To think the US system if repeating grades is weird?

Moving through the classes should be done on the basis of ability, not age.

Which ability? If I have an exceptionally able mathematician who struggles with English, do they stay in a low class or move to a high one? If I have a child with dyslexia, do they move up to access the curriculum content that they are capable of grasping, or stay forever in Year 1/2 in line with their writing ability? If you are saying that every child who needs to repeat more than once needs a special school
place, where are you going to find all those extra places? Especially as it appears that ‘passing’ or ‘failing’ a year is a school-by-school construct?

No, I don't believe education is about pouring facts into a DC's brain. In the UK all DC are entitled to an education based on their age, ability and SEN.

School is for education but education is much broader than facts.

I think being able to repeat a year is really useful and should be made more available.

My OH's family moved to a different region in at the start of third year (year 9 today), and initially spent a few months without a school allocation, then got allocated a crap comp in a different town, so learned nothing, and didn't actually get allocated a place in a decent comp in the new town until something like June so basically missed an entire year. Never recovered from that. Fourth and fifth years were a real struggle, ended up with a few poor CSEs. But he managed to claw it back at college and got a diploma with credits and distinctions.

At my crap comp, I was mercilessly bullied so ended up failing all my O levels and CSEs. I "re took" them in a different school's sixth form, passed enough, then went on to A levels there, so basically spent three years in sixth form and did my A levels in classes with pupils mostly a year younger than me.

It definitely should be something more readily available, especially when there are genuine reasons, such as moving and losing a year of education, and extreme bullying leading to moving schools etc.

Never really understood this obsession with everyone moving up a year whether they're ready and able or not. Moving through the classes should be done on the basis of ability, not age.

I was born in May and I remember going to reception with some other nursery kids in January (I imagine, but I definitely remember some of my classmates going to reception without us then we were in the class with them again later), this was England in the 90s.

No it's one of the few things we should take from America, passing a grade to move up. If we don't do that then all classes need to be streamed by ability with tests throughout the year to ensure your learning at a similar rate to peers and feeling supported

Perhaps OP would know that if she had been held back a year 😂

Don’t get me wrong - in the UK, the message to all children in the high level football/ dance / music etc schemes is ‘do your homework- no homework, no football’. So they require engagement with schoolwork, but do not set a minimum attainment level, recognising that not all gifted participants in sport or the arts are also academic.

The point I was making was in response to a poster above, who said that extracurricular activities in some US schools were explicitly not available to pupils who were not reaching specific academic standards.

Which is obviously ridiculous, as by limiting eg orchestra or drama club or dance or football to those who were doing well academically you are denying potentially gifted pupils the chance to do ‘their thing’.

Are you asking if there is a standard across all schools? In the US, in the state?

I think you have to remember and it’s been said here. There is no national curriculum/standard. There may be a statewide standard but not necessarily. There are standardized tests to see how students are doing in relation to students across the country and state but that has no bearing on their advancement.

From school to school there is not a universal requirement. I gave the example of transferring into a religious private school and would have been held back due to religion credits. If I had transferred at a grade lower and 6 months later decided to transfer back to a public school I would go back at the original level.

It’s interesting, for example, that a UK conservatoire - very high grade music, selected by audition - has very minimal academic requirements (the 2 Es ir equivalent required for funding) to acknowledge that musical ability does not always parallel academic ability.

This is the case everywhere in the world and makes total sense. Musical ability and talent is recognised this way, not just awarded to anyone. Academic ability should be recognised in the same way - qualification not just automatically earned by everyone.

Interesting to read the EEF’s ‘take’ on this:

Here

Studies seem to show that pupils who repeat a year actually make less progress than similar students who don’t (rather than catching up) and that it entrenches disadvantage.

I was held back a year in my French school in the mid 70s. From. 4-11 I went to French, US and English primary schools. Different systems, different age cut offs. Sometimes I "redoubled", sometimes I went up a year. I eventually landed in an English secondary comp age 11 in my "correct" cohort.

Are the requirements to repeat a grade universal (ie not school-dependent)? Or might a child be required to repeat a grade in high-performing school A but progress normally in school B?

I went to a school where we had to pass each year-end exams before being allowed to progress into the next year group.

