Am I being mean about the "supersweet" friend?

"My MIL is exactly like this but it's not manipulative it's just she genuinely thinks she must never express an opinion in case she upsets someone. She doesn't even realise she's doing it. And when it's pointed out she can't understand how deferring to everyone else's needs would be infuriating. It by turns drives me mad and makes me sad that she's never felt empowered to say "no this is what i want to do". She can never state she's enjoyed something until it's all over and done with and she then knows no one was upset and nothing went wrong. This can cover across as her being bored and disengaged with everything." @TinyGingerCat

This reads like my DM as I mentioned earlier who always defers to others, even if the issue is for her to deal with on her own i.e. has a medical condition; she's asked 'would you like to give XYZ a go?' and she'll look at me and say 'what do you think?' (just as an example) She actually wants me (or whomever she defers to) to make that specific decision for her. I often wonder if it's because if that decision was the wrong one, she can piously say 'ah well, never mind, you said I should try it but it didn't help. I knew it wouldn't'. So, in a way, passing the blame to me and to guilt me so, as a result, I no longer help her with these kind of things.

But additionally, the last couple of sentences in your post where you say she can't enjoy anything until it's over. That's something else my DM does at family events. And then when it is over, she'll cry because she's had such a lovely time and that it's all over and done with rather than be happy that she was fortunate enough to attend and see people she loved and relish in the happiness of it all. It's all doom and gloom. I remember her telling me as a child 'don't ever look forward to anything because when it doesn't happen, you won't be disappointed'. So whenever I felt excitement about something, it turned into anxiety because I felt those feelings of excitement were wrong and I shouldn't be feeling them.

She was brought up by parents who were very Victorian in their views (from what she has told me), quite authoritarian and she then subsequently married someone who had a much stronger personality so was subservient to him too and 'did as she was told'. All very sad but infuriating at the same time!

I find people like this are interesting when you INSIST they make a decision for the group (eg restaurant). The genuinely nice ones clearly flounder and are very anxious about it, while the manipulative ones get really arsey and dickish. I usually then make a point of praising whatever choice the genuinely nice people make, so that they might gain some confidence from the experience.

I must admit my own response to a childhood of not being permitted to have needs is to go off on my own a lot. You're not being selfish and diminishing the enjoyment of the group if you're on your own....

I would say something every time.

Such as "Why do you insist on buying my child something he doesn't like? Don't you like him?"

Or

"Why would you give your salad away? I can see you don't like it, I'll get the waiter". And proceed to call the server over and say to the server "Jane doesn't like her meal she's trying to give it away to a toddler can we get her something else from the menu."

I have used these exact examples ad nauseum. These people think nothing of being manipulative and only understand the language of taking the piss.

Ever so 'umble Sir! Sometimes I used to call my late OH Uriah, if I asked what he fancied for lunch he invariably would say I'm easy, and I'd often say Yes, I know you're easy but what would you like for lunch first!
It's really annoying, we have been known to be standing in the check in queue at the airport going on a long road trip and he'd start wondering where we were sleeping that night! Luckily for him, and me, I enjoyed the planning of trips.

This is spot on and it's the exact trouble with people pleasing. It's done to "be nice" but it has the opposite effect and comes across as passive aggressive and inauthentic. As a reformed PP it took me a long time to see this but it absolutely gets people's backs up for this very reason.

Noone is "just fine" with anything - we all have preferences and views and constantly suppressing them ends up in resentment for the person (I can guarantee you that inside she is like a pressure cooker and not "fine" at all) and others picking up on the fact that what she is saying simply isnt genuine- its masking her true feelings which to others "feels" like lying even though its not done intentionally to deceive.

It's difficult to express your authentic self when you are anxious, I totally get that but it's vital to start small and practice doing it. For both your own sake and mental health and so that you can connect genuinely with others in an authentic way. Otherwise, people end up feeling they just dont know the real "you" at all and all they're getting is some kind of bizarre Stepford friend.

Yes, this! I was reading some of what the OP said about the poor woman, and I could recognise myself in some of it. I'm not as extreme, maybe, but I do have a tendency to people please and my self esteem isn't what it should be. And it stems from having a shitty family member I avoided as much as possible when growing up (hard when you live in the same house). I've worked damn hard to try and please myself and change the way I am. I'm now sitting here wondering if people hate me because of the way I react to things sometimes. Poor woman. One thing we could all do with more of is some understanding.

I think you need to ask yourself why you see the behaviour the OP describes as ‘nice and accommodating’. Offering to stay at home from an outing that’s specifically been organised for your benefit isn’t in any way helpful or accommodating (if anything, it’s a bit rude and suggests a lack of enthusiasm), and neither is continually saying ‘Oh, let me buy your child an icecream’ every time you pass a shop, when you’ve been told that the child doesn’t like icecream — it just suggests you’re not listening and an ‘automatic’ mode.

I do think this woman was anxious and trying to please, but if she’d thought about other people a bit rather than herself and her impact, she’d have seen that her behaviour was having the opposite effect.

