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Original poster

To feel really gutted for England tonight?

210 replies

Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 01:28

This Euros tournament has been quite a crazy ride for England and it’s a tournament I’d rather forget (partly because of the way that Gareth Southgate and the team have been treated by the British press and their own fans).

I think that whilst the team has loads of fantastic world-class players, they haven’t consistently played well as a team, either in the run-up (e.g. in the Iceland or Bosnia games) or in the tournament itself.

I really feel that the team only managed to get through to the final because of moments of individual brilliance (Jude Bellingham’s goal, Ollie Watkins’ goal, Pickford’s absolutely top-notch goalkeeping).

I’m also quite disappointed with elements of Gareth Southgate’s management even though I still really admire his leadership style, his achievements as England manager and his attitude. Southgate has - undeniably - produced consistently excellent results with this team, but they haven’t yet won anything with him, and ultimately they will be judged on winning. They have got close to winning on two occasions now with him, and he and they obviously care for and respect each other, but I don’t think that’s enough anymore (feels harsh to write that).

I think it’s time for the team to find a new manager and go in a new direction, but equally I think it will take time for a new manager to find their feet with England and I worry that the new manager will not be able to create the same sort of culture that Southgate did, which I think really helped to shape this current team and make them so successful.

I know that there can only be one winner in the Euros - just like in any sports competition - but I just really feel for the England players. I’ve followed them for a few years now, they come across as a really nice team and I feel really sorry that it didn’t work out for them tonight.

Focussing on the final tonight, Spain were clearly the better team tonight - and throughout the Euros. Having said that, I do feel quite sad that the England players couldn’t achieve the win they wanted. They obviously really really wanted to win, and I think the team’s performance has overshadowed the individual achievements and excellence of the England players that I mentioned earlier in the post.

I know there will be many more tournaments to come, probably for most players in the team as most of them are still very young and are full of potential, but they had so much expectation riding on them and they came pretty close to winning, having got to the final.

They should feel really proud of themselves for getting to the final and coming close to winning, but I know that they would rather have won than been runners up.

OP posts:
Original poster
Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 13:33

Miley1967 · 15/07/2024 08:31

Yes I feel terribly sorry for them especially Gareth and Harry Kane as it's likely the younger ones will get other chances.
Also think it's time for Gary Linekar to go.

Why has Gary Lineker got to go? He’s a football pundit who is pretty good at his job, so what’s he got to do with anything? Unless you mean he needs to go because of the comments he made about the team (which I also disagreed with)?

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Original poster
Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 13:29

DanielGault · 15/07/2024 08:08

If they weren't gutted they'd be in the wrong job.

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Exactly!!

I disagree @UtterlyOtterly - they clearly are very resilient. They have to deal with frequent disappointments in their regular club games and then deal with more of the same - but much more intensely - when they play for England. They are obviously resilient enough to manage that, otherwise they wouldn’t be able to show up for the games and play the way they do.

They have been in two finals now under Southgate. Whist that is a fantastic achievement, it’s obviously very disappointing for them, because it’s a reminder of how close they came to winning. That not only requires boatloads of resilience but also - more helpfully - helps to build it, especially in the environment that Southgate has created.

OP posts:
flapjackfairy · 15/07/2024 12:47

pikkumyy77 · 15/07/2024 11:56

Should the second place team be executed? Discuss!

Well they might be a bit more motivated !

flapjackfairy · 15/07/2024 12:45

Well they might look a bit more motivated !

maudelovesharold · 15/07/2024 12:29

socialdilemmawhattodo · 15/07/2024 12:01

But look on here at the quite aggressive posts about kids in boarding schools. One of my DC had to attend boarding from a young age for a very different reason and it was awful. Culturally (England) - so much commenting about class/boarding.

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Yes, I wasn’t advocating it, just wondering if it has anything to do with their success. The former USSR and Eastern bloc countries used methods with children picked out for intensive ballet and gymnastics training etc. and were very successful. I’m sure that the students paid a heavy price, though.

socialdilemmawhattodo · 15/07/2024 12:01

maudelovesharold · 15/07/2024 08:15

I don’t know a lot about it, but does anyone think Spain’s football success is anything to do with their strong ‘Academy’ structure? I was hearing last night that Yamal has been with Barcelona since the age of 7 and at their boarding training school from age 12.

But look on here at the quite aggressive posts about kids in boarding schools. One of my DC had to attend boarding from a young age for a very different reason and it was awful. Culturally (England) - so much commenting about class/boarding.

LetsGoFlyAKiteee · 15/07/2024 11:59

England winning would've been undeserved. I know its happened and doesn't work like that but Spain have beaten France,Germany etc to get there and not lost or drawn a single game..

Impressive to get there and get to the final but just not enough to get it over the line..

ilovesooty · 15/07/2024 11:57

TansySorrel · 15/07/2024 11:48

They did well to get to the final and lose 2-1 to a team who've won 4 times. Nothing to be ashamed of.

The best team won. Spain won all their matches, negotiated a much tougher draw than England and were the best team throughout the tournament. They were deserving winners and if England played them every day until Christmas I think the result would be the same.

I think Southgate will probably resign and I think Kane might need to reconsider his international future.

pikkumyy77 · 15/07/2024 11:56

Should the second place team be executed? Discuss!

ilovesooty · 15/07/2024 11:53

JamSandle · 15/07/2024 11:28

It's just football.

So?

placemats · 15/07/2024 11:52

England did well to get to the final. They were beaten by a better team, Spain.

dollybird · 15/07/2024 11:48

KnickerlessParsons · 15/07/2024 02:28

England didn't lose. They came second out of the 20 (?) teams in the tournament, not to mention all the others that didn't make it that far.
If your child won a silver medal at the Olympics you'd be delighted.