It's not helpful, it's stigmatising
But the whole way they grade....which is typically on a bell curve as I understand it, is not really objective or particularly helpful...especially in determining of you can progress. And I have heard from several people that standards are lower. British students at US universities find the first 1-2ys to be very basic I am told

Actually UK is in the minority. Most countries have the repeat system. I’m from an European country; my stepbrother had to repeat yr6 twice. Sure, he’s in the minority to repeat the same year twice but repeating a year once wasn’t that uncommon. An alternative was parents to secure tutoring for the subjects the child struggled with so that the child can pass the year but most didn’t bother.

And it seems to have an underlying message that ‘nice things are only available to those who not only try hard, but do well’ - ie an philosophy that low academic ability is a student’s ‘fault’, which can be overcome by ‘trying harder’.

Is it a student’s fault that they cone from a family background of relative deprivation? That they have a specific learning difficulty? That their genetic inheritance or birth experience means that their ability is for sport, or music, or art, or dance, rather than narrowly academic?

That must be really tough for children or young people for whom eg dance or drama or music or sport is ‘their thing’, if academics is not - again, a double disadvantage where their area of relative high ability is denied to them by their area of low ability. It’s interesting, for example, that a UK conservatoire - very high grade music, selected by audition - has very minimal academic requirements (the 2 Es ir equivalent required for funding) to acknowledge that musical ability does not always parallel academic ability.

in early years students are often very spiky anyway. Schools aren’t holding students back often. Every grade has mixed abilities even with age grouping.

most sports in elementary are not linked to school. They remain based on age, not grade.

at the high school level, you don’t have to pass all your classes to advance. You can take 9th grade math over and over again and you will still be a 10th, 11th, and 12th grader. Summer school is going to trigger at that point though. Our school will also let you take some of your credits at the local community college, which is harder, so generally not an option chosen by someone struggling, but if they just need a different approach I could see it working.

School sports are primarily at the high school level and they are grouped 9-12 by skill. So yes, 14yo can end up competing with 18yo.. Some sports just have one team. Some have a varsity, junior varsity, and some even have a beginners squad. There are eligibility rules that prevent 5th year seniors from participating in most sports leagues so you won’t end up with the significantly older students out on the football field.

Students also have to maintain a minimum gpa to participate in extracurricular activities at most schools. it’s is not purely punitive. Some activities are incredibly demanding in terms of time . If a student isn’t passing their classes, they can’t really afford to dedicate the hours required to play a sport or to compete on the debate team.

How are children with very spiky profiles, e.g excellent at Maths but poor at literacy; excellent reader/writer but dyscalculic, managed? Do you progress at the rate needed for your strongest area or your weakest? Does repeating a grade show a measurable improvement in weak areas while still allowing progress in strong ones? How are eg school sports teams (or anything ‘age related’) managed?

Is / was there a strong link between family deprivation and repeating years? It does seem to me to be a mechanism for further entrenching advantage ‘you have good family support, a stable home and educated parents - of course you move up. On the other hand, you come from a less advantaged background, you are vulnerably housed, your single parent is working all hours to keep food on the table - you have to repeat a grade’. Is that something we want to entrench? Does it help younger pupils if you have a concentration of older, bigger, disadvantaged, possibly disengaged pupils as part of the same class? Does it impact behaviour?

I went to an American school and had a 22yo in my 12th grade class. I don't know many years they. Can keep trying but you can't graduate without the requisite points ie classes passed. The GPA system is harsh.

I knew a couple, but it was more of a case that they transferred into a private school and was placed in a lower year. The other case was a kid in my 3rd grade class who was going to held back and parents transferred him to a public school to move on.

I almost transferred to a private religious school from public in 10th grade but it would have cost me an extra year because I would have been too far behind on religion credits.

But answer the question… I think it’s not as common as it was in the 80s/90s and earlier as there was a big push to social advance kids.

I taught in a country which did this (not USA). It works pretty well. The kids are not in a class full of people several years younger than them, because many people repeat years (and some skip years) so everyone will be the same age to start with, but the more you go up the school the greater the range will be.

I only know one kid who was held back a year in my elementary school in the US. And I know one kid in my kids school here who was held back. So not sure if it's more common in other areas?