Conversations around race with your partner

@ATenShun Well I think that's what her husband's argument is. That it carries the same offence level. To me, commenting on race is a whole new level and much worse. Not to say my example insult isn't incredibly painful. If one is bad, the other is worse.

In addition, he's used a racial slur and not simply a comment on this persons race which may or not be the same race as OP.

I've no authority here so happily told I'm incorrect and learn from it.

Sounds like he and your husband think it's akin to saying "you fat cunt" or "you homeless tramp".

But surely those two examples you give are every bit as offensive to some people as what transpired in the OP's initial post.

"Sounds like he and your husband think it's akin to saying "you fat cunt" or "you homeless tramp"."

To clarify, I don't mean using racial slurs is an insult like fat or homeless. I mean that if you want to hurt someone overWeight you call them fat and if they look poor/unkempt etc you'd say homeless. I don't get into altercations with strangers and want to hurt them so Im not good at the responses and can't find a good way to explain.

Either way it's wrong and your husband is racist from your updates. I'd say his relative is too.

An ex’s friend made a racial slur (I had suspected he was racist before) and I said to him you could be talking about my family. I got the usual your famiky are not like that they are different 🙄 heard it so many times it’s tiresome

my boyfriend said nothing that after had a go at me for making a fuss over nothing as no one was hurt

a week of two later I finished it with him for others reasons too but was certainly one of them

of course he understands it’s offensive he just doesn’t care that much that it is

There's loads of white people who are racist and in relationships with non-white people.

I had a mixed race friend (white mum, dad Black, similar colour to Stormzy) who was white-passing. Her sibling was not white-passing. The Dad left early doors and lived abroad, leaving the mum to bring up the DC in a very white part of the country. The mum HATED Black people, and conditioned her DC to do the same. Particular vitriol was saved for Black women, as apparently the dad had left her for one. This made for two very confused DC growing up, united in disliking Black people, despite one looking so to the outside world.

My friend's experience was far from unique as I come across the result of this kind of upbringing all the time.

I started a post saying almost exactly this but I wasn't sure how to word it without causing offence. Now I've read all your comments and see that he's used the excuse, I'm going to try my best, please know I mean no offence.

If I was to ever get into an altercation with a complete stranger who started it, I would want to say the most hurtful thing I could to them. This could be based on appearance or clothing or similar. However, I know that race shouldn't be one of the things that I say and just simply shouldn't be mentioned.

His relative either doesn't realise this or doesn't care. I don't think it means he automatically holds racist beliefs, more that it means he doesn't understand the issue of race. Probably thinks it's a small side issue rather than something that affects every waking moment of POC. Sounds like he and your husband think it's akin to saying "you fat cunt" or "you homeless tramp".

It's so important to get this nailed down before you have children, he needs to understand how they will be affected by his views and the world you'll all live in. Ask him how he would feel if this relative said it to one of your kids?!

I do think white people live in a bubble of unawareness around racism. They either think it doesn't exist or that they could never be racist but the truth is white British culture is deeply ingrained with racism and othering - as are many others.

I'm really sorry you're going through this and I hope you can get the support you need.

Sorry OP, but how much more are you willing to tolerate, before your self esteem is totally eroded, and you are made ill with the stress of it all? He really has not got your back at all regarding this, and will likely never understand the impact that the colour of your skin will have on your life. I have never said it before on here, and see it said far too quickly sometimes, but you really should not stay within this union. It is not serving you well.

I had a Polish boyfriend years ago. We'd been together for 3 years and the relationship was serious enough that I'd visited his family in Poland and was gearing up for him to formally meet my parents in London, and visit my grandparents who still lived in our ancestral country.

Polish BF expressed extreme reluctance to travel to our ancestral country on the basis that he was worried about being attacked by lions and tigers in the street, or by one of the savage locals Not by me of course, I wasn't one of "them".

Some people on this thread will understand, others will think I am mad, but from that point I saw him differently because he'd revealed himself to see me differently through what had seemed like a tiny issue. I didn't try and convince him to go, I just continued to spend Christmas with my family overseas and he went to Poland for the holidays instead of coming with me.

On our return in the new year, I faded the relationship out to its eventual end, as that incident showed me how entrenched some views could be. Overlooking the first thing would likely lead to other offences in future that I wasn't prepared to deal with in my personal life; I get enough of that every time I walk out of my front door.

