Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not understand why my mum ( or anyone ) needs to sunbathe topless ?

290 replies

aghak · 19/07/2024 09:24

I'm staying with mum and my two kids at a holiday cottage. It's private so no one can see, but I still don't get why she or anyone feels the need to sunbathe topless ? I would just never do it and it makes me a bit uncomfortable to be around people who sunbathe topless.

I get it I get it, not everyone is like me.

But why do your boobs need to be brown ?

She also insists on wearing a bikini at almost 70. Ok fine, I don't wear a bikini and I'm not even 40 yet. I do think, good for you but I do think one pieces are just more classy. Same with having everything on display.

I realise I sound mean spirited don't I ? Or just uptight ? But isn't more, less and more classy in general ? Interested in opinions !

She raised me so I'm surprised I am not more on display myself but I'm pretty private about my body and always have been.

OP posts:
Sapphire387 · 20/07/2024 18:08

You keep talking about 'people' being topless. Do you mean 'people' or 'women'? Does it bother you if a man sunbathes topless?

MarvellousMonsters · 20/07/2024 18:03

CatamaranViper · 19/07/2024 09:29

Sorry but your own hangups or insecurities about your body should not dictate what others do with theirs.

Personally I hate having white bits on my boobs when the rest of me tans. Restricts the cut of whatever else I wear on the holiday. If I get to 70, I'd love to still rock a bikini. Good on her for not people pleasing and making herself uncomfortable

100%

Imustgoforarun · 20/07/2024 09:06

Mumsnet is weird and I’m sure a lot of posters have never been to a beach /hot resort. I’m current in Cyprus. The sun beds are full of ladies of all sizes, wearing bikinis. Infact the odd one wearing a full swimsuit look hot and out of place. When the ladies walk to the toilet or bar they all wear lovely cover ups. Unlike the majority of men who have male privilege and walk around with gut and moobs hanging out including getting on the bus. Perhaps the media needs to focus on men getting the beach body rather than us ladies.

Mumofmarauders · 20/07/2024 08:25

I was thinking about a lady I know who wears the full niqab yesterday and how she never gets to feel the sun and the breeze on her body (which I think is such a shame, though that's a totally separate question of course!), but then reading this I guess because I would never go topless anywhere I could be seen, and our garden is overlooked, your mum might say the same about me!
I agree with you by instinct OP, it does seem unnecessary and weird to me. But the comments about the freedom of it have got me thinking!

OneTwoTen · 20/07/2024 00:36

please provide references for your thesis, especially for ‘natural shame’ and its uses

Perhaps you could try googling anything you don't understand about what I've written, or that you'd like further clarification on.

Allfur · 19/07/2024 22:47

LadyCrumpet · 19/07/2024 22:45

Funny how it's on the woman to stop others feeling uncomfortable, when when it's a man that's uncomfortable they are told to not lol and it's young girls/women's right to parade about how they like.

God no, that would be even worse

LadyCrumpet · 19/07/2024 22:46

*Look, not lol

LadyCrumpet · 19/07/2024 22:45

namechangetheworld · 19/07/2024 17:38

What attitude do you admire, the one where she doesn't have enough regard for her own daughter and grandchildren to prevent them feeling uncomfortable?

Funny how it's on the woman to stop others feeling uncomfortable, when when it's a man that's uncomfortable they are told to not lol and it's young girls/women's right to parade about how they like.

mm81736 · 19/07/2024 22:15

It sounds like a 'you' problem tbh

missshilling · 19/07/2024 22:12

Maria1979 · 19/07/2024 20:41

I hear you OP. I don't want to see tits or asses either, no matter how young or well-toned. If it was my mum I would tell her to please cover up because it bothers me. My DC would be mortified if a family member went topless. We have our neighbour sunbathing topless all summer. To be fair I'm so used to it so I don't see it anymore. My oldest DC thinks it's embarrassing though..

I would stay away from Spain.

To not understand why my mum ( or anyone ) needs to sunbathe topless ?
NighttimeNightmare · 19/07/2024 20:48

LindorDoubleChoc · 19/07/2024 19:18

I agree completely. A pp told me that I was wrong to have seen far fewer topless women on the beaches of Europe in the last 10 to 20 years than I did when i was younger. I don't know how she knows I'm wrong, it's a bit odd.

I'm in my 60s and wouldn't dream of going topless infront of my children or anyone else, although I might have many years ago. And it's not to do with how my body looks, it's to do with how times have changed and being mindful that my children and grandchildren might prefer not to see it!

