Not trying to be inflammatory but why do people *need* more than two kids?

Kids really don't need their own bedrooms.

Parents having their own bedrooms has only been culturally normative for about 5 minutes!

I think there's a bit of a misunderstanding here. You're seeing that some people with many kids don't have high-powered careers and assuming they have children because they're bored or trying to fill a void. For me, and many others I know, the decision to have a larger family isn't about lacking a career or being unfulfilled in other areas of life.

Personally, I've always valued family and my children above professional success. It's not that I ended up with many kids because I didn't have a great job, it's that I chose to focus on family because that's what matters most to me. For some of us, the fulfillment and joy we get from raising a large family outweigh any desire for a traditional career. Everyone's priorities are different, and for some, family is the greatest source of happiness and purpose.

How many children do you have?

From what I’ve observed from knowing families with 3 or more children is that they aren’t brought up properly imo.

what a load of crap.

Even I think this is a ridiculous assumption. I don't recognise any of this in any of the families I know with three or more children.

However, they are all financially secure and well educated and have high aspirations for their children.

It’s what I’ve observed from growing up on a council estate, to now being in an affluent area.

its not possible to cater for every child’s need if you have more than 2.

ive seen it so many times in real life, people think their children are well cared for etc, but actually their standards are really low and it’s not what I call being cared for properly.

I can't think why you'd 'need' any children unless you're running some sort of sweat shop in which the more the better.

@TheHeadOfTheHouse speak for yourself… plenty do manage all this with 3.

You are confusing need and want.

Yeah, I kind of think this too.

In fact, one of the things about the environmental impact of children is that it's often the kids in western countries, not in places where they have larger families, that have the largest footprint. Why? Because the parents try and give those kids a luxurious (in worldwide/historical terms) lifestyle. Those kids grow into adults that see that as "normal" and expect a similar or better lifestyle as adults and for their kids.

In bigger families you typically see kids sharing rooms, with hand me downs, having to decide of which activities to pursue or choosing less expensive ones, entertaining themselves, taking far fewer trips to less exotic locales. They don't grow up into adults who believe they need two or three bathrooms, an overseas holiday once a year, etc. This is a good thing.

You are judging everyone by your own standards there. You couldn't manage to raise more than 2 well rounded, well mannered kids with clean teeth, a clean bed, a bedroom each, nice clothes and a some well fitted Clarks. Plenty can.

What makes you think that people don't think that? We are well off and so we decided to.

It doesn't make sense to use the word "need". We don't really need much i.e partners, friendships, our parents after a certain age etc. The only things we need are true essentials like air, food, water.

We were lucky to be able to afford more. Mine begin brilliantly (I have three). I would have had four if younger.

the west is running out of kids!

From what I’ve observed from knowing families with 3 or more children is that they aren’t brought up properly imo.

yeah they do extra activities and go on holidays, but that doesn't mean the child’s wellbeing and needs are fulfilled.

with each child people have, the parents standard of care declines. I don’t believe you can have 3 or more children and fulfil all their needs and shape them into a well rounded, decent, unscathed adult.

Things get missed the more children you have like:

• dental hygiene
• personal hygiene
• clean bedding, clothing etc
• the child being able to have their own bedroom (this becomes really important as they reach puberty)
• helping with homework and extra needs children may have like speech therapy etc
• one to one time with their parents
• shoes and clothes that aren’t handed down and fit properly.
• teaching children things like manners, respect etc

The things above take up a hell of a lot of time and there’s no way they’re done properly with more than 2 children.

What's the big deal with having a great job? Nice if you like it I suppose, but not the only worthwhile thing in life.

Someone could easily say that people with no or few kids have to spend so much time thinking about jobs that aren't actually all that important because they have such empty family lives. But that would be pretty narrow and stupid.

If you have loads of children, then make sure you can afford them. The cap should stay.

95% of terrestrial life forms are humans and their livestock. We need to get a grip of human population before we destroy our planet completely.

My third was an accident so not exactly a decision that I made on purpose.

Alongside some negatives (financial mainly!) there are so many positives to having 3 so I can now see people do want bigger families. I really love the chaos and how much more fun they have together compared to DS1 growing up as an ‘only’ for quite a few years. They all have such different personalities nothing is ever boring. I don’t feel they miss out on anything by me having one more, maybe abroad holidays but that’s about it.

@Hangingupnow well two seems like a good balance, and then some will have more and some won't have any. Seems like there's enough people everywhere tbh.

High birth rate is an extremely serious environmental problem. And that's also an understatement.

The UK doesn’t have a high birth rate though, a softer fall would be better. Much of the population increase here is driven by people living longer and immigration.

@marshmallowboy I aspire to be like you! Finding toddler stage challenging but trying to be more positive because you only enjoy them little once.

lol. Same here. Had one and was like nah… prefer sleep, peace and quiet.

In DH’s family everyone has girls. 2-3 girls now me with 2 girls, he is an only son. We will try another as that’s it. I understand the need to be comfortable but I think nowadays there is too much pressure to afford 6 after school hobbies for each child, expensive days out and holidays multiple times a year and then claim kids are unaffordable. Just because you splash out so much on kids doesn’t mean they won’t grow up to be awful adults either. My parents had nothing but me and my brother are highly educated with good careers. No private schools or private tuition either, just a very hands on mum who loved kids. Those who just don’t want them at all, I do understand, it is a very different and difficult life raising them.

We are already seeing an impact now with inflation etc

I don't understand how you tackle overpopulation that way-genuinely asking, not being goady. My mum's a baby boomer and there were 54 kids in her class! That was always going to be a problem down the line, surely we can't keep having kids and pushing the can further along the road whilst the world runs out of resources?

Theres a balance between schools closing in some parts of the country due to low birth rates & 54 kids in a classroom. A country that is comprised of mainly older people (we already have more over 65s than u15s) is unlikely to be a progressive or innovative one. And it’s definitely not going to be one with a strong economy.