I guarantee this is far from the first time your DH has revealed himself, this won't be the first time. It'll just be the latest in a long line of cuts related to race. Ask yourself how many more insults you are willing to tolerate for the sake of "love", and think about exactly what that love is doing for you, and your life.

@ireallyneedsuppport

Sounds about right. The next level is turning it all on you and accusing YOU of racism. Your situation is not at the peak yet. It's really confusing feeling loved and cared for by someone in many ways but also having to deal with this. When you try to think through it right now, you will say to yourself, he just doesn't understand. Needs education. Not everything is bad and all relationships are imperfect. But slowly it will be death by a thousand tiny cuts and you will need a long time to heal from it. Sending you hugs.

He isn’t going to change so you need to leave him.

I think this may be the root of it. I'm white and didn't understand micro aggressions or most of anything to do with racism really. I thought you just don't use offensive terms and don't discriminate in hiring people etc. I e learnt so so much reading posts from places like Mumsnet. I e noticed since I started to understand more that a lot of people I know who claim not to be racist maybe are guilty of these micro aggressions but they don't think they are racist. They think they deserve acknowledgment for not being racist because they have a black friend or whatever they say. Like it's social points scored for being inclusive. But why would you get social points for having diverse friends? It's because deep down they do think they are better and they are being kind/charitable/a good person by accepting the non white person into a role they would usually have a while person in.

That's my take on it anyway. But as I said I white and I know I don't fully understand

You need to leave this man before you suffer anymore. Please take care of yourself and see a therapist preferably one who specialises in racial trauma.

I am mixed race, my mum is white and dad is south Asian.

My mum doesn't tolerate racism and cut people out completely when they show that side. My mums side of the family, most are racist and we've heard it all. My mum doesn't put up with it and has cut her siblings off when she got called a 'p*ki lover' and they said things about her children being mixed - like calling my older siblings Sanjay and Geta from Eastenders.

People like this are disgusting and have no morales, your husband is showing you what sort of person he is when he makes excuses for those sort of people. He says 'oh they're really lovely' which is essence means they are nice to their own and if you are a person of colour you'll get narrow minded slurs shouted at you in an argument. There's no excuse! Maybe he would feel different if you had children, and those racial slurs were shouted at his kids.

I personally would never marry a white man, for this particular reason. I dated them when I was younger and was just put off by the reaction when they found out I was half Asian - little remarks about curry and spicy food. Also, how my own 'family' behaved towards us has put me off. I would never want to marry into a family that find this behaviour acceptable and go so far as to encourage it - you really should consider leaving him as it won't get better.

I thank god that the amazing strong black women who raised me showed me how to spot the racists fast and how to deal with and to avoid them.

Well put. I totally agree.

Utterly unforgivable , and unfortunately your updates just paint your husband in even worse a light.

I couldn’t accept this in a life partner even as a white person - there is just no place for racism or racist apologists.

I would think long and hard before having children with this man, OP.

This is so true. And then when you try and stand up for yourself or explain certain racist situations to them, they get annoyed and treat you as if you are the problem or are being too sensitive.

OP I haven't RTFT but do you know there's a black mumsnetter's board, where you are less likely to get minimising responses and posters may have more informed advice for you
my small contribution is it sounds unlikely he will change and for your own health and sanity you should get out, and above all do not have children with him

There are many racist men who fetishise back women. They think we’re exotic, sexualise us and think of us almost like toys.

They think we’re inferior and need to be ‘taught’ how to behave properly.

I’d put money on him acting like you don’t how things ‘should be done’ - always explaining the right way, what’s normal, you don’t understand because of your upbringing.

Stay or go, be under no illusions - you are married to a racist.

Apologies - I was being sarcastic and it came out wrong. I don't think there is anti-racist counselling though...racism is not an illness it's a belief.

Sorry I know realising this about your partner must be really upsetting. But he's not going to change. Please don't have children with him.

@ireallyneedsuppport
I do believe be does loving things for you and you do nice things together. This is always the case. You are his favourite black woman. In his head he can't be racist because of this.
What happens to you over time when you stay is really horrible though....you will shrink your blackness more and more to avoid arguments. You will not be able to share important things that relate to your race with him. With time, the time you enjoy spending together now will be poisoned. All you will have left will be the resentment of him never standing up for you. And if you have kids it will be painful to see how much they want to get rid of their blackness because in their end it doesn't just affect you.

Think long and hard about the future you want...

Do you need practical support to leave your husband? No good will
come from you staying in this situation.