To think this is scandalous yet in plain sight because the patriarchy has no shame

The point being it is difficult for NRP to get 50/50

It has got better but it still isn't the automatic assumption and is very difficult to do it RP is against 50/50

Often when NRP go to court to get 50/50 the RP stops all contact so it can actually reduce contact in the short term which puts many NRP off as seeing their children 30% is better than risking RP stopping all contact

Not talking about adequate and fair maintenance, Im against the view that in separated parents one parent should pay some ridiculous amount determined by a RP rather than a % of income that it is now.
A % is the only fair way to ensure every NRP pays a share of their income.
A % means they can also house and feed themselves and their children when the children are with them
If we say NRP has to pay 80% of income or a flat rate of £800 a month this in the first instance put the NRP into having not enough left and in the second instance may be great for high earners but be more than low earners earn.

I understand for Mums who have been left and have NRP doing no care and no involvement. The system doesn't seem fair. But it has to be a system that works across the board.

CMS does tend to go after easy pickings (NRP who pay and see their kids) and ignore the totally absent NRP and that does need addressing

Other than for the very wealthy, family Court is primarily self represented in. It's rare that people pay solicitors unless it's part of divorce proceedings.

The normal process is that the person who applies pays the application fee (used to be around 200) then the forms are completed by each parents and anyone else with relevant input. It's set up to be self represented in, as by nature the majority of parents who end up there don't have much money.

I'm not really sure what your point is. If a dad doesn't want to pay for half the child's expenses, nor does he want to go to court for more contact, why does he need a bigger pot for the children? He's not willing to spend it on them as it is. Swap around the words mum and dad as it suits, the point remains, the child is half your responsibility one way or another.

But the NRP has far fewer day to day running costs AND can work more to meet the mortgage or rent payments since they have no childcare issues.

@Againlosinghope that "whatabouttery" ALWAYS happens on these threads. This is about non-resident parents of either sex, though lets not kids ourselves about the balance, who pay little or nothing and certainly not a fair contribution.
Access arrangements for NRPs who want more contact is a separate thread. Even if the RP is limiting access, that doesn't absolve the NRP of needing to contribute adequately in the meantime.

Dad also needs a home to house the kids through. You can't have the kids overnight if you life in a flat share so both parents need homes and 2 homes will cost more than one.

You do realise court costs mum too. So both parents have less money for the kids. Before you go to court you go to mediation. Generally the advise to dads is to keep offering/asking for more time until mum feels happy with this. If mum doesn't budge then when you get to court the court says mum having majority of time is status quo and they don't want to change the status quo.
I'm not saying that there isn't bad dads who don't do their fair share financially or in care but there is also bad mums who block decent dads.

I know many dads who have spent thousands through solicitors and court and got no where other than a smaller pot of money to support their kids in life

@Gogogo12345 my very real children live in the very real world in a way that was possible because their WC parents worked hard, went to uni, qualified in professional jobs and now are in the MC bracket. Of course I know the things I listed aren't essentials but I'd be a pretty piss poor parent if I COULD give those things to my kids but didn't as I'm ring-fencing only 15% of my pay for them, as their Dad does. I am no way denigrating those who cannot, but I absolutely will denigrate largely absent parents on decent salaries who pay the bare minimum or less than that because they know the RP will pick up the slack, because they are the ones actually seeing the day to day reality of the kids' lives and their interests, hobbies, friend's birthday parties, inadequate coat or whatever and pay for it. Or maybe I should do that - match my contribution to their Dads and live accordingly, limiting their life experiences and chances out of spite to their dad so its fair on me?

No court will be able to mandate care. The only way to ensure equity is where 50/50 isn't in place and by that I mean full 50/50 not the token version some men do, is to take half the cost from their wages

Yes men should pay, however there needs to be a deterrent to stop people having children with whoever Willy nilly

I had 4 dc with a man who abused me and refused to wear condoms ever and raped me so. Don't know how what kind of 'deterrent' would help with that. Abusive men and whily in their ways of entrapping women and keeping them under control for years.

And I did escape, and now this price of men who doesn't work pays not a single shiny penny.

If there was an American style system that forced men to pay regardless that would probably be the best deterrent because the men who don't pay are selfish fuckers so hitting them where it affects them personally would be the only viable strategy.

