Can ex demand holiday details?

BookArt · 2024-07-26T06:07:15+00:00

Two kids are under five. First court hearing about the kids is next week. Ex doesn't see kids at the moment due to concerns about his ability to look after the kids. Police investigating ex assaulting me since our split. I gave 6 weeks notice of a UK holiday. Now 5 weeks later, 1 week before we go, ex tells me he does not give permission for the children to go unless he has the address and who is going on the trip. I could have guessed this would happen as control was an issue throughout. Now I am happy to tell him the county as a location, and make sure he understands that the kids will videocall at the same time and day as normal as one videocall falls while we are away. I don't want to tell him anything else as I'm really looking forward to not having to look over my shoulder while away. Is that reasonable or do I need to tell him all details? He's done this because I stopped a videocall yesterday that was nearly an hour long where he was watching the kids play but they weren't engaging with him. It was past their bedtime and rather than relaxing they were running around getting hyped up.

6pence · 30/07/2025 23:30

This is a year old.

How are things now op!

ReasonablyFair · 30/07/2025 21:34

@BookArtwhat was your outcome in the end?

Original poster

BookArt · 31/07/2024 06:42

Sunshineafterthehail · 31/07/2024 00:06

Have you heard the saying give a man enough rope?. Bide your time op. My exh showed his true colours at the final hour. The judge did eventually see him for what he was. A controlling bully. He lost his case. Stay factual. But state when his apparent 'facts' are lies. If you have reports already go through them with a highlighter so you can have the lies brought to the judge's attention.. 3 times a week is very intrusive. You are allowed time to parent your dc without his input
.. And abuse.

Thank you! If the judge does agree with Cafcass then 3 phone calls and one visit a week is going to be hell to regulate the kids back to calm, if that makes sense at all.

That is a good saying, my family said I've done that since the split. He was given a lot more and has quite quickly shown he isn't capable, which was my concern. That is good to hear that the judge saw it with your ex. I have everything crossed!

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Sunshineafterthehail · 31/07/2024 00:06

Have you heard the saying give a man enough rope?. Bide your time op. My exh showed his true colours at the final hour. The judge did eventually see him for what he was. A controlling bully. He lost his case. Stay factual. But state when his apparent 'facts' are lies. If you have reports already go through them with a highlighter so you can have the lies brought to the judge's attention.. 3 times a week is very intrusive. You are allowed time to parent your dc without his input
.. And abuse.

Original poster

BookArt · 30/07/2024 22:43

@Sunshineafterthehail that is really creative, thank you. Definitely got me thinking!

No stipulations yet, first court date is this week. So we shall see. Dreading it as he is representing himself. Hoping he shows his true colours, but he is a clever man so I can see him putting on a show unfortunately.

They'll be another court date after this as evidence needs to be gathered due to allegations made. He has lied about things where I have physical proof.

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Davros · 30/07/2024 20:06

What about him wanting to know WHO is going on the holiday? Terrible ⏰ ‼️ 🚩

Daleksatemyshed · 30/07/2024 19:21

He wasn't a reasonable man when you were together, he's not going to change now. Follow any guidelines set down by the court to the letter but no more. The courts seem hell bent that DC need a relationship with their Father even when they dislike and fear him. Be strong Op, one day your DC will vote with their feet and refuse to go

Sunshineafterthehail · 30/07/2024 18:28

What sort of stipulations do the calls have? Set times? Length? My mate was court ordered to have school photos sent to her exh's prison. The school abliged in her request to have 2 sets done. 1 for her family and photos of the back of the dc for him. He also succeeded in demanding proof of her spending. The bank sent A5 copies of 2 years of statements in braille to his prison..
You need to adhere to the order but get creative. Dc can ring him from sat on the loo. He doesn't get to see around your home or see you.

Merrymumoftwo · 30/07/2024 15:46

Suggest making a diary before court maybe make videos also showing the impact before, during and after contact. Focus on impact on your children. Good luck!

Original poster

BookArt · 30/07/2024 15:30

jrc1071 · 29/07/2024 15:11

Sounds like the classic abuse by proxy: controlling you via the children. 2 calls a week is plenty enough (as they get older they will be more social and 1 call a week is sufficiient). 30 minutes max. 1 hour too long.

Re holidays: as the children are in your care, you have 100% custody, you are not traveling outside of the UK, he does not need to know. Tell him to stuff it (politely of course). And as you have a solicitor, have the father's solicitor contact yours as opposed to contacting you directly.

