Family expecting us to pay as we’re ‘high earners’

Say you're not paying, keep saying it if you have to. It's not difficult.

I had a similar type thing with my (ex)sister regarding entitlement. When my Dad was alive he used to help out her and her husband regularly. When he died I told her that would stop as my Mum and I did not have the money to pay for their stuff as well. I lived with my parents to look after them and I also had a full time job. My SS (shitty sister) and her husband both worked full time. I suggested they might try tapping up his parents for money, but they claimed they didn't have any. His parents lived in a council house (all bills etc paid for) and both had good occupational pensions. They had more disposable income than we did. I eventually had to give up my job to look after my Mum for the last 15 years of her life and still they wanted money - "you can sell some shares" was one option put to us. There were very few and only worth a couple of grand. Because we lived in a relatively large 4 bed house it was assumed (wrongly) that we had pots of dosh. We were in the classic house rich, cash poor situation.

After Mum died I became very ill and ended up in hospital (3 months) and a care home. I couldn't sit up, never mind walk, but they wouldn't wait for me to recover enough to go to the house and retrieve my belongings. When I asked why, SS said "it's my money and I want it NOW" meaning the sale of the house. I ended up with my record and CD collection sans record player and a few pictures which a couple of my friends were able to get for me before my (now ex) cousin got a house clearance company in to empty the house.

It doesn't matter how much, or little, money you have there is always someone who wants some or all of it. My SS got half of everything, house, shares etc even though she contributed fuck all. I bought the new kitchen appliances and TV when they went kaput and any other things that needed replacing or buying to make things easier for Mum but I expect they are all at the bottom of a landfill now along with 99.9% of all my personal possessions. No great intrinsic value but irreplaceable sentimentally.

I took extreme steps to distance myself from my family and moved 250+ miles away to start my new life. I wouldn't recommend it to everyone otherwise the extremities of the country would get a bit crowded. The good thing is they don't even know I've left the care home, much less where I am now.

You have to decide whether you want a relationship with these members of your family or are happy to cut them off. That will determine your next course of action - either tell them to go to Hell or discuss the situation in a calm way and let them know you won't be bank rolling their social lives any longer.

Good of you to be generous with other people's money there - don't you agree that being "treated" shouldn't be assumed by anyone and these family members were astonishingly rude and entitled to have expected their meals would be paid for?

They do seem quite entitled, yes. But it's worth having a conversation before getting angry about it. I don't understand the extent of rage and outrage expressed on this thread (no comment on the OP who has explained her feelings in an understandable way - it's more the responses that I fund surprising in their vehemence)

help out with childcare or cut the grass if they have spare time but not spare money?

Not really - people lead busy lives, and we don't see each other that often. I just don't recognise these family dynamics from my own family though. People seem very hung up about not being taken advantage of - my point is that most people give or take depending on their circumstances and different points in their lives. If someone feels that they are being treated unfairly, then have a conversation first rather than ending the relationship. Why fall out with people especially family before you give them a chance to put things right? I'd be mortified if a family member thought I was taking advantage of them - I'd want to know.

@PreesHeath I think it's nice to treat your family if you can Do the less well-off members of the family - help out with childcare or cut the grass if they have spare time but not spare money? Do the well-off members of the family not deserve a treat too?

Move, change mortgage broker and never pay for anyone again. Choose to eat at modest, low cost establishments when eating out when you visit each year.

My sil (dh's sister) is like this. We were away skiing once (paid for by us) and she sat down with her adult dd in the most expensive restaurant on the mountains and ordered the whole menu with champagne. When it came to pay she said "Omg I need to be rescued!" She called dh who was on the other side of the mountain so couldn't come, she then called her ds who bailed them out.

Nothing has changed, dh is kind and generous and she pulls at his heartstrings. We have separate accounts so it's up to him but it actually puts me off seeing her.

Good of you to be generous with other people's money there - don't you agree that being "treated" shouldn't be assumed by anyone and these family members were astonishingly rude and entitled to have expected their meals would be paid for?

It wasn’t arranged by OP - she said in her second post. She likely would expect those inviting her to be able to afford it, given that they chose it.

It doesn’t sound like she will be going out for meals with them again.

I just don't understand how you went to an expensive restaurant with people who clearly couldn't afford it, watched them order starters and mains without raising the question of cost, watched them order a lot of alcohol without saying something about the cost and then watched them order desserts and whatever without raising the issue of the cost.

If they would normally just have a main, why didn't you say when they ordered starters "Have you lot come into some money?" When they ordered bottles of wine why didn't you say, "Have you seen the price of a bottle here?"

If they always expect you to pay, why do you continue to go out for a meal with them?

I don't think it is on. Although a collective salary off 200k is high, even for London, you should be able to enjoy a meal out without the financial pressure.

