First Labour f up

There’s not much point in scrapping the 2 child rule while the Benefit Cap is in place. Otherwise, for a large number of people, you’re giving with one hand and taking with the other.

Firstly u don’t see this as a fuck up. No decision has been made it’s just a discussion.

There has been research. The policy did not stop people having more than 2 children

This sounds made up - do you have some reliable data on this?

I haven't read the full thread.

There isn't a 2 child limit on child benefit.
There is on universal credit.

If anyone reading this is expecting their 3rd (or more) child, you can add them to your existing child benefit claim.

To quote one Boris Johnson, this is an inverted pyramid of piffle.

Poverty is about how much money you have. The previous government knowingly pushed hundreds of thousands more children into poverty, by cutting benefits at a time of rising costs.

Sorry but I think this is BS too. All the povo's are spending their money on fags and drink? Wtf like? This is crazy.

So the government website says UC per child is £286 per month. £333 for the first child. The government need to focus on policies that promote economic growth and work ethic so fewer people need to claim state support.

Capping the UC element to 2 children may deter some (and we need people to consider affordability when planning children - that is basic responsible citizenship and parenting). However, once the child is here, they have to be taken care of, so I would favour policies that promote economic productivity and deter planning for children one can't afford but ensure children are properly supported once here. How to do that is what the government need to work out

Refusing financial support for kids already here is not humane.

That is why I was asking that poster for a link, or source of their information. Where did you find yours?

What happens to the total benefits cap of whatever it is now if a family has more than two children and the rules on number of kids changes?

In some parts of the country where housing benefit makes up a large part of the UC entitlement and you can claim for as many DC as you have won’t the total amount be capped anyway if no one in the family has a disability which exempts them?

I’ve phrased that very poorly but I wonder if anyone can explain. Eg if the total cap is £26k a year but you can now claim for extra DC bringing it up to £30k won’t the maximum in benefits you can get still be £26k?

All going to what you expected? They've not even been in government a week.

Personal responsibility only takes you so far. Do you rely on the NHS? Rather than an American style private system? Do you use state services? Do you feel ok with being left on your own when chronic illness hits because 'personal responsibility'? An over reliance on personal responsibility leads to a breakdown of society. We should all be looking out for each other to an extent. I'm not in UK but you seem to do that well enough. It would be an awful thing to see people just turn their backs on everyone.

Poverty is largely caused by how people spend their money rather than how much they have.
If you want to help families with more child benefit, give food and clothing vouchers. This will be a great help
to people struggling and makes sure that those with addictions or other issues spend the money on their childrens welfare.

Lifting the cap would improve living standards.

There’s a family with four hungry kids. Those kids appear at your door asking for money for food.

Do you
a) Give them a bit of money for food or
b) Keep the kids hungry cos their parents should’ve been less feckless.

It’s always about the kids.

And yet working people, for several elections now, have been more likely to vote Labour than Conservative. Higher earners are also more likely to vote Labour that those on lower incomes.

(For balance; unemployed people are also more likely to vote Labour; it's retired voters who are more likely to vote Conservative or, this time out, Reform),

Labour do it to keep the proles down and voting for them. They aren’t going to go and work towards a career of any sort when they see the parents living off the state.

It would be better to spend the money on education, social care, health education, improving living standards.

Did the 2 child cap have any effect on whether people had another child or not? I do know that the number of children living in poverty has risen though.

The releasing of prisoners early to make space has always been a thing, not a labour only policy I remember them doing it when I was a probation officer. The prisons are full, where are they going to put those that need to be behind bars for public protection. They are not releasing violent or sexual offenders early.

Depends what your attitude is to personal responsibility, I guess. I don’t think government support should enable feckless, chaotic, inadequate parents to breed indescriminatly. The rule was brought in to stop welfare spongers grabbing more money per month than decent, working families. I think if you need to rely on handouts, you don’t get to have more than two children.

Exactly. The fact that the cap isn’t being removed is a major gripe of mine. It would remove a million kids from poverty instantly.

Wtf? You're obviously missing out on the dream lifestyle there so. Not Labour's fault if you don't take them up on their generous offer 🤔

Can’t help but to think we should be supporting people in work who want to have more kids or are single parents. Providing tax relief and actually free childcare with expanded hours is going to be more useful alongside an expansion in housing.

Say you are a single mum on 30k with 3 kids. Wouldn’t say 25k tax free and working hours childcare be useful to you? A government note says that 40% of people affected by the 2 child tax credit cap are not in work. If you can’t work because you are a single parent with 3+ kids then proper free childcare will help a lot and you keep more of the money you earn once you do get into work.

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/universal-credit-and-child-tax-credit-claimants-statistics-related-to-the-policy-to-provide-support-for-a-maximum-of-2-children-april-2024/universal-credit-and-child-tax-credit-claimants-statistics-related-to-the-policy-to-provide-support-for-a-maximum-of-two-children-april-2024

The Labour dream no? Their virtuous welfare state clients can shag, smoke, drink and fritter their days away supported by the taxpayer. The poor shmucks grafting away will just have to pay more and more tax.

It was in their manifesto wasn’t it?

Personally I would say throw more money at working parents. More subsidies for childcare if parents work.