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I would swap with her in an instant

560 replies

Cookiecrumblane · 28/07/2024 01:21

I am a sort of clever woman, financially secure, good at what I do. I have lots of friends and family around me, despite being single.
Today I met a woman through a friend, ten years younger than me. She was upset at losing her job last month, she had tried but made a serious of errors and was eventually sacked.
Even as she cried, she looked beautiful. She told me about her various problems, not being able to pay rent, her debt, her self esteem.
And I thought how much I would love to be that pretty. She was distraught, but even with all that was going on, she was served first and efficiently in the bar. Men held doors and beamed at her. They crossed the street to walk closer to her.
I have never had that. And so what good is education, my job, my success. Because ultimately she'll end up ok. She is more likely to get a job and when she does people will praise what she does much more than they praise people who look like me.
Is that mad? That I would swap with her in an instant, even to be jobless and at risk of losing my flat, just to feel visible?
I'm sure men don't feel this way.

OP posts:
IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos · 28/07/2024 09:13

LadyGrinningSoul8517 · 28/07/2024 08:59

To be fair to you, I have often thought this.
I went to a birthday party with my son once and it was at the most beautiful house right on the beach front, easily in the millions.

The birthday girl's mum was beautiful, slim and perfect.
She didn't work, the dad had a very high paying job though.
I remember being sat there thinking "Wow, being attractive really can give you a whole different life, can't it? Definitely makes it easier to pull the rich bloke with the big house".

So yes, I do think very beautiful people just don't realise how many advantages they have, and I totally understand why you feel you would want to be in their shoes.

That isn't the life everyone wants though. I can't bear the idea of having nothing to do. I'd work anyway, because I like the independence of earning for myself.

If I were that woman, I'd be bored out of my mind staying home all day. And my brain is dangerous (to me) if I'm bored. I'd find myself wondering whether I was enough for myself, my husband, my kids. Whether I was setting the right example. Whether, if he left me, I'd be able to cope having been out of the workforce for so long. What might happen if my looks faded.

FairyLightBan · 28/07/2024 09:13

Cookiecrumblane · 28/07/2024 01:21

I am a sort of clever woman, financially secure, good at what I do. I have lots of friends and family around me, despite being single.
Today I met a woman through a friend, ten years younger than me. She was upset at losing her job last month, she had tried but made a serious of errors and was eventually sacked.
Even as she cried, she looked beautiful. She told me about her various problems, not being able to pay rent, her debt, her self esteem.
And I thought how much I would love to be that pretty. She was distraught, but even with all that was going on, she was served first and efficiently in the bar. Men held doors and beamed at her. They crossed the street to walk closer to her.
I have never had that. And so what good is education, my job, my success. Because ultimately she'll end up ok. She is more likely to get a job and when she does people will praise what she does much more than they praise people who look like me.
Is that mad? That I would swap with her in an instant, even to be jobless and at risk of losing my flat, just to feel visible?
I'm sure men don't feel this way.

Jesus get a grip woman!

user906532 · 28/07/2024 09:11

I do believe there is pretty privilege, but the "walking across the street to be closer to her" is where the creative writing went a little too far here I think.

Theothername · 28/07/2024 09:10

It’s quite dated now but Naomi Wolf’s The Beauty Myth is well worth a read @Cookiecrumblane I read it in my late teens so it was one of my formative texts. I highly recommend it because it unpacks so much of what you’ve expressed. I think you’d get a lot from it.

Yalta · 28/07/2024 09:10

Newnamehiwhodis · 28/07/2024 02:52

You’re not wrong- there’s something known as “pretty privilege,” but it comes at a high cost. Those men served her because they wanted her. The second they made a move and she turned them down, you’d be shocked at how quickly that politeness can turn into something uglier than you can imagine.

I say this from experience.

what you’re imagining her life is like - I can guarantee you, it isn’t.

when someone is seen as pretty, they’re also seen as a thing. A commodity to possess, to buy and sell. And it comes with owing - owing everyone who wants. Either owing explanations, owing a horrible people-pleasing dance to try to get out of a situation without being harmed, owing your time, energy and attention just to try to stay safe.

her life isn’t good. She is crying for a reason. Please don’t wish that hell on yourself.