Do any of them own their home outright? In theory they do have money and it's just tied up in assets. They can't plead poverty then. Money isn't straightforward anymore. An average salary doesn't go very far and a lot of people on paper look like they have good salaries, but haven't managed to get on the housing ladder yet, unlike their parents on lower salaries woth a mortgage paid off.

My brother is on a lot of money and he likes to pay a lot, but we all chip in for meals and Christmas.

After pulling a stunt like that they richly deserve to be humiliated.

It is a very difficult and complex dynamic. There's almost guilt at having achieved a level of financial security unthinkable for family/some friends that is similar to survivors guilt. My DH was a free school meal kid living in a council house who worked his way up from nothing and has had an amazing career. He never brags or discusses money but he has had this from family and friends ranging from expectations to bail family members out of significant debt (when we had our own family responsibilities) to many, many times where he has settled huge bills for meals/bar tabs. There is almost a level of entitlement that is so distasteful, it's just assumed because he has money it's their right to take advantage. DH is sanguine and very generous - he loves his family. It's me that gets pissed off.

After your 2nd post @Spotlightdeck I think it is really sad that your family obviously discussed between them that you would be left to pay. Proof is them all ordering 4 courses. Someone proposed the meal, chose the restaurant, invited you, all the time knowing that you would be tricked/pressured/embarrassed into funding their night out.
I wouldn't blame you at all for going lc. I do hope you pay for your own bill at the bar in future. Then sit back and watch them scramble as it dawns on them all that they have to pay for their large meal.

I think this is a spiteful, jealous thing to do - I would take some time and distance myself from this toxic relationship - nothing to be gained from continuing it.

Yes and when we said no - she huffed for a couple of years! We were assertive over a large sum of money and it resulted in a lot of unpleasantness that we could've lived without (whether we are well off or not we found it upsetting) - not sure we'd have been so firm on paying for a dinner and after standing my ground with my family (eventually after putting up with too much) I lost contact with my siblings - so I totally get the OP and her dh being reluctant to stand their ground - it feels like a small thing to fall out over but when it continues you have no choice - but ultimately you pay a big price. Family dynamics can be very toxic.

I've known people totally fall out with friends for no reason when they've found out how much they earn. They've got a massive inferiority complex and that the friend who was previously liked and taking a completely different attitude to them purely on the basis of salary. It was a male competitive thing and it upset the perceived pecking order (higher earner was 10 years younger and just bought a bigger house).

Your assumption about someone earning over 100k being educated, assertive etc is fine but it doesn't take account of just how unreasonable the other parties might be.

We've had this - think it started when dh took a job with a Government dept that published all salaries over £140k. We live in an expensive area (big mortgage) - we have a nice life but when sil thought we should be handing over a large sum of money to pay off her mortgage, we honestly didn't have it, nevermind it has affected our relationship

OMG, your SIL seriously thought you should pay off her mortgage?? Insane!!!

This is how I would handle it. I wouldn't say anything but I would do this.

Make sure you and your partner order last.
and before you order, ask the waiter to open a separate bill for the both of you.

Before the end of the meal, pretend to go the toilet, and settle your bill and keep the receipt.

When the main bill comes, it won't come to you because you paid already.
While they are all looking at you, tell them you've paid for your share already. Your food is not on their bill. Then you can up and leave. "lovely meal, take care everyone, we must do this again."

It is bizarre behaviour from the family. Is it possible to not catch up with everyone at once and just see one or two at a time every few weeks? Meet up for a coffee and cake only or invite them around for tea? Maybe if there’s less in the group and a low-cost activity you won’t be stuck paying a huge bill.

Report the mortgage advisor, don't go to anything with the family members , none of my family members are aware of money in or out of my household. They wouldn't behave like this if they did but may make remarks on stuff we do .just because you earn well doesn't make you responsible for everyone .

There is a world of difference between taking someone out and "treating them" for their birthday/anniversary etc. and being expected to pay for everything and everyone all the time.

The size of their salary is irrelevant. Just because you perceive someone to have that sort of income doesn't mean they have to spend it on you. They may have financial commitments that are unknown to anyone else. They may support different charities/sponsor animals and or children, have a massive mortgage and household overheads, be paying off student debts etc. etc. Presumably they didn't get these highly paid jobs by accident and had to work and study hard to do so.

Personally, I find it embarrassing if someone tries to grab the bill and pay it every time, so to force someone to do so would be unconscionable.

Some do, some don’t. Same as lower earners. I’ve known confident and assertive people have a complete personality transplant when in the presence of family members, having been conditioned to accept that dynamic.

All you have to do is say you won't be paying for everyone's meals and drinks. Do that the first time and nip it in the bud. If you start a precedent you make it harder, but it can still be done.

If family fall out with you over a meal and drinks they didn't care about you anyway.

That still doesn't change one fact - how do such high earners not know how to deal with this?

It’s trickier when it’s family- with neighbours, acquaintances, even friends it’s easier to say bye and not look back but cutting ties or making things extremely awkward with family isn’t easy!!!