Same. I earn more than I did when I was single, and then I had a nice flat and could afford to eat out and go on fancy holidays. That is not the case now I'm the single mum of teenagers!

Yes but a 1 bed flat would cost less than the house I need for 4 people! 3 kids use more utilities, eat more food, require more lifts - most single parents do prioritise their kids over themselves - obviously the post was hyperbolic - but I don’t buy new shoes and not pay for school dinners!

id have a lovely life if I was single in a small flat on my wage - but I’m not because kids!

Is the world for middle class people somehow less real? What are you saying - if single mothers aren't on the poverty line they should be bloody grateful?

Pointless pedantry. Wasting energy squabbling about hyperbole when obviously the point is that mum doesn't have 85% of her money or time left for herself and dad does.

And in the real world many kids living with 2 parents dont live in " good catchment," areas. They don't all have gardens at all never mind a decent size or a bedroom each. Most of that is for middle class families

Okay, it was obviously hyperbole. I didn’t starve or walk round naked for 15 years, but nor did I walk round in designer clothes or drive a new Audi like my Ex. 🙄

I live in a bigger house than I'd need if there was just me (and the dogs) so mortgage and bills are obviously higher, and yes, basic cost of living for me and my kids takes up my entire salary. I get some money from my ex otherwise I wouldn't have money left for myself, or for things like taking the kids on holiday. Like I said, he's not stingy. Plus I get Child Benefit. But the amount I spend on my kids is easily my entire monthly salary.

But you still would spend SOME money if yourself Even if it was 10% you and 90% kids. Not 100 % kids. That's my point NOBODY spends 100% on kids. You'd still need to pay for the 1 bed flat and bills

Surely women should pay less if they are doing more of the childcare?

It happens the over way around too. My SD lived with us full time after her mum decided to move abroad. She has not paid maintanace (or contributed ANYTHING to her daughters upbringing from early teenage years) even though she has a decent job and owns properties(abroad). When SD lived with her mum her dad paid regular maintanance (and more).

NRPs don't have to worry about living in a good catchment or safe area. They don't need a decent sized garden, or even a bedroom for each child. They don't have to have a stash of snacks food constantly being replenished. They can work additional hours with no restrictions. When my kids do spend a rare week with their dad I spend about £25 quid on my food for the week, run the dishwasher and washing machine once only, use only minimal power. As I said upthread, if I ringfenced 15% of my income for the kids...even if I excluded my mortgage and utility costs from that, they'd run out of funds way before payday

@Thewheelweavesasthewheelwills he thought he would walk you down the aisle? He really is completely unaware of the negative impact he has had on your life.

Dreadful.

Well done for cutting him out.

You probably have all the answers you need by now anyway. And now you make your own living, safe family.

If I’d only had myself to consider I could have bought a one bed flat instead of a three bed house. I wouldn’t have eaten toast for dinner every night so my children could have a proper meal. I didn’t go out for years, I’d rarely buy underwear and footwear, but most of my clothes were given to me by my (spendaholic) bf. I barely spent a penny on myself for years during the childcare years.

@OceanStorm me 😂there was nothing they didn't own a house etc. My mother stayed living in the city we lived in at the time and sent me to live in her tiny rural home town with her parents. But she would visit twice a year and take me for a few weeks over Summer and Easter

@ghostyslovesheets what a prick! My parents divorced in the 90s IDK if you still needed someone to be at fault then.

@BlastedPimples I met up with him twice, once his step daughter was there and she made it sound like the sun and moon revolved around him. How he had been the best dad ever, taking them to Disney, always being their, etc it was really hard to listen to. After a few years of telephone calls I dropped all contact. It wasn't good for me. Like really wasn't good for me. I got no straight answers out of him. I don't actually think my mum was a complete 'innocent' in everything but the only question I asked and that he refused to answer was why did he leave me? I told him why him and my mother split up was none of my business but why he left me was, what had I done. He couldn't or wouldn't answer

I haven't spoken to him in about 5 years now. We live hours apart so it's not like I bump into him. I think one of the funniest things was he thought he would walk me down the aisle, I didn't invite him to my wedding!