"Prime Minister Keir Starmer recommits to £3 billion a year of military support for Ukraine until 2030/31 and for as long as needed"

We aren’t “giving money” to Ukraine, we are funding our own arms trade.

And this. A cynic might point out it's fairly good advertising to have your weapons used in an actual war. As the UK's arms exports almost doubled in recent years - primarily due to instability in the world - it's also true that war is a business. Sadly.

That's so incoherent I can't even tell what point you think you're making. Doubt it's much of a loss, mind.

There is absolutely no evidence that Putin will “move further West”

His stated aim is to reclaim a part of Ukraine that was previously part of Russia / USSR

I don’t believe that hype anymore.

I’m also unsure what this pledge means anymore, I am of the understanding that the money just goes to British companies who make the weapons that are then given to Ukraine. So if that’s the case, it’s odd. We aren’t “giving money” to Ukraine, we are funding our own arms trade. I don’t know what to make of it all. Theres definitely some jiggerypokery going on

Government spending always lists the top price but it never actually costs the government that.

They spend £3bn with companies like BAE for weapons. BAE pay tax on profits - and employ people. Those people pay tax in their salaries and spend money. They pay tax when they spend it.

By the time the money has flushed through the system, the net cost to the government is never anywher near the £3bn initially spent. Same with lots of other spending announcements.

Or we could not spend that money, damage relationships with NATO, especially relationships with the EU and the US and let Putin do WTF he likes.

Seems like good value, to me.

I guess that’s great, until you think about how he’s going to fund it.

I find this reassuring, we should be doing this it’s in our own interest as is an increase in defence spending.

Be grateful that it’s just costing us billions of pounds, and not thousands of our citizens’ lives.

Your either haven’t read the thread or this is an iffy post. It’s been explained why several times already.

Do you see any parallels between the current situation in Europe and the run-up to WW II?

And if we look weak to Putin, we also look weak to others. We absolutely need to support Ukraine. The Chinese will be keeping a close eye on how the rest of the world sticks together. For them it will be Taiwan.

Out of interest, why?

Also all of this. It’s because I hate and fear war that this is, unfortunately, a war I have to support to prevent worse.

You really don’t get this, do you?

As with all international aid, our govt provides backing to Ukraine because it is massively in the UK’s interests to do so.

They’re not just doing it out of the goodness of their heart. Do you not see this?

I am generally very anti-military, would happily cut spending for day-to-day stuff, loathe all the pomp and ceremony which I feel glorifies war, etc, but even I understand that we have to spend this money on Ukraine.

If Putin wins in Ukraine he won't stop. Why would he? He already believes he is at war with the West, he is spending enormous amounts of money on influencing elections on social media (all those Reform bots on Twitter have mysteriously disappeared now), if we don't show support of Ukraine he will invade further. This isn't some distant war, it absolutely will affect us if Putin wins.

It’s not as simple as supporting Ukraine.

It’s about proving to Russia that invading another country is unacceptable - because Russia won’t stop at Ukraine. Any reading of news of the South Caucasus or Poland or Romania or Moldova will tell even an idiot that Russia does not respect other countries autonomy and borders.

No. We can’t afford it. But equally we can’t have Russia continually sending missiles into NATO allies either or annexing parts of other countries. We lay down in 2014 with Crimea, with Abkhazia, with South Ossetia, with Transnistria. If Russia doesn’t take it by force, then it takes it through disinformation, through putting their own people into power, and through coercion. There is not a single one of Russias neighbours (except maybe Azerbaijan - who have their own wealth and security guarantees to protect them with a country Russia would never pick a fight with) that does not fear a Russian invasion.

We had to make our stand at some point and tbh we should have done it over a decade ago.

Edits - for some frankly shocking typos!

Ok sure. It’s less about the support and more about then spend. But you do you.

I think you are mistaking labour for the Green Party op

@Missingpotatocroquettes Putin bombed a children’s hospital two days ago. We shouldn’t give £3bn to Ukraine, we should give £300bn. Putin needs to burn in hell.

Supporting Ukraine is first and foremost the right thing to do morally, but it is also in the UK’s security interests. Russia already invests huge amounts of money trying to influence the British public through an incredibly comprehensive disinformation effort, and its leaders have spent years buying assets both economic and human here. They think they’re at war with us already, trust me if you speak Russian and watch the state TV or read the more popular blogs there they fundamentally believe that to be the case.

If Ukraine falls, we’re all next.

And is less than the Conservative party wasted on PPE that got burned, or HS2.

I am anti-war; a total pacifist. I hate the UK selling arms around the world. I am strongly opposed to our meddling in conflicts in the middle east etc.

But even I concede that Ukraine is different. Putin is an existential threat. If Trump gets in, NATO will be weakened. Europe needs to stick together and strengthen its defences.

Agreed. Some people are seemingly incapable of seeing the wider implications. This support is necessary.

OP, since you appear to be quite alarmed by big numbers, you should perhaps put this in context by realising that this £3 billion is 0.25% of the governments total spend in the year.

We do send aid to Gaza.