Daily mail article, integration has failed in Germany. Aibu to agree with article?

Who? The arrested man called Mark?

Looking at Wikipedia, it does look like the child in question has Romanian citizenship. Not clear if the child and the people involved in rioting were immigrants or simply dual nationals. The social media on this certainly didn't play out as this being a group of Romanians rioting!

But I am interested in whether that's why the OP raised it. Seems a tenuous link to be honest - systematic discrimination against the Roma community is a centuries old issue in the UK and Europe and not one particularly linked to immigration that I'm aware of.

I never said he had or hadn't.

Plenty of Irish born people are also in homeless accommodation ,no doubt.

What have they not integrated into?

Strange question. The Leeds riots are probably more pertinent to the topic than the Southport riots, because they relate to a group of migrants who are not well integrated.

Ah, you think the OP raised because the rioters were Romanian immigrants?

Can you confirm that OP?

Ireland has low overall crime rates. SIX countries could even be arsed to hand over their data. Read the article you posted. Shame on all the otehr countries, too.

It's alarming - but I'm not sure what you think it is pointing to?

More generally:

I do think it is important to have discussions on whether rising levels of immigration are leading to rising levels of crime / anti social behaviour. I have no problems having that discussion - there are issues with integration (although this is nothing new - I remember this being a major topic 20 years ago), language acquisition (which can lead to vulnerable groups becoming more isolated) and for the refugee population in particular there simply isn't enough support for the extreme mental health issues a lot of refugees face as a result of the experiences that led to their refugee status. There does also seem to be a growth of extremism in general. I think it's worse from the far right that the far left, but that might be my own personal bias. Is it worth saying that I would consider both fundamental Islamists and the EDF to be far right.

Where I think I fundamentally differ from the OP and others accusing 'lefties' of trying to shut dirn the conversation is that I'm not clear that it's actually immigration causing this rise in extremism as opposed to immigration being a convenient excuse for the nationalist far right to use to support their views or drum up more membership. I think it's deprivation and the fact that if you come from a deprived community where there doesn't seem to be any way our, or any hope of your situation improving, an extremist group giving you something to believe in and something to blame is very easy to cling to.

Now there's an argument that some of this deprivation comes because immigration means our resources are being spread too thin. I can't comment on Germany, but for the UK there are far bigger factors in play. Immigration, particularly non-EU immigration has spiked post COVID but the majority of this non-EU spike is people on work visas, or study visas (and their dependants). A work visa means immigration has reviewed the case and believes that this is someone we want here. A study visa means they're paying tuition fees etc (and if university a massive amount) and again the immigration has decided they want that person here. If we don't have the infrastructure in place to support immigration that the UK government is choosing to actively support (and gets tax revenue from) then that's a UK government policy issue ultimately. It's not an 'immigrant' problem or an integration problem.

There are also people who believe Romani are Romanians and the Romanians in the UK are also often a target of hate or prejudice.

There is a swathe of people on SM who want the riots in Leeds to be Muslim rioters. Despite evidence that they came from a range of backgrounds, this is being perpetuated. It suits a narrative that they believe it was under policed.

Roma and Romany are different by the way, as I understand.

I assume because it was the Roma community and support groups have called on the government to address the barriers and disadvantages Roma people experience during child protection cases.

You couldn’t be more wrong. My parents were refugees and came here from Latvia and Ukraine when I was a young child. Latvia has Russians as almost 25% of their population. They don’t want to speak the language, they don’t want to integrate, they want to be Russian but living in Latvia because the quality of life is better and they get an EU passport. It’s not only people of colour who are an issue with integration.

England is not allowed a national identity because people are embarrassed by years of colonisation all over the world, they are trying to redeem themselves by insisting that the immigration in this country is normal with huge swathes of the population not integrating into society. But in the case of Latvia and Ukraine they don’t want to be anything but to be their own country. They want their identity back, their culture celebrated and language to be used. The UK is so brainwashed by its past that people can’t see past ‘racism’ for everything. I don’t condone racism but if people want to immigrate they need to integrate into that society, towns that become enclaves and ghettos are what drives racism. The UK has so many different people and races within it that you can meet people from anywhere in the world which is fantastic, but they need to intergrate and so many do not. It is becoming an issue across the EU and people are not happy about it. Another point would be Brits living in Spain in their little English enclaves - again the Spanish aren’t happy about it even though they’re white. It’s not the colour that is the issue- integration and not fitting into that countries’ identity.

As a child I remember when I first went to school and going to the shops with my mother - seeing and meeting Indian and Pakistani people and black people for the first time - like a time warp, a Soviet child never seeing people like this in their life. The cultural shock for me moving here was incredible. These days I have friends and colleagues who are black and Asian but as I child I would have never imagined this, it was not a cultural norm for me.

@Mimififi Why did you mention the Leeds riots? I am trying my best not to jump to an assumption as to why you thought they were relevant to the thread, so it would help if you could explain.

Imagine thinking that every single DM article is fake 🤷‍♀️
Compare the DM to SM and the DM looks like the Telegraph.
Stop putting down DM readers. It’s not necessary and is another example of causing division.

You can report me if you like but don't go around demanding apologies.

You missed out the bit where you said he hadn't integrated. That's kind of crucial.

You also raised it in the first place.

Just for accuracy your exact words were:

The Algerian man who stabbed the children & carers had been in Ireland 20 years & does this. I don't think he integrated too well somehow.

I promise you it’s not the big government censorship operation you appear to think it is.

Do find me the sentence where I say that.

Absolutely wild to see people mentally blow a fuse when they're given hard evidence that contradicts their narrative. Mind blowing. If someone can explain the difference between wilfully ignoring data and cult thinking, I'm all ears.

Mainly from the op!!

You really need to read reports properly and stop misquoting them.

@Mimififi you have done well here holding your own! This thread is wild with accusations of all sorts.

It's important to discuss these things!