To think this is scandalous yet in plain sight because the patriarchy has no shame

well this wont work if you are on any kind of top up benefit due to low wages, as you cant have more than £6K in savings, which then leads to a point where you are saying that only the wealthy are allowed to have children. Are they the only people who can raise a child to be a decent human being?

@Yalta she can choose 50/50 contact

I would devastated if my child didn’t live with me full time. I don’t think that’s the patriarchy, I think it’s my biology.
I rather wonder if it might be the influence of the patriarchy that makes women feel that being a mother is somehow not valuable and that raising the child you gave birth to is unfulfilling?
Just a thought I’ve had since becoming a mother that I feel I’m not really supposed to say out loud, please don’t jump on me!

It’s worst when they lie and don’t pay. I had this for years. Life was tough for us - really hard at points, and he didn’t give a shit. Thankfully my dd has nothing to do with this shameless arse now she is an adult.
i have no idea why the government are not keener to sort out this mess - start taking away passports and driving licences when they don’t pay. Instead we leave kids in poverty.

So how many women are 100% certain their husband wants to have a baby with them before getting pregnant?

And I used husband deliberately because I can't understand why anyone thinks it is a good to idea to have a baby with a bf then complain he won't pay

Women are the only ones that get pregnant so if you are not willing to raise the baby yourself don't get pregnant

Nothing prevents divorce or separation but something can be minimised

And as usual it is the children not the parents who suffer from adults decisions

Yes, he does pay for them when they stay with him. And clothes them. And takes them on holiday. And buys new phones. But, even so, I think 15% is a bit pathetic.

Good advice - think like a man! Also, think long term. As children get older, they appreciate higher earning mothers! And, appreciate mothers being around less (a bit more freedom). And, if married, on splitting remember his pension fund.

Is he not paying for them when they are staying with him?

Well the current situation might deter women from having children with whoever Willy nilly. The OP’s whole point is that it actually does very little to deter men from having children with whoever Willy nilly. Is there any particular reason why you think it’s only women who should be deterred? Men biologically are capable of creating a lot of one-parent families much more quickly than women are, and also have a much greater track record of doing so, so might it not be logical to focus any deterrent strategies at least equally on them?

@SummerTimeIsTheBest but a woman can abort a baby after she lay down with him?

My new partner pays 15% towards his ex wife. He has the children for about 1/3 of the time. Whenever he grumbles I just say 'well, it only just covers a food bill for two teenagers' or 'that's only double what I pay on violin lessons'. To be fair to him he is a decent man and contributes much more than that, paying for lots of activities and holidays. But, really, just 15% of income? Having children takes up most of my income!!

The minimum a completely absent father should pay should be £1000 a month.

@Naunet men do have to pay though. It's would be better financially if women chose 50/50 custody

Awful comment. The ‘father’ has choices too you know, condoms/vasectomy/abstinence. Once he has sex with a woman, especially unprotected, he takes that risk and basically accepts that a baby may result from two minutes of fun. He got his willy wet and now he needs to pay.

Im wondering why you are not using U.C. to pay for the 80% of childcare for nursery? This limit on this as a benefit is very high for a single parent.

Yes the equalness of parenting is not equal and woman come out of this less favourably on many counts - pension, career, solo time

I would push for more negotiation for more time spent with dad

Investigate your pension contributions fully, making sure you are putting as much as possible and if it lowers your net wages then more the better

which then leads in to this - see how much pension you can put away to lower your wages and use the tax loophole

put in a U.C. application for childcare cover if you are earning less than £50k - check entitled to website

Its how males have set up the system, so use it like a man would

Does that divorce statistic just mean in 62-70% of divorces, women start the divorce process? It doesn't account for the reason for divorce? Because I'd be surprised if 62-70% divorces were happening because of women choosing to walk away from an ok but not perfect marriage.... I can imagine a lot of cases where the man is cheating, financially/emotionally abusive, just plain lazy and not contributing to the marriage, and as a result the woman feels they'd be better off divorced.... so they probably don't have a financial plan for post-divorce, because they are only divorcing due to unacceptable behaviour on behalf of their spouse.

I don't have any stats so might be wrong, but of the handful of divorcees I know personally, all were due to infidelity or shitty behaviour on the male partners side!

