No holidays - carbon footprint

I think this is very true
I rarely talk about the choices I make and the reasons because unless the other person is broadly of the same view they often seem to take it as criticism and get defensive or try to undermine your choices
and I would never question other people's choices unless my opinion was asked obviously
better to light a candle than to curse the darkness

One. I'd have loved more children, but didn't due to the environmental impact. One was a big decision, but I did everything I could to minimise my carbon footprint. Cloth nappies, homemade clothes, growing my own food, keeping chickens, solar panels, composting/recycling, grey water use etc.

I won't fly (or cruise) for the rest of my life. I don't need to be on a different patch of land to find satisfaction in life. I'd much rather do my bit.

None.

Surely that's a reason for why more people should reduce the amount they fly (so it makes a more significant contribution) rather than telling people not to bother?

Yes we did a train trip to Italy last year. It was amazing and far better than flying. But it cost more and took longer. The train journey was part of the holiday. But if you want to go somewhere and flop on a beach for a week then spending 2 days travelling by train to Spain isn't really going to be for you.

We don’t fly anymore, since 2019. We do go abroad once or twice a year, by ferry and diesel van, or train. We also travel in the U.K. We’re not perfect, but we make good choices or less bad choices where we can. We can’t control anyone else, just our own behaviour.

i won’t point to celebrities or royals or politicians who fly frequently (even though they should be first against the wall come the revolution 😉) because there’s nothing I can do to change them. I can only do me. Similarly, in our friendship group (middle class, doing well), everyone flies. It’s come up once or twice but never divisively.

Other things we do - one child (not through choice, we wanted two, but are now happy, and we definitely didn’t want three); electric car (don’t buy the nonsense about taking 6 years to pay back manufacturing - how long do you think fossil cars take? It’s very similar, all that metal isn’t free - And e batteries can be recycled); solar panels; mostly vegetarian; have a contract for renewable energy only from Ecotricity so even when we use the grid to charge the car, it’s not coal.

On the downside - we have a diesel van and a wood burner, both of which are terrible and we try to minimise; we flew a lot when we were younger; used to eat a lot of meat. In some ways I look back with grief and nostalgia for the 90s and early 00s when we could still do these things with some degree of innocence. Not any more. But as the saying goes, when the information changes, I change my behaviour…

@NoBinturongsHereMate

My point was, the minuscule amount of people who don't fly at all, compared to the ones who do fly, aren't having any affect on reducing the demand as flights are at an all time high.

The result is negligible.

Note the words 'demand' and 'number of flyers'.

Reduce number of flyers, reduce demand, reduce flights.

Makes sense as a population continues to grow I s'pose. Sad, but can see how that would be the case.

this subtopic has been covered on the thread already :)

@perplexedandbemused

The stats state that flights are at their highest demand, with 200 million more flyers since covid. There are about 8k flights in the sky at anytime, sometimes more.

I hope no one on this thread who is a no flyer / low flyer is a swiftie.

vm.tiktok.com/ZGen74UdF/

Her carbon footprint is wild, especially as she's one for being one with the environment and nature.

That's a nice way of doing it :)

I try and see everything in moderation, as I'm not sure I believe in reincarnation and would like to enjoy my time. So, we're in our house probably every 3rd Christmas, and when we're home we have a real tree. We eat meat when we're out if we want to but are veggie at home, we look for everything second hand first before buying new, then try and buy local/sustainably, and only if that's not possible and we can't live without it will we buy something new with a large carbon footprint.

Think I'm going to take your three year cycle idea forward to DH as a good option for us. To be fair we couldn't afford to fly more often than every 3 or 4 years anyway. But I would like to do some really epic trips with the kids whilst they're under 18. We're open to the kids having an input in the final locations depending on their interests as they get older, but I know a safari is high on my list, as well as Japan, New Zealand and Canada. We're saving with the hope to do 2 or 3 'big holidays' in the next 10-15 years. Feels like an okay compromise to still enjoy my one ride on this planet whilst trying to be mindful that I'm not the last generation who need to live here!

I'm very worried about my carbon footprint and we follow a three year cycle for holidays. We do have them.

We rotate between holiday in the UK, holiday in Europe by train/drive/ferry and then holiday in Europe with a return flight. (This is over a period of 3 years).

We had flights in 2016, flights in 2022 and flights in 2023 (because there was a 6 year gap I figured 2 years in a row would be ok). We aren't holidaying this year and are looking at ferry/train options for next year.

In my case: 0.

Although I'm more of a reduced flier rather than a no flier.

The environmental and ethical concerns around tourism are obviously a bonus but the main reason for us is cost, for a family of 4 it could cost hundreds of pounds to go abroad and we don't have that spare. I think it's been 10 years since we flew anywhere. I don't really know people who take a lot of foreign holidays in real life.

I'm quite new to mumsnet, and not new to the idea of avoiding flying due to the environment. I live in a very liberal area and a lot of people are prone to thinking greenly.

On the flip side my brother is a pilot, usually for private customers. Within his circle flying regularly is totally normal.

Would suggest therefore it's a lot to do with who is around you and what your everyday normal is. However completely agree with you that if the big shot influencers, contributors, companies etc made it a priority then it would become a movement rather than just down to personal preference and opinion.

Also...empty seats perhaps because more people are opting not to fly? Or can't afford to with the COL. Maybe not entirely, but more than likely the reason behind some!

It’s just a mumsnet thing. Dh is a pilot so we fly very regularly. If the major contributors of CO2 suddenly made a u turn and made an effort to reduce levels I certainly would follow suit.

But my flight to Vienna for the weekend on a commercial airliner (with empty seats) pales in comparison to yachts, private planes, the agricultural industry etc.

If that makes me a hypocrite I’m fine with that.

We haven't flown for years, due to environmental concerns. We'll probably fly in the future but want to be mindful about it and only do so rarely when it's somewhere we really want to go (no more random city breaks just because there are cheap flights available).

We have one friend who is similar. We also have family who fly constantly, I mean up to several times a month. I try to keep my gob shut!

This isn't a new way of thinking - I remember feeling bad about flying for my honeymoon nearly 15 years ago and looking into carbon offsetting options.

And yes, before anyone jumps on me, we did save up for an electric car, air source heat pump to replace our oil boiler, we are veganish. We are far from "perfect" but trying to do our bit as I'm genuinely worried about the future for our DC. But I also studied climate change as part of my MSc so probably have a greater awareness than average.

I don't fly.

I'm also kinda poor.

Environmental reasons makes my failure sound like a merit

It's all performative lies. If they can browbeat somebody online else into foregoing a holiday, it offsets their own secret travel. Remember that anybody can claim anything on here.

It makes me wonder about how to make a difference. A few shells and bombs overnight on Ukraine cancels everything my family attempts in 10 years.

Given up flying because it is so tedious and uncomfortable. I remember when you got decent service,they had plenty of staff and a comfortable reclineable seat even in ordinary section.

I don't know that one. Thanks for the recommendation.

I bet that was incredible!! <3 I'm mostly scratching my travel itch with books on the topic these days. Tuk Tuk to the Road is a great one for a flight free adventure.