To think the US system if repeating grades is weird?

My experience is upper primary, so it may be that you’re right about secondary (by which time many if those who move through primary with the highest levels of SEN may well have moved to alternative provision). Thinking about my current class, none would benefit from ‘doing the same again’. 2 absolutely need alternative provision (working around 4 years behind, for reasons that will not change with age. At least one other , probably two, would benefit from alternative specialist education focused on autism but with subject content at or above age level. 3 more would benefit from specialist dyslexia support / provision, but are academically capable of accessing the curriculum for the expected age group with this support. Several would benefit from additional challenge while remaining socially with their age group. Two need additional dual language education but with it are capable of accessing the age group curriculum. One needs acute MH support.

But as I say, none need to ‘do the same again’.

It's not just the US. Lots of countries do this. Though as PP have said it would be extremely rare to fail more than one year.

When I was at school there were also separate remedial classes if you weren't able to keep up with students in your year. It worked out like intense tutoring and in my opinion works better than having everyone in the same class at the same time as seems to be the case in England.

My school used to do this, back in the dark ages, but it was a private school. I remember one pupil being held back in the first form for two years running, in hindsight I'm surprised her parents didn't just take her out. They also used to put new pupils into whichever class they felt appropriate for their abilities, rather than according to age, so that in effect some people skipped a year or two. The ones who were kept back tended to leave after GCSEs, although that wasn't universal.

I see where you're coming from, but I think it ignores the wide variety of reasons why children can 'fail' a year. It might be a kid who has been ill and missed a lot of school one year. Or, more commonly, teenagers whose hormones are all over the place, suddenly refusing to put any effort into their schoolwork once they're 14/15. These kids don't have learning difficulties, but for whatever reason are not keeping up in school. In my experience (not from the US, but from another country where kids do occassionally resit a year), holding these kids back a year can help them catch up. Of course it's always a trade off - for example if a kid has been ill a lot teachers might decide it is more beneficial to keep them in the same year group as their friends, rather than having them resit a year. Especially in primary, that flexibility is usually there.

From my younger days, I know a couple of kids who repeated reception year, and a handful who had to repeat a year in secondary school (often the final year after failing their final exams). In all of the latter cases there did not appear to be an underlying reason for struggling with the material, just typical teenage behaviour & not putting in the time required to study for exams. All passed their final year at the second attempt and subsequently went off to uni.

It’s normal where I come from in Europe. I think the limit is to repeat the year twice. You can also skip a year or delay start time by up to one year.
The children I knew who were held back once or twice ended up finishing education around 15 (primary school finishing age in my country-this was back in 1997) and going on to do technical education and gaining non academic qualifications. Some are doing very well as adults.

It is incredibly rare these days that a student in K-8 is not passed to the next grade. Consideration is given to the social impact of losing peers and the stigma of being held back. Students are often given summer school or additional tutoring instead.

older students absolutely have to pass their classes in order to get credit. They have grades/years, but they are largely irrelevant. Students end up mixed together across ages quite often because many courses are not linked to year at all. For example, any student can take Art I. but if you don’t pass year 9 english-language-arts, in year 9, you have to keep taking it until you pass. It is a required course to graduate.

How does that work with children who would never be able to pass the standard or equivalent exam that you describe? Are there any safeguards in place for them at all?

I assume there’s a limit though and and you don’t have 17 yr olds in kindergarten.
I don’t think it’s a bad thing as long as limited to 1 year. Would potentially help those young in year, missed school for illness etc.
It would probably also help with motivation in secondary the messing around cba types, incentive to work to stay with friends.
After 1 year if still not meeting targets to move up then there’s clearly some additional needs and they need alternative provision.
Would take a massive shake up and funding though.

I think that there is a fallacy here - that a child who does not make the ‘minimum expected progress’ in a given year will progress better if they repeat that year. It may be true in Reception- that a child joining at just turned 4 from no previous provision at all (so no nursery, no pre-school, perhaps less than ideal hone situation) may benefit from 2 years in Reception just to develop key social, motor and language skills. However, a child who is older than that who isn’t making minimum progress in a year has a barrier to learning that needs something different, not the same again. So all I can see would be that either children would process smoothly OR children would be forever ‘take grade, repeat grade, maybe scrape through, take next grade, repeat grade’.

I don't think anywhere they regularly have kids repeating every year, but I think it would be an interesting debate if we said to kids in primary if you don't achieve a certain standard by the end of year 6 you repeat it or go to summer school (there would need to be exceptions for some SEN etc) and maybe again at about year 9 you may focus the minds of some children who don't engage properly with school. I expect it would be rarely used, but having it as an option may well improve focus and, with it, achievement in the classroom.

