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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this is fucking crazy

436 replies

itstheendoftheworldasweknowitnow · 13/08/2024 15:46

We’re en route to a holiday rental in France. I wasn’t sure if the pool was shared or not between other guests so emailed the owner to ask. This is his reply - which I put in to google translate
Could you tell me if sharing the swimming pool with us who occupy the ground floor bothers you and for what reason? Recently we refused the rental because the wife and the two young daughters were veiled; are you english or muslim? We do not want you to make the trip and see yourself refused access to our property for reasons of displaying religious beliefs which are very resented by the neighborhood.

Fuck Fuck Fuck
What the hell do I do?
I am not a Muslim.
I am also not a racist.

OP posts:
Flibflobflibflob · 13/08/2024 17:45

I think disliking artefacts of a religion is fine, being mean to individuals is not. The veiled bit is fair enough if he wouldn’t be able to use his own pool at the same time. The bit about how basically anyone wearing islamic dress is not welcome in the whole neighbourhood is pretty awful.

I would go as you are on the way anyway. Maybe you could talk him around? I dislike the veil intensely, I’ve also met some perfectly nice women who have worn it. These are two separate things.

MarkWithaC · 13/08/2024 17:44

Breezy 'I was just wondering; thanks!' message, enjoy your holiday, leave a candid review on the site and make Booking.com aware of what he said. I don't know if they have the same terms as Airbnb, but if you tell them they can make their decision.

BigWillyLittleTodger · 13/08/2024 17:44

GiddyNavyJoker · 13/08/2024 17:33

It's a difficult one with children involved though, no? We dont know how old the children are. How do you explain to a child and ruin the holiday they've been looking forward to based on an assumption from an email thats been translated from a foreign language? Would you in the same predicament?

Surely though the OP should be leading by example, sorry kids holiday is off because the owner is a racist otherwise you are just teaching children to look the other way, OP either live by your principals or you are a hypocrite, don’t use your children as a convenient excuse.

GiddyNavyJoker · 13/08/2024 17:43

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:36

I wouldn’t pontificate on MN about how horrifying it is.

Quite. But to be fair to the OP they forgot that face coverings were banned in public swimming pools in France.

Anyway, I'd go there, try and forget about it, enjoy the well deserved time away with your kids and never book their again.

PuggyPuggyPuggy · 13/08/2024 17:43

I would find that exchange alarming. Not (just) because of the racism - I've had to grit my teeth about this since arriving in the UK 25 years ago, when I discovered that a lot of people are absolutely delighted with their casual racism because beating the Nazis cancels it out, or something - but because of the sheer unhingedness (if that's a word) of responding to "excuse me, is the swimming pool shared?" with "Are you Muslim? You better not be be Muslim! We don't allow those around here!!" That's proper back-away-slowly-and-avoid-eye-contact-territory Confused

Allie47 · 13/08/2024 17:42

You've paid, you're en route, you're not Muslim and so won't be refused. You don't have to socialise, have anything to do with or like the people you're renting the holiday home from. Stop overthinking, you can't change other people's perspective on life. Go enjoy your holiday 🤷‍♀️

AngelusBell · 13/08/2024 17:41

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:36

I wouldn’t pontificate on MN about how horrifying it is.

I might check it’s not illegal to play “Top 5 most beautiful Adhan in the world” in France and then play them on a Bluetooth speaker as I swim. That should settle the matter.

Ariela · 13/08/2024 17:41

Can you not reply along the lines of:

Apologies, I am not sure if things have been lost on Google translate, but I just wanted to clarify if we were sharing the pool as I am really looking forward to a swim after our travels, but worried I may have forgotten my robe! Hopefully you'll have large towels anyway.

MrsSunshine2b · 13/08/2024 17:41

"I think something must have got lost in translation. English is a nationality. Muslim is a religion. Many people are both. I choose not to share my religious views with others. If this is going to be a problem for you, I am happy for you to refund my money and I will stay elsewhere. We have no issues with sharing the pool."

Tulipsareredvioletsarebue · 13/08/2024 17:41

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:25

You hate racism but only if standing up to it doesn’t come at a price to you?

Di you suggest losing thousands of pounds on a holiday that was prebooked is something you would personally do for the principle just to punish an owner of the air bnb and show your higher moral ground?

Tulipsareredvioletsarebue · 13/08/2024 17:39

Totallymessed · 13/08/2024 17:02

They weren't just limiting themselves though, were they? So it wasn't just their risk to take, if they were really concerned about the experience of their fellow guests, they should have checked in advance to make sure they wouldn't be affecting other people. I guess it's up to you if you're happy being walked over by entitled men though.

But they werent affecting other people. They never expected the other guests to miss out on the pool and left the pool without fuss, dipping in when the ladies were out. They just asked us to tell them (if we felt like it) if there were times that we could give them to use the pool if we so wished- and it was only after we asked them, as they were prepared to just work around everyone else when no one was around.
I really didnt see the issue and still dont. I just dont feel like hating on someone just because of their religious beliefs, but you do you.

Fluffyelephant · 13/08/2024 17:38

Nowstrong · 13/08/2024 17:37

He is not being racist. He is asking if you why you do not want to share the swimming pool with them, who occupy the ground floor. He had to cancel a reservation recently because the wife and daughters who were renting, were veiled and refused to share the pool with anyone else.
He also says that he wouldn't like you to go all that way and feel resentment by neighbours if you are being opening religious. Whatever the religion it is a sensitive subject in some areas in France.

