Is this anxiety in DD? Advice on how to help

Hi OP , I hope you don’t mind me saying that I think this sounds like quite a stressful situation for a young teen to be in. She’s trying to navigate her dad not communicating with her mum properly and holding responsibility for that - and also she is really reliant on him in terms of timings etc. I wonder if she’s feeling out of control and so that she’s trying to get a sense of control where she can. And then maybe when her attempts to be in control fail, it taps into her general feeling and it feels like everything is falling down around her.
For sure, there may be other things to consider. If she is autistic, then this arrangement is likely to be really anxiety provoking too. I’m not sure of how much control you have in terms of this situation. Do you think her dad would communicate with you if he realised she was struggling as a result of the situation?

The thing is - there are OCD thoughts and there are OCD behaviours. When someone is having very severe intrusive thoughts that is really tricky - that is when they are distressing. I have gone through periods of having intrusive thoughts and I have found the only way to stop them was to accept that if you stopped the rituals your very worst fear might come true.

I think you might find it helpful to understand what your son thinks will happen if he doesn't perform his rituals. Literally say to him, if you don't do X - what do you think will happen? You might even find its his subconscious thought driving him and it might even help him to express this thought into words so he can challenge himself the validity of his internal rules.

When I was a child of around 5 or 6, if I heard an ambulance, I would have to say three hail marys and three our fathers...and if I didn't - in my head the consequence was the person in the ambulance would die...it drove me insane. . Eventually I did say to myself - they are going to have to die because I can't do this anymore....

I still have contamination but it used to be really bad - like I thought eating an icecube from the freezer that had been uncovered would kill me. For some reason when I was a child, someone once said to me the ice in freezers was poisonous....so in my first therapy session my 'homework' was to eat an uncovered icecube from the freezer and see how I felt!

I think as well - people with OCD who are messy often have ADHD or more significantly inattentive ADHD. Inattentive ADHD is a terrible word for this as it implies we are not paying attention....what we are really doing is thinking of a million things at once so we tend to over think things and this drives our anxiety and drives OCD. OCD is really just a coping mechanism for anxiety - the winning formula is to work out how to get the person to use a better copy mechanism.

The autism is neurodiversity - the OCD is mental health response to coping with that neurodiversity.

I actually think CAMHS are more dangerous than helpful.

Ive ended up paying due to their crapness

@Breakfastatlunchtime that article was really interesting, thanks for sharing.

Thank you for the recommendation, I'll definitely look for that.

I also agree with your other comment about coping mechanisms being so important and the need to develop strategies to deal with the thoughts.

However, I don't recognise the sort of OCD one can enjoy? Is that still defined as OCD? The D stands for disorder after all, and if it's not causing distress...?

Anyway, our famiy's experience of it is more akin to that described in this link.

https://www.turningpointpsychology.ca/blog/do-i-have-ocd-sorting-out-through-ocd-confusion

My son does have other (different) routines he enjoys but we consider those part of his autism. In a way it can be hard to tease apart, but I think the 'black and white' thinking that sometimes comes with autism made it more likely that he succumbed to the intrusive thoughts of OCD. I suppose we think of them as two sides of a coin really. But the OCD thoughts are intrusive and unwanted.

I don’t have an answer for you but we had family therapy as part of helping my daughter with ocd - and apparently it’s very common for that child to develop an intense relationship with a parent (usually mother) who gets drawn into their ocd world.
I think one of the most important steps is to help your daughter learn coping mechanisms to deal with stress and discomfort. People think deny the behaviour…but the behaviour started as an unhealthy response to stress and fear - and healthy behaviours need to be adopted in their place. Your modelling on how you deal with stress and fear is vital too.

Yes unfortunately I do agree with that - I went to an ocd parenting course where we were taught unfortunately parents who think they are helping a child with their ocd by facilitating rituals usually end up with a child with severe ocd which is what happened in our family - but how you deal with a distressed child and refuse help they ask for is something very difficult. Especially in young children.

I have OCD as do my children - and this is not my experience. What I have learned from having children with ocd is that all ocd is very different. My daughter and I admit to enjoying some of our compulsive obsessiveness. But I get some people can find it distressing and I am sorry for your son. My son reduced his ocd at the age of eight himself after reading gold fish boy - maybe that book would help your son.

If the OP's DD actually has OCD and that'a very big if at this stage.

Some accommodations are important in autism.

Most parents of children with OCD do provide accommodations (eg cleaning things, repeatedly reassuring) at least some of the time. An increased amount of accommodation is associated with OCD symptom severity...how much of this is casual and how much is correlation is much harder to determine.

Treating OCD involves the individual trying to resist the impulse to perform the compulsion and family are certainly encouraged to help this process by not getting involved in the compulsions themselves...or trying to limit involvement as much as they can without causing severe distress.

But OP really needs to know what she's dealing with first...

?

Parental accommodation does increase OCD. This isn't pandering, it's natural to want to decrease distress. But it does make it worse in the long term.

Secondary transition is when girls tend to fall apart.

My son's autism was picked up when he started primary school, there were a lot more social interactions at primary which highlighted his issues. However, transition times especially the primary to secondary transition are naturally scary and anxious young people can seek to impose some form of control over other areas of their life as a form of reassurance. The behaviours are an indication of underlying anxiety.
You are doing everything right in seeking a GP referral, you may also be able to receive Disability Living Allowance for her, this could be worth looking into if she is requiring more care from yourself (I get DLA and Carer's Allowance).

It is a compliment really.
She trusts you to love her unconditionally.

Contrary to what another poster has said, In my experience you can in some cases manage/help OCD without professional intervention.

If it is OCD, and it sounds as though it could be, I can't recommend this book enough.

It proved extremely helpful with my children, so reassuring and educated them on what was going on with them.

No, it just shows she can relax and be herself with you OP. Probably masks with others so behaves better on the outside while stressing inside.
You are her safe place.

You’re her safe person. Thats why.

I remember Dd saying the only person she didn’t have to mask with was me. Like it was a compliment😭

From what OP has said so far I think autism too.
Whether there is OCD there too I don't know. Everything OP has described so far could simply be autism, but she needs to be assessed. As I said the reasons behind her behaviour will be important in ascertaining what's going on.

I'm sorry OP, I know this is all a shock and obviously we can't be sure at all - these are simply suggestions, a starting point when you're looking for help for her. The behaviours are familiar to those with experience of autism though.

She does need help and support now. And so do you.

It sounds like autism to me and anxiety is usually a big feature in girls and they often are mistakenly diagnosed with OCD.

Also, I would reiterate that it's so important to work with experienced people who take the time to get to know your DD well.

It took CAMHS about 6 or 7 years to acknowledge my DC had OCD as well as autism. A lot of damage was done in that time.They put all repetitive behaviours down to his autism and refused to look further, even though it is well known that autistics have a higher incidence of OCD and MH issues in general.

It does sound like OCD - I have two somewhat anxious DCs, one more than the other, and while the general seeking reassurance is part of anxiety, the repetition and exactness is not really.

Routine and repetition and stimming can be a big part of autism though? They help calm anxiety.

The routines in OCD are based in fear. It's different. I have seen my DC with OCD crying while performing rituals because he really doesn't want to have to do them. He has to, for fear of adverse consequences. He will be quite terrified if he can't carry them out.

On the other hand, his autistic routines provide comfort, they help him feel more secure. He can still get very upset and overwhelmed if he's prevented from doing them though. So there can be distress there but it's for a different reason. He wants those routines, they help.

The reasons behind the behaviours are key.