Would this be too much for your young kids ?

Weirdly DD almost 3 would be fine with that; she’s a pretty relaxed child though and would happily curl up on my lap for cuddles. However, DD5 would be absolutely awful. She’s infinitely more high maintenance! We’re away atm and bedtimes have been around 8.30pm, yet she’s still insistent on getting up at 5am (plus a couple of wakes overnight as per usual) and so is absolutely shattered. She’s on the go from the moment she wakes up until the moment she finally goes to sleep, whereas DD3 will happily sit and chill if she feels weary.

Different personalities I guess; maybe you and your siblings were immensely easy going?

Yes - lots of children who are up late into the evening are in a long term schedule of a 3+ hour siesta/ lunch time nap. You can't just suddenly introduce that for a week's holiday, it's what they always do.

I'd imagine they have a very long nap during the day? I don't buy the argument that European pre-schoolers need less sleep than Uk pre-schoolers. I imagine they simply have a siesta through the heat of the day allowing them to stay up late in the cooler evenings. Surely?! My children NEED 12 hours sleep a day. That's not my choice. That's simply what they need. To not give that to them would simply be cruel.

For mine yes, bed by 7pm every night for 12 hours sleep and then a big sleep in the day. I suspect this is why we don’t have tantrums. Tantrums = exhausted kids. I’m not saying there’s never tears when things end but the tears quickly pass as there is no exhaustion. People say you can’t plan your life round kids but I can’t be dealing with exhausted tantrums.

Massive point to consider - all kids are different. That’s why I started with ‘For mine’

My mum spouts all sorts of nonsense about what she supposedly did with us when we were little. She forgets that as my youngest sister is a decade younger than me I have very clear memories of her infancy and early childhood even though obviously I don't remember my own! So I know that her versions are massively rose tinted and edited to suit whatever she wants to say now.

She used to try to bully me into keeping my children up late so she could have them on display at unsuitably late events by comparing them to my niece who supposedly was completely able to fit in and just sleep sitting up at late night family gatherings too - until the fact I put my foot down and said no gave my brother and SIL the courage to admit how keeping her up had always meant a really difficult day with her the following day and refuse to do it when they had their second child!

If they are only getting 9hrs sleep they are sleep deprived. V young kids need more than that and whilst the occasional late night is fine, more pre midnight sleep would help imo.

My girls would have a had a routine like this when they were that age and we were holidaying with my parents. They'd get into the buggy when they were tired but most nights wouldn't have been in bed until 1130/12. They were fine. I did stick to their naps during the day. We always had a great time. Normal routine started again when we got home.

In my experience grandparents have often forgotten an awful lot about what it's actually like to parent small children on a day to day basis.

My mum has rolled her eyes when I haven't let her give my children popcorn or toys which are small enough to choke on and said, "I have raised children myself, you know!"

Well yeah, fine, but I'm not going to give my kids things which are unsafe just because you don't remember paying any attention to that stuff and I survived to adulthood.

Similarly, I think they've most likely forgotten the naps, the weaning, the potty training, all the stuff that you have to structure your entire lives around for a few years while your kids are that young.

It's never helpful to compare your kids' ability to cope with that of children you don't know. You don't know when those children went to bed last night, when they usually go to bed, when they last had a nap, how long for, or when they had their last tantrum. @toomuchfu You say your child had three 20 minute tantrums in one day which sounds like a bad day to me. But anyone else looking at your child outside of those three 20 minute periods might have been thinking, "See, that child is coping, why isn't mine?"

All you're seeing is a snapshot of their day, whereas you know what's going on with your kids all day every day.

Ultimately your mum isn't the parent responsible for your kids so if you think the holiday schedule and late mealtimes and bedtimes don't work for your kids, that's your call, not hers.

Mine couldn't have coped with that but some would and also depends how different it is from their regular routine. Mine were 11+ hours sleep a night kind of kids (plus day time sleeps until well over 3) and meals at 7.30, 11.30 & 4.30pm. One holiday we went on it was clear after a couple of days DD wasn't going to work well with later meals and later to bed so I just reverted to her normal routine and I ended up going to bed much earlier than other adults but I was going to take the worst of a tired and unhappy DD so made the best choice for her and I. There were comments from other family members but no offers to step in so I did what worked best for us.

Mine would have been fine with that kind of schedule at that age, but it doesn't really matter what anyone else's kids are like. What matters is whether it is too much for your children. If it is, then it's perfectly reasonable to dial things back a bit.

Wouldn't have worked for mine at that age, unless there was a very significant later afternoon nap for both. At 4, mine needed more like 11-12 hours sleep.

Tbf though, that wouldn't even work for me - standing around at 10pm at a funfair waiting for shrieking kids to puke on the trampolines (at £5 a go)? No thank you!

They will certainly let you know, one way or the other if it is too much for them! Expect the odd scream and tantrum or sudden falling asleep at wrong place and time!

My DS often stayed up that late on holiday. Hes managed to reach adulthood with no harm done

I think that sounds fine for a holiday. We did similar when we went overseas with our daughter for the first time when she was nearly five, and would have done the same if she had been younger. It just added to the excitement of being on holiday for my daughter to be out at 11 or midnight; she fell asleep a couple of times and we carried her back to our apartment, but she didn't come to any harm and just slept in until 9 or 10 the next morning. She was never the only small child who was in a restaurant at that time of night.

A one off day maybe. My 6 year old stayed up last night to watch the Olympic opening ceremony. He woke up normal time at 6.30 this morning and he’s an emotional mess and looks tired.

So for my child, that would be far too much

Yeah my DD is 7 and we could do 1/2 possibly 3 days of this, but she’s normally sleep between 8/9pm and up at 7. Losing 2-3 hours a night would be too much and she can’t manage a nap in the day now.

I think there’s also an element of rose tinted glasses going on with your mum.

I don't get the question ? Is it the late bedtimes. Mine were never put to bed later than 7 pm. On holiday or special occasions they would stay up but otherwise no. If that works for you that's fine. You don't need us to tell you that surely.

I mean if it was an occasional day my 4 year old would probably be okay but if it was for a week or longer absolutely not. In fact he probably wouldn't cope with his routine being out for 2 days. He's autistic though so a bit different.
DD1 would have been fine on that sort of thing but knackered by the end of the holiday. DD2 would be okay during the day but not so great by the evening. She's 16 now and still likes to be in bed before 9 pm even on holidays

My 2 year old would be sleeping on his feet. I expect my kids to be able to cope with small changes in routine on holiday but this would take them ages to recover from.

🤣🤣🤣 at least she did that rather than give cuddles and say ‘I know how you’re feeling’ when you were being bratty 🙄🙄🙄

🤣🤣🤣 I know right! I bet it stopped you acting up in public though

My oldest would have been absolutely fine with it as a toddler* but she barely slept then anyway, and went to sleep around midnight on a normal night, let alone while on holiday. I don't think my youngest would have coped at 2 but when he was 4 we went on a long holiday and we did a lot, with a lot of late nights (but not as late as midnight, except on travelling days) and he did manage alright. Now at 6 he'd bloody love that kind of holiday but his tiredness would show in being more prone to tears over smaller things.

*she'd hate it now as a teenager though!

Maybe in the 1800s.

I grew up in the 90s and I was a whiny crying brat. My mum used to tell me to play in traffic on a daily basis.

All kids are different but if you're somewhere in southern Europe I suspect the reality is that those kids are on a completely different sleep schedule to your kids and have a 4 hour nap in the afternoon, waking up at 5 or 6pm, and they go to bed late every day.