To not let DS pull out of doing the 11-plus

@Porcuine20 he is having a big wobble, saying he thinks he’ll fail, we’re ruining his life by making him work over the summer, he doesn’t want to do it any more and wants to just go to the local school.

I haven't read all of the replies, but I've read your updates - I think you've summed it up really well by saying he's having 'a big wobble' .

Kids at that age don't always know their strengths and weaknesses and often say they 'don't want to do it any more' because they're not sure that they can do it - but remember they also don't want to disappoint parents!

This sounds like what it could be in this case - he thinks he’ll fail, we’re ruining his life by making him work over the summer, he doesn’t want to do it any more and wants to just go to the local school -
Sometimes they just need a big dose of 'yes, you can do it - but there's no pressure ' to back them up and help them feel positive and help them feel 'yes, I can do it'

We've all had a 'big wobble' at some time in our lives - even as adults ! - and sometimes we just need someone to believe in us, to cheer us on to make us feel positive. Isn't that something that we all need? (and this is why we turn to Mumsnet!!??)

Doesn't a DC need the same sort of advice / cheering on / bucking up ........ call it what you will.

It's hard when you're trying to not let parents and teachers down when they're all expecting you to do well .............

But also, parents should try and remember that the 11-plus isn't the be-all and end-all of everything.

Yes. we all want the best education for our children, but I've known many of my friends who ' wasted' their time at school and then found out what they wanted to do in their mid-20s and even mid-30s and very happily retrained (with a passion!)

It's never too late these days, because there are so many opportunities.

Tbh, It doesn't matter if he passes the 11-plus and it doesn't matter if he fails the 11-plus.
Different schools will teach different things - different life lessons.

And there are so many educational establishments / institutions today offering different options that you always have the opportunity to take extra qualifications if you want to.

Your job as a parent is to know what's right for your child - and what they're ready for at this age (far easier said than done!! 😳)

Speaking as a parent (who passed the 11-plus and went to a grammar school) of 2 children: I wanted to put them through the 11-plus and send them to a grammar school - it wouldn't have actually suited either child .

One passed the 11-plus but didn't want to to go to a school where she wouldn't have any of her primary school friends - and is now working in education as Head of her speciality.
The other didn't seem suited to taking the 11-plus - and is a very well-respected lawyer in her field

What I'm trying to say is that it's all about about knowing your children, about trusting in their abilities and supporting them at all ages.. It's an on-going process - however young or old - they are.
There is always the opportunity to do what you need to do to get where you want to be

I think your trip away can be a valuable breathing space for you all :)

I hear what you are saying but, unless things have radically changed recently, I don’t think the 11+ is memory or knowledge based exam. Analytical skills and techniques can be refined through practice but I think that’s why PP said that there’s no new content at this stage.

But generally speaking, it’s great that you figured out a learning style that worked for you but I expect there are lots of people that wouldn’t work for, so if teachers taught to suit those that cram, they’d probably be doing the slow and steady students a disservice.

perhaps unsurprisingly things have changed in 50 years.

YANBU.

Remind him that he's doing really well and that regardless of how he does, it will be excellent practice for all future exams.

Sadly there is an industry behind this and a load of tiger parents. Many kids are tutored within an inch of their lives, multiple times a week. Good schools learn to discern the tutored/spoon fed pupils. The ones that don’t probably aren’t happy places. It’s brutal.

This - my DS has ASD and struggled through parts of school. Was really behind in his first year of GCSEs due to multiple bouts of covid, anxiety and feeling overwhelmed. Once he decided he really wanted to study medicine, even if that means a detour vis a MSc/MSc in Bio Medical Sciences to compensate for mediocre GCSE grades, he completely stepped up. Is predicted all 7-9s (appreciate that may not be what he gets, though!)

I think many children - maybe boys in particular as my DH was the same - only really find their focus once they know what they want to do. At 10yo it’s impossible to know. If he’s bright, he’ll find his way even in an average comprehensive school.

Just give him love, space and encourage him have a stab at the exam without pressure. Maybe a treat for doing it, rather than the focus on whether he passes.

I did the 11 plus 50 years ago and I dont remember revising for it. We had a practice paper. We werent told in advance which day it would take place. We just turned up for school as normal and were told, today you are doing the 11 plus.
I thought it was just an IQ test.

YABU. Let him be a kid. My DS went to a bang average secondary and has just left school planning on doing a medical degree. If they want it, they'll put the effort in themselves.

I’d give him several weeks off and suggest he revisits towards the end of August. See how he feels nearer the time - but for now take your foot off the pedal.

If thousands of kids for a few hundred places, then most will fail anyway.

Those children are educated somewhere, they are probably bright enough for grammar but because places are very limited, they will also have to go to the local comprehensive. I'd be finding out where those children go and applying there.

One of mine failed to get into grammar school and so did most of her cohort, no idea why, several had been tutored but it just didn't work for them. The one that got in did well academically, but there's been a concern about hot housing and MH provision at the school.

I don't think it's worth pushing this in the first or second week of the holiday, and overall, you may have to dial down the 'he needs to go to grammar' thinking anyway- likelihood he won't get in, not because he's not bright enough or doesn't have the skills, there's just too little chance and it's all a bit random.