Those men served you

If they then asked a customer out I think management might frown on that interaction

Unless the turn down was done in an extremely rude way I can’t see why a 30 second interaction would result in the type of response you are describing

Why would you feel the need for a people pleasing dance. Be polite but have boundaries

I think what you are missing is that those of us who are not blessed with good looks have a hard time trying to find someone to serve us in the first place and get the anger without any of the pleasantries.

My shopping experience ranges from not being served at all to being treated like a criminal and followed closely around the store until I find it uncomfortable and have to leave

So you getting served because you are deemed pretty just proves the point

Funkyslippers · 28/07/2024 09:08

I have never seen a man cross the road just to be near a woman. I think you're imagining it. I've had many gorgeous friends and that has never happened

echt · 28/07/2024 09:07

This thread, and I mean what the OP has posted, is literally unbelievable.

Shennie100 · 28/07/2024 09:05

PurpleBugz · 28/07/2024 01:42

When I was younger and prettier I got lots of unwanted attention from men. Had my bum pinched more times than I can count. I've also consistently experienced people assuming I wasn't very intelligent. I also wasn't aware I had reasonable looks I only see that now I look back- most women will be unhappy with parts of their appearance. Yes people do open doors for you and serve you quicker but it's not an even pay off in my opinion. Now I'm older and less attractive I prefer how people treat me generally

I totally agree... I get treated with a lot more respect now I am older. I am also more able to deal with it.
I do understand the envy from OP, but the grass isn't always greener...
She probably feels the same about you and everything you have achieved.

Theseventhmagpie · 28/07/2024 09:04

I’m going to come at this from a different angle OP and will no doubt be flamed but I really don’t care.
As far as I’m concerned we only live once and it’s easier to change what you look like than how society treats women. If you’re intelligent and successful why not change what really upsets you about your appearance? Go on the slimming injections, buy the great boobs and get that new nose! You’ll still be intelligent and employable but with more confidence in what you look like. You may well find that good looks aren’t the be all and end all but what the hell- life’s an adventure and a rollercoaster ride!

AccountCreateUsername · 28/07/2024 09:04

iseegulls · 28/07/2024 03:11

This has got to be written by man, surely?

"Men cross the road to be near her" is not something any woman would wish for!

OP, if you are actually a woman, give your head a wobble.

When I was younger I was slim and attractive (although I couldn't see it at the time). I probably did get served quicker in bars and experienced positive bias.

However my memory isn't of an easy life, but of constant hassle from men, including many sexual assaults. Men crossing the road to be near you is a scary experience IME, definitely not a nice one.

Now I'm much older and larger, I am invisible to those kinds of men. It's glorious. I can walk through the world without them noticing me or hassling me, and thank fuck for that.

I still manage to be employed, however.

Edited

Such an odd OP isn’t it?
I also think OP is a man.

Missmarymack2 · 28/07/2024 09:04

Mintypig · 28/07/2024 08:44

Are you sure people were not just crossing the street anyway? I have never seen anyone cross the street to walk near a beautiful woman. I think you may have over egged this in your head.

Agree I’ve never seen men cross the street to be near a woman. I’ve seen men stare at women from across a street but that is about as far as it goes. Thankfully.

Missmarymack2 · 28/07/2024 09:02

bananacreampie · 28/07/2024 07:36

Is that mad? That I would swap with her in an instant, even to be jobless and at risk of losing my flat, just to feel visible?

Bonkers. Plus the visibility stops abruptly anyway, at a certain point.

That poor woman, in her darkest hour she turned to you for comfort and you sat there envying her.

People are allowed have private thoughts and there is nothing wrong with that. The op has not stated that she told this woman she envied her or that she didn’t offer her any comfort ? I’m not suggesting the OP should envy this woman though, I agree that is bonkers .