Well, yes they can repeat but not endlessly. I think it's a maximum of twice.

It makes sense. What's the point in kids continually progressing through school when they can't grasp the material?

You should need to pass each year before you can progress - obviously with the leaving age of 18 still in place, so wherever you're up to at that point, you don't need to continue any further if you don't want to.

It just means each pupil gets as much of an education as possible, rather than being dragged along and passing absolutely nothing whatsoever.

One of my old colleagues had an October born child and because she is obsessed with thinking she has bred a genuis wanted him to get on, she found a private school willing to take him a year early. So he went at 3 and didn't turn 4 until the October.

So going early does happen.

If a child is failing grades year after year they surely have special needs rather than ending up 13 in a class of 9 year olds?

I think it’s a good idea as I suspect that kids who struggle at school come to a point where the difference between them and their peers just gets wider and wider where as if they repeated a year then that gulf might remain the same or decrease because they’ve got that extra year to catch up.

It's the same in Austria where I live. It works well. It's often the first class which is repeated and that is a good thing because some children are just not ready for school and learning and need a bit longer to mature. That extra year makes a big difference.
I think they can repeat a maximum of two years though I'm not 100% sure about that. The system is quite complex. There are various different types of secondary schools. There are also polytechnic schools which cover the 9th year group and are usually attended by those who have struggled at the middle school and will go on to do an apprenticeship combined with vocational school after the 9th school year.

It's better that a child has a solid foundation of education rather than shuttling through the system simply because of their age.

In the US you have the right to stay in school till 21 (this is important for special education students). However kids who have repeated grades multiple times have high dropout rates.

We need more options to repeat years here - the myth that we can teach a 4 year range of ability in one class to any degree of success is one of the problems in schools.

Agree that if you need to repeat multiple years there are serious problems and other interventions are required.

As it is we just pass the lack of attainment on with no stop til exam years and too many kids slip through to GCSEs/NAT 5s with inadequate interventions.

There were some complete utter thickos in DS's primary. So dumb the school had to cheat for the year 6 SATs and tells them the answers

I have a friend whose child repeated reception. He’s 13 now in year 7, so only a few years ago. It seems to have worked really well for him. He’s very well adjusted in secondary school now, though he is huge compared to the other year 7s.

That said, I grew up in the US, and had a friend who skipped a year because she was SO BRILLIANT! She was really immature for her cohort, bombed out of uni and married an absolute twat at 20. She sorted herself out and is now with a lovely guy and 2 dc and in a career she loves and seemingly happy and well adjusted. But the pressure of skipping ahead didn’t really serve her I don’t think.

I think it’s a very individual decision.

By not surviving?

Not sure why you are calling it the US system. This is what happens in most countries. It's the UK which is more the exception here.

I think the U.K. system of pushing children along to the next year even if they don’t have a grasp of the curriculum is much worse.

@llamajohn I think I read somewhere that in some parts of America if grades have been repeated they can carry on High School until age 20 ish and if they still haven't "graduated" then that's it - they have aged out.
They do have the option of the "ged" (different names in different states) - which is basically a graduation equivalent test. From my knowledge of American telly (😁) that's a multiple choice general knowledge test.
They can do that at a community college.
(you also have teens that have reached legal leaving age - which can be 15 in some states - go and take the GED so they can "drop out" of school)

Most other countries DO have the repeat system, OP.

In terms of compulsory school ages, some places actually have compulsory school levels to complete. In my country you must achieve the equivalent exam to GCSEs - usually done at age 16. However it’s not unusual for 17 or 18 year olds to sit them for the first time at that age after having repeated one or two years.

There is no option to leave, say, with only grade 8 (normal age 14) if you’ve turned 16 and decided to stop going to school, because it’s compulsory to achieve the equivalent of that exam before you can enter the workplace.

For students who have genuine difficulties achieving that exam, and would be at risk of repeating over and over, there are “practical schools”, a bit like colleges or apprenticeships, where they can take more tailored courses that would give them an equivalent qualification and direct them towards a job, but it’s rare that children are allowed to fully leave the educational system just because they were held back.

Nobody bats an eyelid at an 18 year old sitting GCSEs with their 16 yo classmates.

Edit to add that if you were to leave education altogether before achieving the minimum required level / exams, you’d have lots of trouble claiming benefits or entering programmes designed to get young people into the workplace. It’s not a get out of school card - you must complete your secondary level in order to either progress towards uni exams, a more apprentice-like schooling system, start working or claim job-seekers allowance.