Is DN rude or is this ok?

As the child is OK with everyone else I think it's just her choosing to be rude to her Aunt and Uncle, no need to make up excuses for her.

Or more likely she's a brat! Not everything can be magiced away by an ism.

@TeenScreenQueen and @PerkyMintDeer

Do you think OP should ask her brother sensitively what’s going on?

Because if it is selective mutism and it’s happening in other aspects of the child’s life then maybe the parents should be guided gently towards talking to the SENCo of the school.

And if it’s just rudeness then they might be inclined next time to ask their daughter to say hello!

The thing is...maybe they don't know themselves.

I'm ND and was a SENCO/SEN Teacher in a Referral Unit for years.

I know from years of personal and professional experience that both of my friend's kids are ND (and I communicate with them as if they are, which works out successfully) but my friend still suspects they are just a bit "quirky" or "slow developers" as does most of the family. It's all "just ignore Teddy not talking/making eye contact/having a meltdown every time he leaves the house, he hates all people just like his Daddy!" (Dad is also very late diagnosed ND) and "I know most other kids can talk and walk and are potty trained by now but Lily is just really lazy and doesn't even attempt to stand up or say hello haha. Lazy bones! She'll get there when she gets there!"

They're older now but there have been clear signs for years that have just been dismissed as "they're perfectly healthy, that's just Teddy and Lily being Teddy and Lily".

If the OP's family are saying "Cat got your tongue?!" to DN, there's a big chance that they have no idea that there is/could be an additional need because, if she IS selectively mute, that would be an awful approach.

It's difficult in today's society. We're all so scared of offending each other. I don't feel I can't tell my friend that both her kids have SEN and that I am really concerned in particular about the youngest, she'd take it very badly.

Even when a parent does notice something unusual about their child's behaviour and they say, "have you ever seen how Fred repeats the same word over and over? I'm a bit worried it's a sign of something like autism..." friends tend to say, "oh no...I'm sure it's nothing at all! Ava used to say willy a hundred times a day at that age! He'll grow out of it!"

One of my family members was told directly by their step mum (nursery teacher) that they felt their step grandchild should be assessed for Autism due to her tiptoe walking, hand leading/flapping and other things she'd noticed (she went with the obvious physical signs which could be observed). The family took it really well, were grateful and the child is indeed Autistic and doing far better in school now adjustments have been made. But by that point she was six and signs were apparent from at least two...I really admire step-mum in this case and the parents who didn't take it personally, they just wanted their daughter to get what she needed in the long-term. It takes courage to be upfront!

The easy answer there is the parents probably don't know. I don't think most of us with experience of it are suggesting the child has been diagnosed with anything. We just recognise the behaviour as being very similar to situational mutism and therefore not necessarily a kid being rude. The parents probably just think their child is a bit shy or whatever and are just muddling through not being entirely sure how to deal with it.

And of course it's not definite the child does have anything going on. Maybe they are just rude. But as there is a possible other explanation I'd always err on the side of caution and just try to be nice about it.

I just don’t understand why the parents wouldn’t say to their brother or son (OP’s DH) ‘just so you know, we think Katy has selective mutism which means blah…’

Then OP and DH would know how to approach the child to make her feel comfortable.

Perhaps OP doesn’t know??? She is clearly not aware what selective mutism is, but will now hopefully educate herself. It’s particularly important to do that as a teacher.

Yes my son has been diagnosed. Having read OP's account of her niece's behaviour it sounded very much like my son's behaviour, identical in fact. Many other OP's have come along to suggest selective/situational mutism too. My son was able to talk to some children but became completely mute when spoken to by adult relatives, neighbours, friends.
It broke my heart when people saw him as rude because he was going through hell. I can't be sure OP's niece has SM but she could have been describing my son at family gatherings.

I would just cut out the awkward conversations/questions altogether and ask GPs or her parents the questions. If she's ND then you're helping her and if she's doing it for attention then you're taking it away from her and she'll get bored.

Do you find you're often the people telling the kids to be quiet? It might be that she sees you both as the fun sponges. Not that you don't fully have a right to tell them to quiet down - but just seeing it from her perspective.

OP hasn’t said her niece has selective mutism. So why are you conflating her with your son? Is your son diagnosed?