I don’t know who told you that you were wrong, but my experience of living in France and Spain up until fairly recently is that most people were topless and that was young ladies (early 20s) and teenagers all the way up to the other end of the scale. Maybe it depends on where you are? In Spain it was definitely Spanish women, not Brits abroad too.

I get the point that other people are making, but for me, that was what solidified it in my head as being absolutely acceptable and our way as being a bit daft. The attitude in general was brilliant. Seeing groups of women in their early twenties with girls and guys of similar ages topless together and comfortable really made me think ‘yeah it just isn’t a big deal and it’s a shame we’ve made it so’. Swimming topless felt very freeing and enjoyable - no idea why! And as far as. I know, none of these people are fucked up in any way from this toplessness. It feels like it becomes the norm and that’s when the discomfort and the perversion lessens and ceases - because it’s normal and acceptable and no one is surprised by it.

Maria1979 · 19/07/2024 20:41

I hear you OP. I don't want to see tits or asses either, no matter how young or well-toned. If it was my mum I would tell her to please cover up because it bothers me. My DC would be mortified if a family member went topless. We have our neighbour sunbathing topless all summer. To be fair I'm so used to it so I don't see it anymore. My oldest DC thinks it's embarrassing though..

Zanatdy · 19/07/2024 20:37

My mum used to in Spain when I was around 8-12yrs old. In front of my teenage brother too which I just wouldn’t do (I did breastfeed infront of my teen DS but that wasn’t all hanging out). I definitely felt uncomfortable but it was very popular back then, doesn’t seem to be now

LegendInMyOwnLunchtime · 19/07/2024 20:32

OneTwoTen · 19/07/2024 18:30

*I find what you write interesting. I'm not sure if you intended your aggressive tone?

Given that I SPECIFICALLY wrote about private saunas, in family homes, it's interesting that you jumped from my post straight into an anecdote about public saunas being problematic.

In the context of this thread and beyond, I think that "prudishness" can often be an innocent-seeming cover for actually quite repressive, obsessive, shaming and ultimately damaging thinking, where normal human bodies are coupled with sexual perversion and things which are taboo.

And looking at this from a population level, that damaging "prudishness" might possibly be part of why so many men in this country are susceptible to following online rabbit-holes that lead to CSA content... Maybe they're following the thrill of the taboo, that starts with something as normal as naked boobs, and ends up with terrible violence and harm?

It's my hunch that if it were more normal to hang out with naked friends, mums, aunties and grannies, and to find naked human bodies no big deal, then possibly we'd be in a much healthier place, sexually, as a culture.*

I don't feel aggressive about it. But I do bump up against the insidious shaming and chilling effect that language like 'prudishness' and 'repression' is intended to have on people who are asking totally reasonable questions about where the line should be when adults are getting naked with children.

I used a public sauna as an example in my last post. But here's a private one for you; a good friend of mine at university grew up with nudist parents - one of whom wasn't his biological parent. It utterly fucked him up for life. We lost touch a few years ago but last I heard of him, he was still in therapy and had just broken off his third engagement because of his inability to have a healthy relationship due to sex addiction.

Granted that's only one piece of anec-data but it does challenge your assertion that de-sexualised nakedness as a part of daily domestic life would prevent later perversion or issues.

Personally, I think that liberalism (and 'cultural norms') can often be a cover for at best, inappropriate and at worst, criminal behaviour.

My children are 8 and 10 and already instinctively want privacy from me, and also give me privacy. If they walk into my room as I'm dressing, they walk back out again and ask when they can come in. I haven't enforced this, it's something they have just started doing themselves. (I actually rarely close bedroom or bathroom doors in our house because we have Siamese cats and they complain loudly whenever they can't get in!)

Natural shame is a protective emotion. It helps keep us safe. It is too often confused with toxic shame. But they are not the same. One is necessary, the other is corrosive.

Subverting the instinct to feel natural shame in service to liberalism can be very uncomfortable, and even traumatising. I can imagine the dissonance experienced by a child wanting to put their own boundaries around their privacy but who also wants to please their parents by taking part in 'family nudity', for example.

All discourse around this topic on this thread has focussed entirely on what the adults feel they would be okay with (or think they ought to be okay with). Bolstered by odd and unsubstantiated arguments that it's 'healthy' or even necessary to know what adult naked bodies look like. Given that every single body is completely unique, I'm not sure what general conclusions are supposed to be drawn from knowing that mum's labia minora stick out and auntie Janet's don't.

I'm afraid I simply don't believe that children want to be naked with their parents - or any other adults, for that matter - after the age of about 8 or 9.

Speaking plainly, I would definitely have concerns about a family who regularly got naked together with children beyond pre-teen age. And I think most other people would too, if they're honest. Whether you're from Berlin, Malmö, or Stoke-on-Trent.