You cannot co-parent with a fuck wit. So let that go. He will try to control you every step of the way so direct him to communciated via attorneys'.

Cafcass have now recommended three phone calls a week and unsupervised visit once a week for a few hours with a third party doing drop off and pick up. Gutted as I really don't think I explained myself very well. Three phone calls a week is a killer as I capped the last call at just over 15 minutes and he was fuming. Shall see what happens at court.

He doesn't have a solicitor, he sacked him. I keep directing him to my solicitor but his latest is he refuses to contact them so I don't respond unless it is actually important. It's all on a coparenting app.

I've politely told him I'm telling him nothing else. He has said he has a right to make sure my holiday is safe so he can object if he feels the need. He didn't receive a response to that one either.

You are completely right there is no Co parenting here, every step is battle. I've been reading about parallel parenting. If contact is confirmed by the judge then I need to prepare myself for our eldest to come back with his opinion of what he does and does not like to suddenly being exactly like his dad's. Then it was taking him a day to get back to himself. Youngest becomes super clingy as she is pretty much ignored. So tough for the kids. Hopefully my barrister is good! Hoping for the best but preparing for the worst.

OP posts:

jrc1071 · 29/07/2024 15:11

Sounds like the classic abuse by proxy: controlling you via the children. 2 calls a week is plenty enough (as they get older they will be more social and 1 call a week is sufficiient). 30 minutes max. 1 hour too long.

Re holidays: as the children are in your care, you have 100% custody, you are not traveling outside of the UK, he does not need to know. Tell him to stuff it (politely of course). And as you have a solicitor, have the father's solicitor contact yours as opposed to contacting you directly.

You cannot co-parent with a fuck wit. So let that go. He will try to control you every step of the way so direct him to communciated via attorneys'.

Original poster

BookArt · 28/07/2024 13:06

ThePearlSloth · 28/07/2024 07:52

You are NOT an idiot… you are a strong woman trying to do the best for your children. Everyone learns by their mistakes - either we live and learn or we die as fools! I’m only saying this as controlling partners try to convince us we really are stupid and are incapable of doing anything right. Never believe it 🩷

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Thank you for this. Definitely have no confidence and doubting myself. Received the cafcass report and the lies that he has told, some are him saying he did something that I definitely did and can prove, so some I am confident with because I have evidence. But other allegations I've started asking my family who I now live with do I do this, do I do that? The doubt is strong. So it is good seeing other people's opinions in black and white, sort of gives me that kick I very much need to stick with my gut!! Thank you for your kind message, really needed it today!

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Sassybooklover · 28/07/2024 10:08

To the best of my knowledge you don't need your exes permission to take your children away, in England and Wales. If you are unsure, please seek advice from your solicitor. As long as your children can still call him, as agreed, it really doesn't matter where they are. You most certainly don't need to give him details of your holiday. Don't allow him to intimidate you, by making you believe you are breaking the law by not telling him, and therefore could get into trouble.

grassyknees · 28/07/2024 09:27

Remember to add in the court order that the children's passports have to be with the parent who is taking them abroad three weeks before the expected departure date. This will avoid any last minute aggro over 'lost' passports and allow you time to get replacements.

IamMoodyBlue · 28/07/2024 09:17

Absolutely agree with not telling him the exact date, keep it vague. If you have already told him & you're at all worried about being followed, can you leave a day early? Stop in a travel lodge or similar overnight, they have family rooms.
Good luck & best wishes for your happier future.

ThePearlSloth · 28/07/2024 07:52

BookArt · 26/07/2024 07:31

Thank you, I think I might do this. I need to make it clear that I won't be giving him all of this info moving forward.

100% about the hour long phone call. I'm an idiot. Won't be happening again.

You are NOT an idiot… you are a strong woman trying to do the best for your children. Everyone learns by their mistakes - either we live and learn or we die as fools! I’m only saying this as controlling partners try to convince us we really are stupid and are incapable of doing anything right. Never believe it 🩷

OnGoldenPond · 26/07/2024 12:15

NSA2103 · 26/07/2024 08:37

I'm a father, separated in late 2017, and well out the other side of a very messy break-up. In the heat of the separation, I wish someone had sat both of us down and firmly asked us this really important question:

What co-parenting relationship do you want with your ex, after all the dust has settled?