What area are you going to?
I think that you'll be fine. He was just being very cautious. Perhaps once burnt, as they say here, the cat is also afraid of cold water.

"Are you English or Muslim?" isn't racist in your world?!

Nowstrong · 13/08/2024 17:37

He is not being racist. He is asking if you why you do not want to share the swimming pool with them, who occupy the ground floor. He had to cancel a reservation recently because the wife and daughters who were renting, were veiled and refused to share the pool with anyone else.
He also says that he wouldn't like you to go all that way and feel resentment by neighbours if you are being opening religious. Whatever the religion it is a sensitive subject in some areas in France.

What area are you going to?
I think that you'll be fine. He was just being very cautious. Perhaps once burnt, as they say here, the cat is also afraid of cold water.

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:36

GiddyNavyJoker · 13/08/2024 17:33

It's a difficult one with children involved though, no? We dont know how old the children are. How do you explain to a child and ruin the holiday they've been looking forward to based on an assumption from an email thats been translated from a foreign language? Would you in the same predicament?

I wouldn’t pontificate on MN about how horrifying it is.

bignosebignose · 13/08/2024 17:36

I think the world over, and particularly in parochial, rural areas where there is next to no ‘outsiders’ you are going to find racism and xenophobia. It’s borne of a place of ignorance and intolerance.

As a lighthearted aside, for some reason that brought this classic clip to mind:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_krntMHJIas

InSpainTheRain · 13/08/2024 17:35

Perhaps he just got the wrong end of the stick and as PP said maybe is worried re the ceiling ban. I would send short a.reply using short and.clear sentences to clear it up.

AccountCreateUsername · 13/08/2024 17:35

Enjoy your holiday and avoid talking to the racist. Post his text message in a review once you’re gone, you don’t owe him anything!

AngelusBell · 13/08/2024 17:35

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:25

You hate racism but only if standing up to it doesn’t come at a price to you?

As previously stated, I would stand up to it but not en route with my children excited about a holiday.

Ineedaholidayyyy · 13/08/2024 17:35

I would still go, but be sure to leave a negative review once you have left. Use this as a learning experience to do thorough research if you book a private rental again. I'm surprised you didn't check about the pool being shared or private before you booked it.

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:35

Totallymessed · 13/08/2024 17:32

So you'd be happy to stay at his property, speak with him, share his pool and then get him banned from Airbnb? Antiracism comes at a price. Hypocrisy is fine on on Mumsnet though, I guess.

Like enjoying a holiday in South Africa in the 80s and coming home and saying "I've got to say, I did think the pool being whites only was dreadful though, can't believe those terrible people!"

Exactly, it is so disingenuous for the OP to pretend to be horrified about it. Just be honest that it isn’t enough of an issue for you to inconvenience yourselves by cancelling the booking.

Fluffyelephant · 13/08/2024 17:33

PeachyKeane · 13/08/2024 17:22

So you'll stay in his place, thinking he's a racist, then you'll dob him in.

Actually think this is pretty shitty behaviour tbh. Think you should do one or the other.

I agree. And not that it's the most important thing but how are you possibly going to enjoy the holiday?

If the hosts are generally awful / constantly racist you'll feel terrible, be avoiding any communal spaces and it'll cast a dark cloud over your holiday.

If they're super nice to you - because as you say, you're not muslim so they'll be relieved when you arrive and see that you're one of them - then you'll feel terrible the whole week thinking how two faced you are because you have to dob this guy in at the end of the week.

And he will almost certainly know it was you.

If it's the second outcome I can almost guarantee you won't report this but will try and explain it away to yourself as a cultural difference / language issue / not really that racist.

It's an awful situation to be in. Are you sure you can't report this to Booking.com now and look for somewhere else to stay? If you're driving doesn't that give you more options?

GiddyNavyJoker · 13/08/2024 17:33

BargingOnBy · 13/08/2024 17:25

You hate racism but only if standing up to it doesn’t come at a price to you?

It's a difficult one with children involved though, no? We dont know how old the children are. How do you explain to a child and ruin the holiday they've been looking forward to based on an assumption from an email thats been translated from a foreign language? Would you in the same predicament?

AccountCreateUsername · 13/08/2024 17:33

PeachyKeane · 13/08/2024 17:22

So you'll stay in his place, thinking he's a racist, then you'll dob him in.

Actually think this is pretty shitty behaviour tbh. Think you should do one or the other.

I don’t. I think the OP is doing other holidaymakers a huge favour by leaving an honest review, reporting to booking.com and leaving a copy of the text in the review too.

he can be racist if he wants to be. People who find that objectionable should be able to make informed decisions about where to stay on holidays.

I’d avoid booking there!

Totallymessed · 13/08/2024 17:32

AngelusBell · 13/08/2024 17:22

I really hate racism but I wouldn’t disappoint my children by cancelling the holiday en route. I would do all in my power to make sure this property disappears from the listings afterwards. Being racist comes at a price.

So you'd be happy to stay at his property, speak with him, share his pool and then get him banned from Airbnb? Antiracism comes at a price. Hypocrisy is fine on on Mumsnet though, I guess.

Like enjoying a holiday in South Africa in the 80s and coming home and saying "I've got to say, I did think the pool being whites only was dreadful though, can't believe those terrible people!"

ButtSurgery · 13/08/2024 17:32

OnePeachCrow · 13/08/2024 16:40

All conspicuous religious symbols are banned in France. It's not just the burkha Catholic nuns can't wear their habits in public either.

That's completely untrue 😂