I'm with the boy. I was that kid. Parents (mostly mum) made me work through holidays, had to have tutors, mock exams invigilated by my dad, that he marked very severely. I sat the exam and it was actually a piece of piss I now see. My confidence was heavily dented. I got into the posh grammar. I was actually extremely precocious, and I must have been not much older that 7 or 8 when I realised (a) my parents didn't know everything (b) they were snobs (c) they thought I was a bit stupid. This last was reinforced by the infectious (!) anxiety they showed over the 11+. I didn't do well at secondary due to deliberate lack of effort; they said I was 'ungrateful'. I didn't see them much fro leaving school until I was 40. I got a good degree when I was 30 and didn't tell them. That felt really good.

@Commonsense22, was it really necessary to quote the whole of the OP's post?

Given yours was the first reply I don't think there would be any confusion about whom your reply was directed to...

Let him have the summer off he's 11 if he's grammar material he will do well wherever he ends up.

I’d lay off a little but I wouldn’t let him not sit just because he wants an easy summer. He doesn’t understand at his age what’s best for him, and this will be. Only one of my 3 sat the grammar test but we aren’t in grammar areas and had an outstanding secondary so I didn’t pay for a tutor. The grammars here are massively competitive and he didn’t get in, but then got 9x9’s in his GCSE and 3 A*’s. Dd didn’t sit but she’s likely to get a place for sixth form but isn’t likely to take it as she doesn’t want to go to a single sex school for sixth form

Give him some time off completely - the summer holidays are supposed to be endless long sunny days of fun - we all know that they don't end up that way and can actually end up quite boring especially when the weather is crap but take a couple of weeks completely off and then ask him if he'd like to start again. I think all kids need a break and some freedom, it sounds like it wouldn't impact his chances too much

Yeah, I did say further down that I didn't phrase it very well - that will teach me for trying to multi-task

I wouldn’t continue with the extra tutoring over summer, if he is going to be able to keep up with the work at a grammar school he should be able to pass it easily with no extra tutoring (I took the 12 plus and they aren’t difficult tests for clever children). I don’t think children should be pressured at that age, as it’s clearly having a negative effect on him and he is either clever enough for the school or he isn’t. It sounds like he is, so encourage him to go for it, but with no pressure! I went to a local comprehensive in a different county, then got in to a grammar school outside the catchment and in the next county over. To be honest, if he’s clever he’ll do fine in the local school - I quite enjoyed being one of the cleverest in the class at the comprehensive, and even though the grammar had far better results, I don’t feel I would’ve performed any differently in either school when it came down to it.

How about a middle ground of - sit the exam and don’t do the extra tutoring over the summer ?

that way if he gets in he can do it based on inherent ability not pushing - having had kids at grammar I think getting in working at the extreme if your ability is a challenge - some kids were tutored all through school and were very miserable. You don’t want to have to push push push for the next 7 yrs.

also , he’s a bright boy. It won’t have failed to occur to him that he can just attend the exam and just spoil his paper / walk out ….

My post above should say it comes down to timing and exam technique.
Yes yr 6 was a very relaxed year as she’d already covered all the maths.
They were tested 3 weeks into yr 6 on whole of yr 6 syllabus. Unless you have been taught it no chance as it’s so time pressured in exam.

Obviously the wisest thing for him to do would be to just push through the revision, sit the exam and open as many options as possible. But 9/10 year-olds aren't known for their wisdom and long-term thinking, and unfortunately this is one of those times where you can't actually make the decision for him; you can try to force him to do the revision and attend the exam but at the end of the day he's unlikely to get much out of it if he decides to actively resist. Worst case scenario is that you go through a huge battle until everyone is frustrated and resentful, and then he intentionally tanks the exam.

I'd be wary of the perfect being the enemy of the good, so to speak. Explain why you want him to sit the exam (stress that sitting or passing the exam doesn't mean he has to attend grammar, but it will give him the option to go), and then negotiate a level of revision he's willing to do. I understand it's a competitive area and something low-level like 20 minutes 4x a week may not be enough to pass, but 20 minutes 4x per week that he actually engages in and leaves him willing to put in effort on exam day is better than an hour per day of arguing over it fruitlessly until he just wants to never hear about grammar or the 11+ again.

You mention revision and big days out - this is a lot for a ten year old. Don't forget to let them be kids - a day of nothing here and there, mucking about, being bored. I'd take the pressure off a bit here op, you don't want to put him off enjoying learning

Yes, your first post just read like anyone who wants to go to grammar school needs to get used to that sort of workload (rather than the difficulty aspect).

The issue if it’s super selective is it just goes on top 150 scores or however many places. If everyone is tutoring then the pass rate is high. A kid scoring 75% might be grammar school standard and able to keep up but because everyone is prepped to within an inch of life then pass rate is 90%. The last few marks that make a difference between place or not come down to coming and exam technique.
Very different if it’s a pass in catchment gets you a place, they don’t need same level
of preparation.

Also for a previous poster, yes the standard has got ridiculously high. Not only are they tested on maths they won't have covered at school, but for example my DC is greater depth in maths but currently achieving about 65% on 11+ papers but needs approx 85% to pass the test in our area.

He's old enough to say what he wants and I think you should listen
No Year 5 child should be making decisions about their future education.