It's all the media hype and the "coming home" crap that winds everyone up that makes you feel like a loser. Coming second is brilliant. If Wales came second I and the rest of the Welsh nation would be over the bloody moon.

This ⬆️

TansySorrel · 15/07/2024 11:48

They did well to get to the final and lose 2-1 to a team who've won 4 times. Nothing to be ashamed of.

DramaLlamaBangBang · 15/07/2024 11:46

GPTec1 · 15/07/2024 11:41

I think if we really had so many world class players, we'd win more/play better.
We always seem to have this "Golden Generation" yet perform so badly, despite so many different managers over the years.

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And so many different players! Maybe what we have are good players with world class teammates? Pickford is outstanding. Without him we would be nowhere near the final, which says a lot.

GPTec1 · 15/07/2024 11:41

Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 10:40

I think it was me who said we had plenty of world-class players and I stand by that - e.g. Harry Kane, Jude Bellingham, Cole Palmer, Bukayo Saka, Marc Guéhi, Jordan Pickford… I think even some players who weren’t picked this time can be considered world-class (e.g. Marcus Rashford).

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I think if we really had so many world class players, we'd win more/play better.
We always seem to have this "Golden Generation" yet perform so badly, despite so many different managers over the years.

Isthiscorrect · 15/07/2024 11:35

I do feel sorry for them. However I grew with those who said they just didn't inspire as a team.
At no point yesterday did they play like this is the greatest day of our lives. There was no joy or freedom. Too much back passing and set pieces. Distinct lack of urgency.
But they did come second and that's a really terrific achievement.

mondaytosunday · 15/07/2024 11:34

Spain played better. Simple as that.

JamSandle · 15/07/2024 11:28

It's just football.

CoffeeCantata · 15/07/2024 11:23

EmmetEmma · Today 06:37
Who might be better at the job - Southgate has been the best England Manager in decades if we are going by results

I find this dissing of him odd and unpleasant

I agree. I confess: I'm not a sports fan, and know naff-all about football, but I am patriotic and really get cross with people in the press making out that England is rubbish. We're not rubbish - we're just not the best in the world! We got to the final and didn't get thrashed 6-0 by a superb Spanish team - there's no shame in that, just a lot of disappointment.

Well done to the team and to Southgate. We've done better under him than I remember with previous managers.

WillimNot · 15/07/2024 11:20

It's also worth pointing out the Lionesses under 19s team won 10-0 last night.

World class players? I don't agree, maybe on the cusp of being like Watkins and Palmer, Saka is close.

Sadly, we don't encourage our premier players, if you look at Arsenal, Liverpool, Man City and United, Chelsea and Newcastle, for decades they buy players from mainly Europe to make up a credible team.
That's why, when it comes to international football, it's difficult to select world class players, because most home grown talent is stuck playing in lower leagues.

If you look at the cup where all leagues can take part, there has always been teams in leagues 1 or 2 who have beaten premiership or Championship teams and it's called a shock result.
Why? It shows that when these lower league players get to show what they can do, they can and do outclass the far better paid bunch in the higher leagues.

We need to invest in grassroots football, if we want a good international team, then start building international worthy England players who can be selected. It's time for limits on player numbers bought from abroad. All we do is train them up to beat us!

LetsGoFlyAKiteee · 15/07/2024 11:11

Shouldn't have to go a goal down to start playing which what we have done more or less every knock out game..why Harry Kane kept starting is beyond. Know he is Captain but if he isn't performing sometimes time to drop.

The subs actually have been spot on but always brought on to late. Yesterday was better timing wise. It was always going to be tough against Spain anyway given how they've performed this tournament and how England have...

I dont think he should be sacked but reckon he'll walk

Meepmeeplittle · 15/07/2024 11:10

England men never seem to play well as a team, ever. But if a mystery.
Perhaps they should hang out a bit more at the England women’s training and find out what it is that brings them together so well as a team…

Meepmeeplittle · 15/07/2024 11:09

Well, you feel how you feel but they were pretty shit and got to the final mostly through sheer luck!

DramaLlamaBangBang · 15/07/2024 11:03

When I used to watch football more avidly in the 90's England could only dream of getting to a final. It was quarter and semi finals all the way. Southgate has got them to 2. I do think England just aren't as good as the other teams in Europe, and haven't been for decades. We had a ridiculously easy group which we struggled through, and we're lucky to beat teams in the easy draws for the knockouts. Spain looked like champions the whole way through. I don't know why England fans and the press think we deserve to win all the time. Second place is a massive achievement for a fairly ordinary team from a country that hasn't won anything for 58 years!

Original poster
Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 10:40

GPTec1 · 15/07/2024 07:15

England lost, they have never won a major tournament in the modern era, compare to other European nations who have multiple world and Euro cup wins.

Someone said "we have plenty of world class players" do we really? one or two perhaps.

We have to face facts, we are (relatively) poor at football, a large nation, huge number of people to pick a team from, yet we cannot win, regardless of the manager (Southgate is a world class manger) or the players.

I think its the arrogance that we think we invented the game and have some sort of "right" to these tournaments, then there is the money in the game, football, seems to attract kids/families who love the idea of becoming millionaires rather than being the very best.

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I think it was me who said we had plenty of world-class players and I stand by that - e.g. Harry Kane, Jude Bellingham, Cole Palmer, Bukayo Saka, Marc Guéhi, Jordan Pickford… I think even some players who weren’t picked this time can be considered world-class (e.g. Marcus Rashford).

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