To say F*** OFF to my ingrate teenagers

They're old enough to do chores for their pocket money

Chores shouldn't be for money IMO, we all have to do chores, we don't do it for financial reasons, we do it because it's part of living. Sets the wrong precedence in my view. They should do chores as they get older as part of chipping in for the family, a matter of mutual respect, it shouldn't be on one person to do. It's probably hard to start that as teens though.

Oh god I would shout so much! I remember being given loads of freedom as a teen but there was absolutely no way I would have been allowed to be rude to my parents, ever.

I can't remember doing chores at all but I cleaned up after myself in communal areas, always.
I didn't have an allowance but asked for money when and where I needed it. That kept me in check I assume, you can't go and ask for £20 when you have been a little shit.

Remember that you are not failing, they are failing you at the moment.

Ground rule: rudeness is not acceptable.
For the rest: leniency, they can keep their bedroom how they want, checking the pockets of their clothes I would actually doit, it takes one second.

Every parent is different though so I would have a think about the boundaries that you do not want to see crossed, and then gives them loads of freedom inside that frame.

I think teens can be a bit cranky, but not rude.
Mine wouldn't dream of raising their voice to me.
No dishes or eating meals in bedrooms either.
They do hang out in their rooms though at times and I think that is both normal and acceptable.
At times they have been lazy and a short sharp dose of zero tolerance has gotten them to up their game.
They have a lovely home and they need to both pitch in and appreciate it.
What the OP describes is absolutely awful behaviour and I wouldn't give them a penny, nor do a thing for them until they majorly adjusted their attitude.

Take the summer off. Just do your own washing, zero cleaning and leave them some food to prepare if they wish. No pocket money but offer to pay them if they do the housework.

They'll soon realise what they are missing.

I’m none of the above, including Irish and my teens aren’t recognisable here either. Most British parents have boundaries that are enforced long before things get to how they are in the ops post, but I think most of us recognise that that is how teens would behave if they are allowed to get away with it.

So now things have hit rock bottom for the op, and she has lots of helpful suggestions to get back on track. I hope she now has the ability to enforce tough love. Pain before gain etc. And it will be painful to begin with, until they know she means business. They’ll push back enormously to begin with, but hopefully she’ll ride through that by being calm and consistent, until things begin to get better.

How are you doing op?
Good luck op.

Teens can be just awful, can't they? Makes me yearn for their young years when you were their world, they could have lots of hugs, now my DD tells me not to talk to her anywhere in the vicinity of the school gates 😂 no advice just solidarity
Add a grumpy autistic teen to an ailing mother with Alzheimer's and as a lone parent doing it all I dream of running away to a desert island fanned by Jason Momoa as Khal Drogo lookalikes 🌴

I'm also really shocked at the attitude that seems pretty widespread on Mumsnet that teenagers are 'vile', that rudeness is just part of the package, that parents should let them leave their bedrooms in a mess as it's 'their' space, as well as the behaviour of the OP's teens. It doesn't sound like many of the posters just sit down and talk calmly to their teenagers, just so much strife all the time.

I'm Irish - if I had tried to behave with such rudeness to my parents they would have thought I was mentally ill.

I have teens and while they aren't angels I just don't recognise this behaviour as normal. Their rooms can be untidy, but I just ask them to tidy them - job done. Same with helping around the house, I just ask and they just do it. We had a sit down recently and said they've to step up a bit in tidying after themselves and take it in turns to clean the kitchen every evening and they agreed although they're often a bit slap dash. I've occasionally caught them rolling their eyes but they apologise when I mention it. Amongst my friends it's similar in that sometimes someone will have a hard time with their teenager but only momentarily or to do with larger issues.

I'm not sure how cultural it is. I'm neither Asian nor Eastern European, just a bit Irish I guess, but in my family we took the same approach - swearing and disrespect from teenagers or anyone else were NOT tolerated for ONE SECOND, the DC knew that was the deal from an early age and nothing changed when they were teens. Equally, I did not swear at them or disrespect them, their feelings or their possessions. Somehow it was also unacceptable that they spent any significant time alone in their rooms, but that was before smartphones and we only had one TV, in the living room, so it was their choice really.

yes, yes and a hundred times yes.

East European here and absolutely horrified at what I’m reading. I mean, horrified.

Had I ever behaved like these teens do, had I ever dared to speak to my parents in the way these teens do… whoa, my possessions would have been sent flying to Neptune with me flying right behind them. And I had loads of autonomy and pretty chilled out parents in general, but that kind of language and attitude would not have been tolerated.

Yes, some allowances were made, but this idea that “they’re teens, what can you do” simply doesn’t exist. There’s plenty that parents can do.

If my room was such a stinking mess they’d empty all the drawers, throw all of my possessions onto the floor, take away all of my electronics etc and make me clean it up. I’d have received no money, no privileges, no right to leave the house, until I learned to behave.

OP lone parent, work full time with an ADHD DD15.

You sound exhausted.

Own oxygen mask on here first.