In the OP's situation, I think her mother is being very inappropriate not to consider how her grandchildren might feel about seeing her in just a pair of bikini knickers.

I get that this might make you defensive, because you're probably quite emotionally invested in the idea of co-opting some sort of quirky, novel bit of Scandinavian 'culture' to scaffold your idea of yourself as progressive and position yourself in opposition to uptight Britishness.

But I simply don't see it the same way. Perhaps I'm too cynical. Or maybe I'm just realistic.

I weren’t bovvered one bit when I were a teen and we were all naked on the beach.

Innit.

(please provide references for your thesis, especially for ‘natural shame’ and its uses)

xxSideshowAuntSallyxx · 19/07/2024 20:15

TaraRhu · 19/07/2024 09:31

It's generational. My parents (70s) see a tan as a status symbol. They both sunbathe in nothing or next to nothing because they don't want tan lines. They do it in anything from 16 degrees plus. They are both the colour of old boots.

Maybe amongst certain groups but my parents are in their 70s, and they cover up and sit in the shade and slap on factor 50. My mum grew up in Africa, and my dad was posted to the Middle East in the 70s. They don't see a tan as a status symbol but maybe that's because of where they've lived in the past.

Tumblingjungleofchaos · 19/07/2024 19:58

Blisterly · 19/07/2024 12:48

There’s nothing classy about being so judgemental.

Good point!

Dearg · 19/07/2024 19:56

Topless and a thong ! I really wish I had your mum’s confidence . She sounds fabulous.
It’s not your thing Op, and that is totally fine, but please, never stop celebrating this woman !

Tumblingjungleofchaos · 19/07/2024 19:46

RitaFromThePitCanteen · 19/07/2024 10:09

My partner sunbathes topless. He's a man though so he's automatically allowed more freedom.

It's only social conditioning that makes you think women's bodies are obscene and men's aren't. Society isn't always right about everything, you know.

Exactly

OP your pair comes across as hideously sexist and ageist about your mother.

Maybe time to examine where those feelings come from?

Men can get their moobs and beer bellies out.
Why is it not "classy" when a woman does it? Is it because you believe a woman shouldn't "flaunt" herself? And where do those notions come from?

Hint:patriarchy- valuing women for looks and sexual function only.

greektreacle · 19/07/2024 19:45

I live in Spain and I’d say boobs-out outnumber boobs-away by 2:1 on our local beach. All ages too. Lots of thong bikini pants too.

TBH I find it very affirming to see that people of all ages and sizes are able to enjoy the beach in the same way, without being told to put it away because they’re old or fat (I am both of these so feel I can use the terms). Some are families, some are couples, some are groups of friends, some are alone.

thefamous5 · 19/07/2024 19:45

@Allfur

Well, that's the whole point of this those isn't it, whether women should be able to go topless in public.

I hate seeing men walking down the street topless and so wouldn't want to see a woman doing the same, but around a pool, on the beach and definitely in a private garden it should be absolutely fine for a female to be topless if a man can be topless.

OhmygodDont · 19/07/2024 19:37

I do admit my baps are now away till September since the schools
closed 😅

Startingagainandagain · 19/07/2024 19:36

I don't think doing this in front of kids is appropriate.

I am half French and lived in the south of France for many years. It was quite common for women to sunbathe topless on the beach.

But I always found it a bit daft and I prefer to be a bit more elegant/understated than that...

I live in a seaside town now in the UK and I also really wish men would not remove their top while walking around the high street every time the sun shines. Today was like a tattoos and beer bellies sunfest...

Most people actually look better with some clothes on, myself included!

OhmygodDont · 19/07/2024 19:33

NiceCutRoundDomeDormice · 19/07/2024 19:32

It's really not good for your nipples to get sunburnt

I’ll ask again - if topless sunbathing instantly equals sunburnt nipples, why aren’t there millions of men in agony with this every summer?

Because as women obviously we are far more delicate little flowers with our hormones. So we don’t have those manly strong nipples.

We have those whimpy nipples that feed babies.

Burnbaby · 19/07/2024 19:33

If I was a child I would be embarrassed my grandma.
Call me a prude all you like but I like my privacy.
I always get sun 30 minutes a day for my vitamin D and take a supplement rest of year. Plus my psoriasis loves the sun and I’m willing to take the risk.

NiceCutRoundDomeDormice · 19/07/2024 19:32

It's really not good for your nipples to get sunburnt

I’ll ask again - if topless sunbathing instantly equals sunburnt nipples, why aren’t there millions of men in agony with this every summer?

Swipe left for the next trending thread