My son has selective mutism. I'm so glad that family members didn't stop making an effort with him, didn't stop saying hello to him or serving him food.
It's because they continued to treat him with love, kindness and patience that he eventually overcame his anxiety and was able to start talking to them.
He absolutely did not become mute for attention.

My cousin was exactly like this as a child, but he also wouldn't speak to grandparents, he would speak to us his cousin's thigh when adults weren't around, but it was the eighties and no one really knew much about neuro divergency, his mother was always a bit overbearing with him or speaking for him etc, and it was issued out down to that. He also had a really limited set of foods he could eat and heaven forbid if they touched. He also struggled with social relationships at school etc but is an excellent musician and had no issue with stage performances.
Seems obvious now right, and he's been diagnosed as autistic as an adult, but we didn't know then.

I would ignore it but also stop making any effort with her. At the moment her silent treatment is getting her attention from everyone so stop that attention.

If they come over, let her parents serve her food. Have drinks on the table, her parents can give her what she wants. Don’t ask her questions.

Don’t go out of your way to say hello to her, just say a general hi to everyone.

Selective mutism?

It sounds to me like her parents are aware of it and are trying to encourage her to talk to you and your DH. I'd suspect there are a lot of discussions going on in their family that you're not part of, and her parents are probably hoping she'll grow out of it.

It doesn't actually cause you any problems and she plays nicely with your DDs, so I'd just continue on as you have been. And not judge a 7 year old too harshly! (If she'd told you to F off - that would be rude!)

Yabu.

She's 7. Give her a break. It is unusual and no doubt there's something behind it. You don't know what is going on with her. The answer is a bit of compassion, not taking it as rudeness and expecting her parents to be tougher on her.

I have the same experience with my child…engaging with children and safe adults without issues. But the sixth sense and the ability to read people and shut down around them when he senses that they are judging is unreal. I have seen in it in practice many times including with his own grandfather (while adoring his grandmother and speaking to her, but not him - these are my parents by the way). I absolutely trust him when it comes to reading people and I think it’s a great thing to have in life.

I was like that as a child. I remember feeling absolute terror if I was out with my mum and she'd see someone she knew. I never felt comfortable with making small talk with aunts and uncles. I was fine with my parents, siblings and gran.

I have ASD. I wasn't diagnosed when I was a child. Whoever mentioned eye contact, I had no problem whatsoever making eye contact. I'd easily do so whilst saying no to being told to say hello or whatever to someone.

I wasn't rude, I was very well mannered and was a stickler for rules. But I just couldn't do that.

It's very bad mannered.

That's down to her parents, because they're letting her get away with it.

Maybe just say hi and bye and don’t expect anything back. It is strange and can feel personal but there’s nothing you can do about it but perhaps take the pressure off her and don’t try to engage her in conversation if she doesn’t want to.

You'd be surprised how many teachers haven't heard of it or dealt with it. My son's reception teacher had the opinion that he must be forced to speak abd punished if he didn't. This goes against all the advice and massively increased his anxiety and mutism.

This my eldest was like this until about 10. It wasn't anyone's business so no I didn't divulge his private medical details. 🤷‍♀️

He debated was well capable in school but certain people or situations he just couldn't address. He is now older and absolutely well able.

He also has an amazing ability to read people, so I do sometimes wonder if he saw things I didn't. As there was a bit of a pattern of them being the more traditional judgemental people he was unable to engage with.

If you are a teacher surely you are well trained in children who have reasons they won't converse?

Yes they can. It’s not like she was giving you the L. She was looking at your or staring into your eyes she was acknowledging that you where talking to her. She just couldn’t/wouldn’t talk back.

Could she have selective mutism? My son has it and was simply unable to talk to many people (including family members) for years. He wanted to talk but actually couldn't. He said it felt like his throat muscles were clamped shut. I'd have to answer for him. It is a phobia of speaking, a anxiety condition.
I have to say I feel absolutely heartbroken seeing you and all the other PPs saying she's rude.
If it is selective mutism it's an extremely difficult condition to have. My son's earlier years were very lonely and isolated because of it.

Maybe your questions are just boring or the child found you ill informed 🤷🏻‍♀️