First Labour f up

Are you sure they had more babies just for the child benefit? Seems a pretty stupid reason to me..
People only worry about how many babies they can afford when they've already got money - careers that can be impacted etc. If you're already poor you might aswell just get on with it and have the family you want.

Well, the figures show that lifting the two-child cap would be the most effective way of lifting children out of poverty. Doesn't sound like a fuck up to me.

I'd say banning of new oil licenses before sorting out ensuring we can generate our own energy from cleaner sources is a big fuck up. Now we will be beholden to price increases again as we have to import. Like why couldn't you build your solar farms get it working and then ban ne wpil licences I mean ffs thats just common sense surely

Not to mention all the tax on selling that oil we will lose out on I hear it's something in the region of £10b

This is incorrect. You CAN receive child benefit for a third child. I know because I recently had my third child and can confirm that I receive child benefit for all three.

The cap they are talking about is in relation to UC and child tax credits (neither of which I have ever been eligible for anyway)

I don't want to derail the thread but early release from prison is a Tory policy. It was introduced a few months ago.

Labour have merely proposed to extended it, because the prisons are in a truly desperate situation (prisons will be at full capacity in weeks if nothing is done) and there's little else that can be done at short notice to try and relieve enormous and immediate pressure.

I work in the justice system and I don't know anyone who thinks it's a great idea, but the Tories had literally decades to prevent it reaching crisis point and didn't (as with child poverty). Labour have had a week! So it seems in the absence of time to do anything else they are doing what they can right now.

As with all things go look at the data ... https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/families/bulletins/familiesandhouseholds/2022#families section five.

Have class sizes got smaller? That'd be a reflection of people deciding to have fewer children.

Is having fewer children a bad thing?

There is no cap on Child Benefit. You can claim for however many children you have!
The cap is on the child element of either UC or tax credits!
It was reported on BBC news that 1.6 million children. Living in poverty because of it.
I wish the news would use the correct terminology.

This was a comment made by John McDonnell. One of the main Momentum MPs. That he holds this view is hardly surprising and anyone who thought that he would sit quietly on the back benches is deluded.

Kier Starmer has indicated that this is something that could be done when the government are in a position to do so but they are not able to do so at the moment. John McDonnell is just trying to force his hand. This is hardly a Labour cock up. The hard left were never just going to sit quietly and the Prime Minister is fully aware of this. I expect to see more of this but it really doesn't mean that Labour are in trouble.

It doesn't affect child benefit - when they talk about a 2 child cap, they are talking about people who get universal credit and working tax credits. You can still get child benefit for a third child.

But fortunately they are in power for the next 5 years.

So your horror stories are just laughable. I mean how can anyone be worse than what we’ve had.

I think an expansion of free childcare for working parents would be good. I would also support an tax free allowance per kid, say 5k.

A fuck up indeed, and it's only just starting.... cancelled all new oil licences so we're all going to be poorer, colder and subject to the whims of tyrants, until green energy is fully up to speed.

Batten down the hatches folks the journeys going to be rough. And its always those less well off that suffer the most.
DELUDED is what they are! Actions without fully understanding the consequences.

By your logic nobody should ever have children as you are only ever one disaster away from needing to rely on state support.

Well, we have had a discussion here and at the end of it all it was a neither one way or the other.

So we put the telly on and all had a nice cup of tea, 🙂
and a biscuit.

Which is a simplistic and childish argument tbh. I used to think like that in my early twenties. Then I grew up. I realised that not everyone fully realises the consequences of their actions, people are products of their upbringings, shit happens to even the best prepared people. I only had the one because it was all I could afford, but I was never caught out either. So I won't cast aspersions on others.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow Child Benefit is NOT capped at 2 children.

Are you saying that you had relatives that had extra kids so they could get less than 20 quid a week for them???

Exactly, nonsense!

"Discuss"

No, shan't. You can't make me.

Instead, I'm going to discuss "Bad Boys 4: Ride or Die", because I saw it yesterday. It was distinctly average, not a patch on the first one, but and improvement of the 3rd.

I laughed, even chortled at parts of it, found parts of it deeply weird, and got bored by two overlong action scenes.

Martin Lawrence appears to have more than two children in the film, but lives in an absolutely huge house despite a police officers salary. So he doesn't seem to need any additional benefits.

Shit, I'm not talking about that am I.

There was a giant albino alligator in it. Someone got et. This was considered a good thing.

How on earth can you construe a perfectly valid internal debate about policy as a fuck up? Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the child benefit policy, the Labour government hasn't actually done anything yet.

Are you just a bit short on analytical skills and desperate to find a reason to criticise?

Yes it sounds like an absolutely terrible idea to try and reduce poverty amongst children who never asked to be born in the first place 🙄

I am glad that this is high on Labour's priority list. It's a cruel and pointless policy which hasn't had the intended impact anyway.

(Like many Tory policies!)

I mean, if people are willingly having children purely for the £25 a week, I think they have bigger problems personally. Kids cost a hell of a lot more than £100 a month ...

Nope, not yet, have I seen a Labour Govt F up. Mostly because they've not been in charge for long enough to F up anything yet.

I'm sure they will at some point, after all I've yet to ever meet the Perfect Person, mostly because none exist. Meanwhile I'm quite happy for this Labour Govt to schlepp along and make a sow's purse out of the pig's ear that is the basketcase UK of today.

Oh god, I was going to say this.

Also it’s not a fuck up, some MPs think one way, some another way. No policy has changed although it might in the future.

Personally, I believe it’s society’s responsibility to take care of all of its citizens, including those whose parents were maybe financially irresponsible in deciding to have them. Whatever the circumstances, the children have been born, they need taking care of now they’re here and deserve all the chances in life of everyone else.

Everyone should limit their families, but if you can't afford to give your children a decent life then that should also inform your choices, not assume someone else will support them. And yes shit happens.