Please take a break, get them to their Dads for a weekend or week, get yourself out to see friends, coffee, massage.

When they come back start deploying any tactics on here you think will work.

My tips. Car time, they can talk about what they want with you. If they don't talk then tell them something interesting about you, you as a teen.
Chores, or there is no reward, praise every small good they do and get in there for a big hug.

Roar, when they are absolute assholes, they need to know.

Mine gets right in my space sometimes, in my room, I tell her to leave when she's being an asshole.

It's a really tough time, I'm in the thick of it too. Plus I have a heavy career so it a balancing act.

Try to have some fun with them too though, something they want to do, paddle boarding or trip to a city etc (but only if they have been nice)

Exactly this!

And that includes trying to stop me taking something from them. They're not his possessions, you bought them and while he lives under your rules he's not entitled to them if he's not behaving.

Why would you need to be overpowering him? Do you allow your children to be physically reactive towards you? I've never lifted a hand to my kids and they certainly wouldn't lift their hands to me, 6ft 5 or otherwise.

My sons the same height and age, if he was acting in the way the OPs son was i can assure you id be wrestling the phone i pay for (because im guessing OP foots the bill) out his hands. My son was being completely disrespectful so his phone was removed and he learned.
In the circumstances OP is describing, her son in no way deserves a phone that he most certainly doesnt pay for.

Bully for you... my youngest was 6'5 at 16yo, I would not be wresting his possessions from his hands. Even if I was in any way able to physically overpower my teen boys to take their belongings from them, I think it would have been entirely inappropriate to do so, not to mention incredibly inflammatory.

Just a thought, but maybe instead of stopping pocket money just reduce it, and agree with their father that he won’t give them extra as that would undermine what you are trying to achieve. Then literally pay them to do chores. Have a set amount for each task and require proof of completion. I’m not talking about things such as keeping their rooms tidy (too easy to deliberately make a mess then get paid for the clean up!) I mean specific household tasks eg washing up, laundry, taking the rubbish out etc things that benefit everyone in the household - even cooking a family meal if one of them is up to it! So instead of asking them to clean up after they’ve used the bathroom, one of them will get paid to clean the entire bathroom however often you want it done, regardless of who makes the mess. So it’s not about clearing up after themselves, it’s about helping with general household tasks. That in itself will probably make them more aware of the mess they are making. Dad can do the same if he wants to at his house. And remember to praise good work as well as paying cash!

Absolutely, TheNuthatch. Not yet seen how period products entered the thread but this has no correlation with the issue and just creates anxiety for the DD and more resentment. That’s awful and immature parenting.

Change the WiFi code, give them chores to do to earn it from you.

Without wanting to put you down because you've looked after both very well BUT you allowed all this. You let them speak to you like that and you let them treat you the way you do. My kids wouldn't dare. They'd lose every privilege and have to earn each one back at a time. They'd have a bedroom that consists of a bed and bedding and their clothes until they followed my rules. There wouldn't be any phones, no video games and no ordering pizzas. While your kids live under your roof they obey your rules.
You should have nipped each bit of disrespect in the bud before it got like this. So you can't blame them entirely, they're teens and they'll act like dckhads if you let them push the boundaries.
Take this summer to restore some respect and order in your home. You don't want your future son and daughter in law to have to put up with this nonsense because this is part of your duty as a parent to raise them not to be like this.

I don’t think the OP could stand the house being in such a mess- she’ll cave in!

My mum hit the roof when she found maggots in the.food under my bed🤣

I'm 51 now and really tidy.

OP wants to tell them to 'f- off'. I wouldn't personally do this to my DD (who is not a teenager anymore). But OP's DD seems an entitled twerp. So she won't get the tampons she likes but the ones OP buys generally. When I was a teenager this was the norm.

I just came on to say this. I’ve never understood the whole chore chart thing. If ever there was a way to create a battleground between you and your teenager that’s it. Money isn’t necessarily a motivator either.

For us, intrinsic motivation was built up from around year 5, where the more sensible they were, the more freedom and perks they got. The minute they let you down (and at year 5/6 let’s face it, the level of ‘let down’ is not going to be huge) - the freedom and perks go away. It’s completely in their best interest to mature and take responsibility, and the result is they are trusted and treated like adults.

I didn’t expect my DC to do a SINGLE domestic chore but by the time they got to year 7/8 they could be pretty much left to choose their own bedtimes, get themselves up and ready for school, get their own meals, secure the house properly etc. They were mini adults. And hardly any disagreements or agro.

My DD15 once described us more like housemates than family, and I was quite sad about it but she said for them as teenagers that was a better model because we all did our own thing but when we did get together as a family to watch a film, or a Sunday roast, or just late night chatting in the kitchen it was so much more friendly and enjoyable - and they had an increased appreciation for family because of it.

Sorry but I find it abhorrent that any parent would use period products as a bargaining chip, or incentive for good behaviour with a teenage girl. You do you

Or she can muck the lot up when he's out. Esp a play station/X box.