Michael Jackson

One person was also ‘accurately’ able to describe how he was circumcised. The autopsy said he wasn’t circumcised.

Also was Jimmy Saville ever convicted?

As was OJ Simpson initially.

Or James Brown for that matter

Because he was so ridiculously talented and absolutely iconic.
The biggest pop star for children of the 80s, his music is renowned worldwide.

people don't want to think about it as bit prepared to never listen to a jackpo song ever again, it's grim really. Everyone was more than happy to cancel saville because well he was saville the two didn't compare and saville was the right kind of predator.

One of his little boy victims was able to accurately draw for the investigators the pattern of vitiligo on the underside of MJ's penis. I wonder what the "innocent" reason for that child having such intimate knowledge of an adult's penis and its underside would be?

Because he's innocent. Proven innocent in a court of law.

HTH.

Alarm bells and one way glass to alert him someone was approaching bedroom.

A door hidden at the back of his closet that opened to a secret bedroom.

The police found in the hidden room peterpan pillow cases stuffed with 'creepy' dolls.

Also in the hidden room, nude pictures adorned the walls, to desensitise the children who slept there.

Jackson admitted taking boys in there for long periods of time.

A game room and arcade with a bed that he would sleep in with the boys.

A cinema with a hidden room that had one way glass, he was almost caught here by a victims mother.

A pool where a security guard said in court that he caught Jackson preforming oral sex on Jordon Chandler.

In a 2003 raid police found photos of nude children in a triple locked closet.

Drugs used for sex addiction and another secret room hid by a jukebox.

On one of the other MJ threads a while ago there was a list, I didn't save it and it was a very hard read to be honest. I'm sure if you google it you'll find it though.

No one who believes it's possible to defame the dead, either through libel or slander, is in any position to 'correct' anyone.

Same goes for anonymous user handles on the internet.

@SerafinasGoose Well said, I completely agree with you.

He could have slept with adults, not little kids, if he wanted to feel safe. Plenty of kids out there have diffucult lives, become carers at young age and don't use that as an excuse to sleep with children.

But indeed, who cares?

Sleeping with other people's children is a boundary between an adult male and a prepubescent boy which should never, ever be crossed. This constitutes at the very best a serious safeguarding failure. The worst is a place we don't need to go to here, but certainly the images and documentation found at his home points to that conclusion.

I grieve for all the boys who, like so many other victims of sexual abuse, go unheard and unbelieved.

Fuck Jackson. I'm not sorry in the slightest that he's dead. He'll never harm or endanger another child again and that, at least, is a blessing.

He's a grave danger to children on this basis alone.

On the basis of material found posthumously at his Neverland Ranch, if it walks, quacks and swims like a duck, it's a duck.

Why do you think that though?
I can't come up with one reason that a full grown man would continuously want to share a bed or bedroom with little boys...
And it was always boys, never little girls so to me it seems he had a type.
I really don't understand why people make excuses for him, he waved it under everyone's nose... I LIKE SHARING MY BED WITH CHILDREN!! They were his words!
The excuse his fans like to make about his lack of childhood is absurd, I'd bet money that if you questioned 99% of pedophiles and rapists they will have a sad childhood story to tell.
Historical sexual abuse allegations rarely comes with evidence, doesn't mean Micheal Jackson is innocent, the evidence for me is that boy after boy have consistent accounts of what happened. Add that to the fact that Micheal Jackson's admitted sleeping with them, while at the same time lying about surgeries and dangling babies he'd paid for out of windows paints a picture of a man who is out for himself, with no regard for the pain he was causing these little boys.

Absolutely 👏

Nothing was ever proven and at least one of the accusers admitted he lied

I think it's very difficult to get to the bottom of the truth when there's such an imbalance of power and wealth. Did they lie or did he make it worth their while to say that? Celebrities have paid off accusers for decades and turned to super injunctions to cover up their less appealing acts.

Having read the evidence, I think he's guilty and being found not guilty clearly doesn't mean he's innocent either. Celebs can afford the best lawyers and in his case, being an iconic pop star worked in his favour (albeit I'm sure plenty on the prosecuting side were keen to chalk up a win).

Hell would freeze over before I'd let my sons sleep in an adult's bed in those circumstances. It's grim whatever way you look at it. And yes, I have stopped listening to MJ songs as it feels wrong to celebrate his work with the question mark of child sexual abuse hanging over him.

OJ Simpson was also found not guilty in court... Just saying.

Ah, mumsnet. Where the overwhelming consensus is that children can be traumatized by things like moving house once, being served food they don't like, having siblings and not getting fresh school uniforms every September. And yet there's pages of debate on whether or not a grown man who made families financially dependent on him and then slept with their children in his bed did anything harmful.

For what it's worth, I don't think the two men in the documentary were looking for him to be cancelled.

Both stated that he had good qualities and showed them kindness, in spite of the abuse.

I think really what they wanted was what most victims of abuse want; to be seen, acknowledged and most of all believed.

There are lots of abusers in Hollywood however I've never been convinced that Michael Jackson was one of them for the reasons PPs have cited.

What I do believe is that MJ became a convenient scapegoat to take the attention off high-profile individuals who WERE up to no good, who have never - and will never - be held to account.

Almost like: 'Don't look over there, look over here!'

I mean, just who IS on Epstein's List!?

I don't understand this either. I realise it hasn't been 'proven', but the notion that those men were lying in the documentary to make money or get attention or whatever is ridiculous to me.

One of them is a massively successful high profile choreographer for a start - surely by coming and speaking out against somebody considered such a legend in the music industry he would be if anything only risking irreparable damage to his reputation and livelihood.

Both men have risked and likely brought to fruition the life sentence of people calling them liars at best and sending them constant abuse and death threats at worst upon both themselves and likely their families. And they would have known this beforehand.

I also think if they were lying, why not do this when he was alive and they could cash in on it? Probably because in a twisted way they loved the parts of him which weren't abusive and couldn't betray him and put him through that while he was around.

You only need to watch that ridiculous interview where Michael is saying that if he is guilty of anything it is of loving children all over the world. It is so overblown and such an obvious attempt to paint himself basically as a saint that it should have rang major alarm bells at the time and certainly should now. Normal people who have nothing to hide simply don't speak about themselves that way.

I get that 'cancelling' him without a conviction might feel unfair to some people. Although anybody familiar with the law will tell you that trials are not really about finding the truth but about painting a feasible enough picture to convince a jury. However, actively celebrating him as though this doesn't exist is absolutely unfathomable to me. Isn't it better that we don't risk completely letting a child abuser off the hook? What kind of message does that send to other victims of rich and/or powerful abusers?