When my child was young and her father fucked off I tried claiming money. He told them he wasn't working (or claiming benefits 🤔)
I sent them a pay slip, the work address and phone number and the photograph they requested.
His boss said he'd never heard of him.
6 months after he died, I received a letter from them asking if I was interested in pursuing him for debt 🙄
(On reading this I have to wonder what BoJos child maintenance bill is 🤷🏻‍♀️ and whether he pays that willingly )
OP it is disgraceful that you are OK to run a house, work AND pick up the nursery bill but your child's father can claim poverty and only afford/be made to pay far far less.
The system is fucked.
I acknowledge both men and women can find themselves in this position, but it is women on the whole who are left holding 'the baby' and struggling financially.

It generally IS a woman's problem though as they tend to be main carers of kids.

And as someone said above most women want to keep their kids with them. There is actually nothing stopping a woman walking away, leaving kids behind and not paying cms. They also have that choice

The system is really shocking! I didn't know anything about it until reading on here. And people seem to justify it with "women want to look after kids". Well, I'm sure most do, but surely they're entitled to the ability to earn a living too! Even if kids are in school, income is often massively impacted. The system definitely needs revamping. I feel for everyone struggling with it on this thread x

That's a good strategy and that's how I used my child free time, but my ex was abusive and horrible so I didn't want the children there any more than the court insisted they had to be and they eventually refused to go for even their court ordered time because of how he was with them. And I quite rightly supported that.

The CMS are a joke. My case is arrears only now as my daughter is 22 and my ex owes thousands. Anyway, he finally paid in a measly few quid a couple of months ago and the CMS kept it for themselves!! They said that the system had automatically allocated the monies to his unpaid charges (the 20% extra the NRP pays on top of the maintenance) as that was the oldest debt!!

So, now, I’m not only fighting him for money but them too. When he does actually deign to pay in anything I have to watch out for the CMS nicking it as they deem their charges to be higher priority 🤬🤬🤬

They grandly say that they care about the welfare of children but they don’t, they really don’t.

I totally agree with you. If I was in charge 🤪 I would change the CMS contribution for children under reception age from non-resident parents as being a minimum of the cost of providing 3.5 days of nursery care in the local area. Each local authority could determine what the average price is in their area. A non-resident parent would have a pro rata reduction if they are providing the childcare one or more of those days. There would also be pro rata reduction if the family is entitled to free/subsidised childcare. It would actually need to be paid and the non-resident parent could set it up through the payroll system. Any amount left owing at the end of the tax year would be picked up in the tax return and would be subject to interest and penalties like tax is.

Equivalent arrangements would apply for school age children for before/after school care and school holidays.

I do think that if CMS affected men equally, this is how it would have been set up.

Exactly. And if they wriggle out of paying or "can't pay" (due to magically no longer needing to work or deciding to be a stay at home parent for their next partner) then CMS could secure a charge over their property for the debt, like they do with council tax. Or it could be a prison sentence for non payment like it is with council tax. If it was seen as important there are lots of mechanisms that could be used

If hr's paying the CMS amount without fail whats the issue?

What exactly do you want?

Money that he hasnt got?

Teaching, nursing, anything shift related, corporate jobs all require all or some of the things I listed. That's just off the top of my head. It's not about "standard of living" so much as fairness of opportunity. My ex fucked off with ow. We do the same job but he now earns more than me because he is unfettered by childcare and once he's paid his CMS, to the penny and no more, that's him done. New laptop needed? I pay maintenance. New hobby requiring fees and kit? I pay maintenance. Growth spurt, adult sized shoes and clothing, school trip related to GCSE..nope, all from the same set amount.

The little amount of money that men appear to want to contribute towards children makes me constantly depressed about the male sex. I am the only divorced woman I know who isn't struggling and it is partly because my ex had the children for 50% of the time and I was able to work at a high level. Now they are older, the children (young adults) have gravitated towards me, but that doesn't impact on earnings. So, when getting divorced, don't fight to have the children more than the ex - use the time without the children to build friendships and work. It is very tough at the beginning letting the children go, but it does prevent poverty further down the line.

My advice does not hold if the men are abusive.

It's all a symptom of the power imbalance within society; the men generally have the money and allow women to do all the underpaid or unpaid care work. Every time I see a woman taking a teaching assistant job, I now see it as the state taking advantage of women.