If, as I suspect, she didn’t in fact want to go on the outing with a lot of strangers (which I can understand, if she was feeling sub par), the thing to do is to be honest about it. The OP isn’t unsympathetic.

Instead, her behaviour has had the opposite effect to her intention (which also suggests she’s not considering other people). She clearly thinks she was a delight to be around and is assuming further invitations in future, whereas the OP is now determined not to because of her behaviour this time.

Well said, @Anothernamechane

Sounds as though she and the OP are fundamentally incompatible. I hope she has other friends.

Performative niceness, we have a couple in DH family like this.
They have to be the hero in every situation but God help you if you challenge their view of themselves, then you see the real person.
People might call you mean OP but I think its just that you see through this person

I know someone like this and it’s utterly draining. So performative and attention seeking but dressed up as kindness. I would advise taking a big step back.

I agree with others about how disconcerting the performance of people pleasing is. Some of the anger you felt will have been because you picked up on the dissonance between what she said and how she acted. It's a subtle performance of superiority.

I'd also wonder if you feeling angry was an unconscious but deliberately manipulated outcome because it allows her to bed down in the position of victim - poor me I'm just trying to be helpful and @endlessnonsense is so mean to me.

I know that seems unsympathetic and I do agree with others that this will come from a place of insecurity / anxiety, but it reinforces an identity for her and as such I think it's a really manipulative thing to do because it's using other people without their consent.

The older I get the less patience I have with this kind of behaviour in other adults. Don't encourage another trip unless she seems to grow some self awareness in the meantime!

She picked up on your
" suppressed anger" & forgot your child doesn't eat ice-cream?
Also children don't eat salad..they do if it's given to them🤔🙄

Trust your instincts. Covert narcs are a nightmare to deal with.

Is she religious or was she raised in a religious household? This type of behaviour can be ingrained - summarised as you are less worthy than others. My experience is with a branch of christianity but i know people from other religious backgrounds who have experienced similar. My MIL is exactly like this but it's not manipulative it's just she genuinely thinks she must never express an opinion in case she upsets someone. She doesn't even realise she's doing it. And when it's pointed out she can't understand how deferring to everyone else's needs would be infuriating. It by turns drives me mad and makes me sad that she's never felt empowered to say "no this is what i want to do". She can never state she's enjoyed something until it's all over and done with and she then knows no one was upset and nothing went wrong. This can cover across as her being bored and disengaged with everything.

The two instances involving children and food would have got my back up the most. Her actions are clearly implying that the parents aren't as concerned and thoughtful as she is.

That would colour everything else for me, even if the other behaviours weren't as irritating as they obviously are.

I think you need to ask yourself why you see nice and accommodating behaviour as a 'performance' and something designed to 'elicit a response'. Some people are just easier going than others?
Eg some people are quite selective eaters so will have a strong preference over the evening meal. Others are happy to eat anything so won't mind - do you lot all think that those people are being 'performatively nice'?!

It’s difficult, because on paper she hasn’t really done anything wrong. But I would also be annoyed by this, “Awwh, let him have an ice cream” and trying to give her food to a child. It’s about showing how helpful and kind she is rather than actually being helpful and kind.

My dad can be like this. A couple of Christmases ago, he bought this (very nice) fizzy cranberry mixer. He thought I’d like it, and I did. But a few days in he’d asked if I wanted a drink and I said I’d have a Baileys. He looked taken aback and said, “Baileys? Don’t you want your nice cranberry drink?” I said I just fancied a Baileys. Then it was “Don’t you like your cranberry drink?” I got annoyed in the end and ended up being blamed for being ungrateful; he’d only tried to get me something I’d like, why was I being stroppy etc.. I just wanted what I wanted!

You sound so vociferous? Some people are just quite laid back and don't mind going with the flow?
Can't believe how nasty some people on this thread are being about people who just happen to be, quite nice! Bet you'd be just as nasty if they were always wanting their own way - i think some people are determined to find fault!!

I think she appreciated being there and was trying too hard not to be a bother.

She was, but anxiety or poor self-esteem is no excuse for not recognising that this kind of behaviour is monumentally irritating to 95% of people because it involves so much work from the person being performed at, and because it’s so obviously designed to elicit a specific type of response.

She sounds like my dad...he just doesn't get it though his thick skull sometimes. He thinks he's being nice and polite when in reality he can be quite rude, he doesn't mean to be but he is and it is hard work.

Your DH isn’t concerned so maybe that’s the clue.

I knew a woman who played sweet in order to undermine the other women in the group. It was a game to her.

I also have a relative also just like this - drives women bonkers but men think she’s lovely!!!

There are men who like women like this - subservient, obsequious types. It’s quite sickening but look at the men who look abroad for wives who are more ‘agreeable.’

Of course she could be genuinely sweet and perhaps over grateful for still being included when she’s divorced from a mutual friend.

Your instinct will guide you.

what ?
people who are still walking around at 11 pm at night because they can’t decide a restaurant between them