To think 'chav' is not an okay thing to call people?

Mush is very common colloquial where I grew up. I had never heard of anyone refer to someone as 'mate' until I moved to a different part of the country. Many Roma words have made it into everyday language. There has been a population here for 500 + years after all. I've never known the word Chav in its modern useage to be used to describe people of Roma origin, even if that's the language the word originated from. As I said previously, how do we know it wasn't first circulated by Romani in it's current meaning?

Bushmills - such ignorance in every line.
Do you think a Gypsy/Romany can or would want to change who they are?
Do you think we do not suffer discrimination?
I am not saying that the people you call Chavs are racially discriminated against, that would be idiotic - they are not likely to be Romany or Gypsy. You really cannot be that thick?
I am objecting to the name you ascribe to them - Chavvy, which means Romany child. That is the origin, there is no other.
Will you please get it through your head that the Romanies and Gypsies are an ethnic minority - it took until 2010 for this to become law. You cannot discriminate against us any more than you could an Indian, Dane or Nigerian. Using our word for child to describe something you consider laughable or disgusting is racist.

This thread is hilarious. Chav is a word to describe a person who displays a certain set of behaviours which are perceived by someto be negative, and apparently that's a terrible word to use
But those same people are happy to call people snobs, also a word to describe a set of attitudes and behaviours which they perceive to be negative. Madness!

Is not discrimination in the legal sense, as discrimination applies to something which a person cannot change - skin colour, gender, disability etc. It does not apply to the choices someone is making about their behaviour, clothing, actions etc. Which are absolutely their choice to make. But calling it discrimination undermines true discrimination people experience every day, about things they have no choice over, cannot change.

Dordi!
I have never heard Charva used as a horseman - sometimes as a mispronunciation of Chavva - children.
Horse is a grai (not a written language, so spellings vary)
Grai mush - horse man.
I'm not fluent, I am a generation away. Gorgios take the language and mispronounce/misuse it.

No one is hating anyone.

Teentaxidriver · Yesterday 15:20

Chav, or Cheltenham Average. Coined by the ladies of Cheltenham Ladies College to denote a particular type of local.

Or Council House and Violent, another retro fitting. It's from Romany, charva, meaning a horseman. It's still charva in Newcastle, which has a fair bit of Romany slang / dialect.

Doilem: idiot
Gadgie: man

... for example.

It’s a total irrelevance anyway. No one envisages Romany people when you say Chav. There are lots of other eirdz gif that and I’d agree they are pejorative and unpleasant. But that simply isn’t how Chav is used.

I don't think enfant terrible is the same at all, to me it's a (possibly) middle class child who is playing up, going through a phase. Nothing like describing an entire group of people.

It's not used about children at all in English, I don't think. It is usually used to describe an extravagantly dissolute or shockingly-behaved adult, often one who is well-known in some particular cultural circle - 'The enfant terrible of classical music' etc. But no, it's not remotely like using a romany word to describe a whole group of people.

@Arraminta so if you look at a group of people and say "urrgh what a bunch of chavs" do you mean -
1 - "look at those people who could possibly be of Romany descent"
2 - "look at those people who are probably from a council estate and are likely to have asbos"
3 - "look at those people in fake designer clothes trying to look like they have more money than they have"
Which is it?
Because despite the many posts of "of course people know what it means" this thread has clearly shown people use it to mean different things.
(none of which are acceptable or nice)

I don't think enfant terrible is the same at all, to me it's a (possibly) middle class child who is playing up, going through a phase. Nothing like describing an entire group of people.

As I understand it, we have evolved by making hundreds of, surprisingly accurate, judgements every day. We're actually extremely good at it, even when we just rely on a quick visual appraisal. Yes, we might sometimes get it wrong but we actually get it absolutely right most of the time.

Everyone judges. Anyone who claims not to is a liar!
And all these people so determined to defend the poor put upon traveller community , would be total nimbys if said group wanted to camp in a field outside their houses.

I don't have a problem with it at all. It's a handy moniker to accurately describe a certain sub culture. Everyone immediately knows who you mean. At university we had lots of descriptive monikers to describe distinct groups. Goths, Rugger Buggers, Townies etc. Conversely, I don't have any problem being labelled a snob or judgemental because I absolutely am.

Calliopespa

Just keep scraping the barrel for excuses.
You are never going to have the grace to admit that you have made an insulting comment.
I'm done trying to educate you.

I think her point was that you don’t need to be French to fit the description enfant terrible.

None of these concepts are racial because with race you are born something. Being an enfant terrible ( or a chav) is based on behaviours and attitudes that are acquired not innate. It may be a Romany word ( though I think it’s far from clear it is the source of the term) just as enfant terrible is a French term that doesn’t make a statement about being French per se.

I agree to the extent that you can’t label a whole “ group” - for instance just because your sister is a chat or you live in a particular area etc doesn’t make you fit the bill. Every person is an individual and I don’t think you are born a chav, it’s a decision you take in adopting certain values and behaviours. But I think you can generalise about the aspects that make people generally feel an individual fits the description.

I assume you don’t know the phrase enfant terrible then? A phrase used in English with the French word for child to describe someone whose behaviour is shocking and/or embarrassing

I don't think enfant terrible is the word for 'child' in French, you are just describing a naughty child in French for some obscure reason.
Keep scraping the bottom of the barrel to excuse the racism, though.

I assume you don’t know the phrase enfant terrible then? A phrase used in English with the French word for child to describe someone whose behaviour is shocking and/or embarrassing

What a load of nonsense.

People need to stop trying to blame others for the way their lives turned out and start taking some personal responsibility.

These “struggling adults” are in fact adults that are perfectly capable of sorting out their own lives if they can be bothered to do so.

Wallowing and pandering to them with the “poor you, it’s not your fault” attitude helps nobody.

Just seen this while having a scroll. If I hear the word chav, I think anti-social. Which would explain memes like this.

What's interesting to me is that my ex husband was from a nice area of the country and his idea of a chav was as some posters describe. Trying to buy class - but the people he described had money to fritter away. He was in for a shock when he moved because he had assumed that was the most vulgar kind of person one could encounter. My family referred to exH as "Posh Knobs". Instead, he would call the kids round our way "urchins", which for me conjured up images of raggedy dressed children with dirty faces.

After reading a few comments I think that if the likes of the OED update their meaning of the word chav to be a racist slur, I would be inclined to stop using it. Otherwise, I think it's a commonly accepted name. Tbh I think it's only a word I've ever used in writing, and to people who wouldn't understand what a docker-picking scrote is.