Mongrelsrbeautiful · 28/07/2024 09:01

Mintypig · 28/07/2024 08:44

Are you sure people were not just crossing the street anyway? I have never seen anyone cross the street to walk near a beautiful woman. I think you may have over egged this in your head.

Surely you have? Men run after women in the street all the time, and try to speak to them. At least when I was younger (80s and 90s) they did. I didn't see it as a positive thing though.

TammyJones · 28/07/2024 09:01

Sugargliderwombat · 28/07/2024 08:45

People always say the grass isn't greener etc. But when I lost weight and looked my best, life WAS better. People were friendlier, chattier, I felt better, healthier, happier and more confident. I would rather be that person again instead of my frumpy mum self 😂. BUT it is what it is and none of that lasts forever.

Well done for becoming your best self.
The reason people responded differently to you was because, 'you' are happier with yourself, and sending happy vibes.
You can do that at any weight by the way.
As many of you will know, people who you gravitate towards, despite their ordinary looks.

LadyGrinningSoul8517 · 28/07/2024 08:59

To be fair to you, I have often thought this.
I went to a birthday party with my son once and it was at the most beautiful house right on the beach front, easily in the millions.

The birthday girl's mum was beautiful, slim and perfect.
She didn't work, the dad had a very high paying job though.
I remember being sat there thinking "Wow, being attractive really can give you a whole different life, can't it? Definitely makes it easier to pull the rich bloke with the big house".

So yes, I do think very beautiful people just don't realise how many advantages they have, and I totally understand why you feel you would want to be in their shoes.

xxSideshowAuntSallyxx · 28/07/2024 08:58

When I've sat on interview panels being pretty or handsome (as I'm female) is the last thing I look for, in fact it doesn't even come into it. I want someone who can do the job, not someone who looks good.

Also when I worked behind the bar (in several pubs) attractiveness didn't come into it either, politeness did, people who waved at me, held their money in their hands, called to me got ignored. If I've served you once and you were rude, I'd take my time the next time. But you do it in turn anyway and believe it or not most bar staff know who's been waiting the longest.

I'm more likely to do something for someone who is polite and friendly regardless of looks.

Ponoka7 · 28/07/2024 08:56

Mintypig · 28/07/2024 08:44

Are you sure people were not just crossing the street anyway? I have never seen anyone cross the street to walk near a beautiful woman. I think you may have over egged this in your head.

I had that when younger, I was followed onto public transport as well. It's frightening and you can do without any over sexual behaviour towards you when you have a baby/young children.
The thing is that you stop taking people at face value. Because you never know if they are only talking to you because they want gossip to shoot you down with (women) or want to shag you (men). Your intelligence and ability is always questioned or you are treated as if you have none. You never know if your date likes you, or just how you look, then you start to question everything. If pretty privileged now exists then I'm glad for today's women. We were seen as a bit of fluff and TV told everyone that. Lower level sexual assaults aren't fun and no-one cared. Most women in the 70/early80's carried internalised misogyny, so there was no support. A lot of men have the opinion that the wanker on this thread has.

Laundryliar · 28/07/2024 08:55

Cookiecrumblane · 28/07/2024 01:21

I am a sort of clever woman, financially secure, good at what I do. I have lots of friends and family around me, despite being single.
Today I met a woman through a friend, ten years younger than me. She was upset at losing her job last month, she had tried but made a serious of errors and was eventually sacked.
Even as she cried, she looked beautiful. She told me about her various problems, not being able to pay rent, her debt, her self esteem.
And I thought how much I would love to be that pretty. She was distraught, but even with all that was going on, she was served first and efficiently in the bar. Men held doors and beamed at her. They crossed the street to walk closer to her.
I have never had that. And so what good is education, my job, my success. Because ultimately she'll end up ok. She is more likely to get a job and when she does people will praise what she does much more than they praise people who look like me.
Is that mad? That I would swap with her in an instant, even to be jobless and at risk of losing my flat, just to feel visible?
I'm sure men don't feel this way.