Every nasty act, on both sides, will make you less able to successfully co-parent together in the future. And if, deep down, you are good people - trust me - you'll have regrets later about how conducted yourselves during the separation/dispute phase.

Doesn't sound like the ex in this case is a good person. He is barred from having direct contact with DC at the moment as he is unable to take care of them and he is currently under police investigation for assaulting the mother of his children. In this case OP cannot trust him and needs to be very careful.

Original poster

BookArt · 26/07/2024 11:54

Thank you for all of this! Really good advice that I definitely had not thought of, and just seeing it in black and white really helps to get things straight. It's so easy for me to give advice to people, but very different when I'm emotionally invested and also needing to learn how to say no again!

I'm going to tell him an area, he already knows the dates, I'll confirm the video call will happen.

I'm going to keep the video calls to 15mins max and be more firm about ending them. If he also points his camera at the ceiling for a few minutes I will say goodbye and hang up also (Yeh... Don't get me started). Boundaries are very much needed in this context.

@CandiedPrincess I understand what you are saying, I would hate if he took the kids away and I didn't know where they were. Completely reasonable to be upset about it which is why I was doubting myself. However, this relationship isn't civil, his behaviour is escalating and erratic since we moved out and I don't want the kids to witness anything further. So I'm constantly thinking what is best for them. If he had raised concerns 5 weeks ago about the holiday when I informed him I would understand, instead yesterday he asks the five year old questions to get the information (5 year old didn't 't know the answers as it was supposed to be a surprise, surprise was ruined by ex). He didn't ask in a civil manner, he made threats and demands including name calling. I can only be hopeful that in the future we can both be civil about these things.

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Daleksatemyshed · 26/07/2024 11:46

I wouldn't tell him where you're going on holiday Op if he doesn't see the DC in person at the moment. If he's that controlling he might just turn up and make a scene in front of the DC. If you must say something tell him the county but no details.

Original poster

BookArt · 26/07/2024 11:26

@Whatabonkersworld thank you for this! So helpful. So glad you're in a better place!!

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ThatsAFineLookingHighHorse · 26/07/2024 11:09

If he 'blames' you for calls going wrong, I'd be quietly recording them. Phone or camera. So you have comeback when you eventually go to court.

You don't have to tell him where you're going; don't 'humour' him by lying, because that could make him feel entitled to knowing more and pressuring you and causing an issue if he shows up and discovers you've lied. Just don't.

TicTac80 · 26/07/2024 10:23

I don't think it's unreasonable to say: "we're going on holiday to X area on these dates". I did that with my XH. I didn't give much more detail in the first few months after we had split (he had turned verbally abusive, but not physical).

IceCreamWoes · 26/07/2024 10:18

notbelieved · 26/07/2024 07:39

Don't lie, OP. It could backfire - I didnknow it at the time but I once took my kids to my parents and the ex foĺlowed - saw it in his bank statements when divorcing. He had literally followed me around for a week - shopping in the same shopping centres, eating at a local restaurant, petrol bought at the station nearest my parents, huge bill at an excellent hotel. Absokute piss take. I used it against him when seeking residence, believe me! Did him no good. You are not obliged to give the details, so don't. Put your boundaries in and hold them.

How is that the same as the op telling him she is somewhere else??

Ap42 · 26/07/2024 10:18

Nope, you don't have to tell him anything. Just that your going away and you won't be sharing those details.
I would advise against lying though, have been through the courts myself and they'll take a dim view of this if found out, even though it's perfectly reasonable under the circumstances. Good luck, and enjoy your holiday.

MargoLivebetter · 26/07/2024 10:18

He's abusive and controlling - you have said so yourself. He is going to use every method he can to abuse and control you still (I know this as I have spent the last 20 years divorced from a controlling arsehole). He will do this through the video calls, his demands, his requests to know where you are or any other thing that pops into his head that he thinks he can use against you.

You are being reasonable and wanting to 'do unto others as they would do to you'. Please remember that the police are investigating this man for assault against you. Every time you feel like you need to be reasonable, remind yourself of how badly he has behaved and how inconsiderate and controlling he is. Was he reasonable, did he behave well, did he do unto you as he would like done to himself? No, of course not.

Going on holiday in the same country does not count as a 'major decision' about the children's lives, so even though he has parental responsibility, he doesn't need to know the details. He cannot give permission, as his permission is not needed!

Big hug to you @BookArt . Try and get some counselling if you can. It helps a lot.