UK universities in trouble - why not add VAT to tuition?

If we want the UK to be able to compete globally, let alone in Europe, we need an overhaul of FE/HE funding and the courses offered.

We already have some of the most expensive fees in the World.

We could start at looking where we have skills shortages and adjusting fees accordingly, fees generally, need to come down.

Quite why its deemed acceptable for a AHP to look after the sick and elderly that we desperately need but then charge them fees to do this is bonkers, HCPs in the main, don't go one to earn vast amounts of money.

How different is this to universities where most young people don't attend and it usually the better off.

It's no longer just those that are better off attending university. However, first generation students and those from lower socioeconomic groups are more likely to attend local and lower ranked universities.

Some of the suggestions on this thread would directly impact that group of students and would mean university becomes the preserve of the rich once again.

@wombat15

"It would be cheaper and less complicated to raise tuition fees in the first place."

True - but politically massively unpopular to raise tuition fees, especially with the left.

Whereas VAT in tuition fees can be argued to the left that "look you're happy for VAT on private school fees because only a minority attend and these are usually the well off (although some are on bursaries). How different is this to universities where most young people don't attend and it usually the better off.

Any university under the top 30 is a waste of your money now that fees have increased. If someone can’t get into a top 30, maybe uni isn’t for them.

I guess you don't really care about social mobility or widening participation then?

UK has some of the highest tuition fees in the world (for its own citizens)

Almost all of Europe offers its children, either v cheap fees or non at all, then there is the extortionate interest rates and lower loan repayment thresholds.

Why are our children seen as cash cows, providing the skills our hospitals, schools and business need to run a successful skilled economy.

The percentage of UK students who go to Uni is on par with that of most EU economies.

moving My child from state to private has removed the cost of educating them from the state. And removed my child from the CAMHS waiting list. And freed up the school from the challenge of meeting their ASD needs, and protecting them from bullies, and freed up the school community policy officer from charging their bullies with assault endlessly. This is the difference a well funded, well resourced school can make to a child. Remind me, in which way are the private schools a drain on society?

Please can you show me the data that proves private schools are a drain on the country?
Private schools save the state £4 billion per year, they pay VAT on all purchases but currently can't claim it back and are large employers in local economies.
On no metrics are private schools a drain on the economy/country, or are you just parroting something you've heard?

Also it won't be the schools paying VAT, it will be the parents. Who are already tax payers, many higher rate tax payers so already contributing most than most to the economy.

But many universities will close. Many are in dire financial straits already and Phillipson has already stated that there will be no government support for them.

It matters because of the devastation that would be caused to some more deprived towns if they were to close. Local students use my local university.

We heavily rely on international students.
Buildings created for the university. What would happen to them.

They are not a drain on the rest of the country. They save the taxpayer money which is why this VAT policy is unlikely to generate much income and may end up costing more than it makes due to private school pupils transferring to the state sector.

Tuition fees make up a large part of universities income. Universities are suffering financially as that income has been frozen for many many years as inflation (and wage demands) have surged. Adding VAT obviously won’t help the situation.

Do we think those who will pay the VAT could and should pay more? A more clear cut question when posed of private school parents than students perhaps.

Why would you look to the bottom of the list though? The Times University Ranking’s top 20 has no former polytechnics. Any university under the top 30 is a waste of your money now that fees have increased. If someone can’t get into a top 30, maybe uni isn’t for them.

Why should they free ride on plumbers, HGV drivers and those who don't go to university but have to pay VAT on education?

You say no one would suffer by bat on tuition fees, well what about the students who have to pay it?

https://hgvtrainingprices.org.uk/hgv-training-london/

https://www.ableskills.co.uk/plumbing-courses/

See VAT on fees. Unfair that universities don't have to charge it.

exactly. Private schools are a totally unnecessary luxury which are a drain on the rest of the country.

Private schools need to be paying VAT. Private schools are going to be paying VAT. It should have happened decades ago.

It would be cheaper and less complicated to raise tuition fees in the first place.

@Aligirlbear

"How would adding VAT help the universities ? - The university have to pay it to HMRC , any business / institution collecting VAT has to pay it across to HMRC they don’t keep it for their own use / cashflow"

You are of course correct that the money would go to HMRC.
However if we agree that many universities are struggling financially especially with the reduction in overseas students and Government finances are not available to bail out the universities.

So additional funding has to come from somewhere and raising tuition fees would be hugely unpopular. So how about VAT is introduced on university tuition fees, HMRC get the money then UK Government sends back the money to the universities perhaps with more sent to those courses the Government wishes to encourage

Would closing failing universities risk further disenfranchising certain locations in the UK? Where there aren’t a multiple of university choices?

First sensible question you've asked all thread.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cv22y7zl18po

I think it's pretty clear that the only reason why the OP is suggesting this policy is because she is feeling bitter and petulant about having to pay VAT on private school fees, and she is desperate for everyone else to suffer as a result.

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves what a spiteful comment.

when plumbing or lorry driver training is VATed?

Are they? Are you sure?

And I wish we could blame Brexit, but no, the impact of Brexit on uni finances, while it's had an impact, it has not been the single most damaging issue.

This is just another school vat thread. OP you will be paying vat. Get over it.

The impact of Brexit is the elephant in the room here.

Isnt there a moral argument that universities should pay VAT like many other education providers?

How is the "entire country disadvantaged by private schools"?

PPE, History, Theology, Golf Courses, etc seem to be luxuries compared to driving schools which are VATed. Accountancy Training is VATed, Electrical/Plumbing/Carpentry training at private colleges are VATed, Foreign Language Courses at private centres are VATed.

I don't see why universities should have any special position compared other optional higher education institutions.

Attending university is an option. If someone goes to a private trade school to learn plumbing they have to pay VAT - why should history not be VATed when plumbing or lorry driver training is VATed? This is just a middle class privilege paid for by the working class.

Universities should definitely be paying VAT now. Why should graduates have special privileges and be able to avoid VAT when essential trades like lorry driving have to pay VAT on training?