OP its really obvious that this isn't about thinking pretty people have ir easier... Its about you being single, and not wanting to be. You've decided that the reason you are single 'must' be that men don't find you attractive enough so in your head, she'll find it easy to secure the one thing you haven't got.
You're right that yes she'll probably find it easier to secure interest initially.... But relationships founded mostly on a physical attraction dont tend to be the ones that last. There has to be so much more than that and the happiest marriages i know are between people who are just very normal looking.
Please don't assume that if you haven't met the right person yet, that there's something wrong with you, there isn't. I know it's really disheartening having been single for forever and not wanting to be - is there anything different you can do to meet more people? Best way to increase your chances of meeting the right person is to meet more people.

NeedToChangeName · 28/07/2024 08:55

My friend's daughter is clever, witty, kind and beautiful. Everything we might like to be

Unfortunately, she gets a lot of hassle from a certain type of men, and hates that

Mongrelsrbeautiful · 28/07/2024 08:55

PurpleBugz · 28/07/2024 01:42

When I was younger and prettier I got lots of unwanted attention from men. Had my bum pinched more times than I can count. I've also consistently experienced people assuming I wasn't very intelligent. I also wasn't aware I had reasonable looks I only see that now I look back- most women will be unhappy with parts of their appearance. Yes people do open doors for you and serve you quicker but it's not an even pay off in my opinion. Now I'm older and less attractive I prefer how people treat me generally

This 100 %. I love the invisability of being in my mid 50s. It has so many advantages. However, we feel how we feel,due to our own individual experiences.

Sarahslaw · 28/07/2024 08:52

Cookiecrumblane · 28/07/2024 01:21

I am a sort of clever woman, financially secure, good at what I do. I have lots of friends and family around me, despite being single.
Today I met a woman through a friend, ten years younger than me. She was upset at losing her job last month, she had tried but made a serious of errors and was eventually sacked.
Even as she cried, she looked beautiful. She told me about her various problems, not being able to pay rent, her debt, her self esteem.
And I thought how much I would love to be that pretty. She was distraught, but even with all that was going on, she was served first and efficiently in the bar. Men held doors and beamed at her. They crossed the street to walk closer to her.
I have never had that. And so what good is education, my job, my success. Because ultimately she'll end up ok. She is more likely to get a job and when she does people will praise what she does much more than they praise people who look like me.
Is that mad? That I would swap with her in an instant, even to be jobless and at risk of losing my flat, just to feel visible?
I'm sure men don't feel this way.

Read An Inspector Calls, this is exactly what the foolish rich daughter thinks when she gets the pretty poor girl fired -
she’ll be fine because she’s pretty. Spoiler alert, she’s not!

You are not magically ok in life because you’re pretty. Sure, there’s such a thing as pretty privilege but it also means men harass her constantly and many see her as a trophy. It’s normal to want to be prettier, but to want to be a woman who is about to become homeless just because she’s pretty is absurd. If she’s pretty but homeless how exactly do you think that will help her? Because some creep will let her stay at their house instead of on the streets?

NonPlayerCharacter · 28/07/2024 08:52

Mintypig · 28/07/2024 08:44

Are you sure people were not just crossing the street anyway? I have never seen anyone cross the street to walk near a beautiful woman. I think you may have over egged this in your head.

I've had men cross the street to stare at or walk alongside me or tell me I'm beautiful. I'm definitely not, but it has happened, so I can well believe it happens to women who actually are.

Relaxandunwind · 28/07/2024 08:52

You have proved that you don’t need looks to succeed. You’ve done it on your own.

She may have good looks but they fade and ultimately life is not about pleasing men.
You don’t seriously want to be pretty but skint and jobless so men can open doors for you ?

FeckOffNowLads · 28/07/2024 08:45

You’re objectifying her like everybody else does

Sugargliderwombat · 28/07/2024 08:45

People always say the grass isn't greener etc. But when I lost weight and looked my best, life WAS better. People were friendlier, chattier, I felt better, healthier, happier and more confident. I would rather be that person again instead of my frumpy mum self 😂. BUT it is what it is and none of that lasts forever.