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AIBU?

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To worry that this is a major threat to our democracy?

110 replies

Worrydon · 09/07/2024 14:23

https://themuslimvote.co.uk/.

Ever since learning about the targeted campaign of threats and harassment against MP Jess Phillips, it has become clear that those harassing her, along with other similar independent MPs are being pushed into power by sectarian politics.

many of these independent MPs have gotten in purely off the back of being pro-Gaza, despite not offering any solutions to local issues. Our MPs should represent local and national interests, not exclusively one foreign agenda piece.

This website (the Muslim Vote) encourages people to put in their post code, and it then tells you who to vote for based entirely off their stance on Gaza.

This appears to be allowing religion and sectarianism to corrupt our democracy, and I worry that not enough attention is being paid to this threat.

The Muslim Vote - We are Pro-Democracy and Anti-Genocide

Muslims and all people who stand for justice agree that the current political class does not represent us. Peacefully, politically, and persistently we will vote them out.

https://themuslimvote.co.uk

OP posts:
DancingPhantomsOnTheTerrace · 09/07/2024 19:03

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 19:01

Let me rephrase that. This is a Christian country. It’s not in the countries best interest to allow Muslims who are indigenously from other countries to vote based on their religion

Shall we quiz people at the polling station - make sure that their rationale for voting a certain meets with your approval?

Mummy2024 · 09/07/2024 19:03

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 18:57

I think people should vote for whoever they want, it’s everyones right in a democratic nation to do so.

That doesn’t mean I don’t think some organisations/political parties shouldn’t be heavily criticised. I seriously object to anyone/any party who thinks that priests should have the legal right to instruct their congregation on how to vote.

Edited

Someone posted that a local doctor sent them a leaflet instructing them how to vote.... is that OK or no?

My labour councilor candidate instructed me to vote Labour.... doesn't mean people have to do it....

My union sent me material instructing me how to vote....

Why are they allowed but religion isn't?

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 19:03

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 19:01

Let me rephrase that. This is a Christian country. It’s not in the countries best interest to allow Muslims who are indigenously from other countries to vote based on their religion

Erm are you seriously suggesting that British citizens who happen to be muslim shouldn’t be allowed to vote? A religious test? Goodness me.

TooBigForMyBoots · 09/07/2024 19:02

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 18:55

Yes but we don’t have actual priests that normal people visit x number of times a week legally telling them how to actually vote. It is leveraging a personal spiritual relationship between priest and congregation for political means and allowing religious authorities to press gang captive audiences into voting the “correct” way. It’s sinister that anyone thinks that should be removed.

We had pastors in Christian churches urging a Leave vote on Brexit because it was what God wanted.🤷‍♀️

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 19:01

TeenagersAngst · 09/07/2024 19:00

@TooBigForMyBoots yes, I worded that badly. I meant that British society js largely 'irreligious' tolerating multiple faiths. For that reason I do not believe specific religions should influence politics.

Same, it’s divisive.

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 19:01

Let me rephrase that. This is a Christian country. It’s not in the countries best interest to allow Muslims who are indigenously from other countries to vote based on their religion

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 19:01

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 18:55

Only the indigenously British should be allowed to vote

Thats funny, Farage wouldn’t be able to vote would he? He’s of German heritage isn’t he?

TeenagersAngst · 09/07/2024 19:00

@TooBigForMyBoots yes, I worded that badly. I meant that British society js largely 'irreligious' tolerating multiple faiths. For that reason I do not believe specific religions should influence politics.

Mummy2024 · 09/07/2024 18:58

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 18:55

Only the indigenously British should be allowed to vote

Good god, here is it.... the indigenous British are long dead my dear... what shall we do with all the none indigenous babies born tomorrow, make them stateless??? What a joke. You expect everyone to pay taxes but unless your grandfather 10 times removed was born on British soil, no vote for you! I doubt many of us would be able to vote if this became policy, you included 😆 🤣 😂.

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 18:57

I think people should vote for whoever they want, it’s everyones right in a democratic nation to do so.

That doesn’t mean I don’t think some organisations/political parties shouldn’t be heavily criticised. I seriously object to anyone/any party who thinks that priests should have the legal right to instruct their congregation on how to vote.

Mummy2024 · 09/07/2024 18:56

Echobelly · 09/07/2024 18:48

I'm Jewish and I have no problem with this. If people wanted to vote on the Gaza issue they are entitled to do so.

Also I don't like this attitude I'm seeing in some places (not implying it was @Worrydon 's intent though, I don't believe it was) that Muslims are some sort of political threat in this country. Many people, especially right wingers in the US (and we've seen this from DH's cousins there) are trying to push a divisive line that Muslims are this massive political force in the UK and this has to be bad for Jews, which I find deeply disingenuous.

I completely agree! I've seen many conversations between Jewish and Muslim people on here and they've always been extremely supportive of each other and share similar issues regarding discrimination.

It's being used to bait the population nothing more.

Danceinthenight · 09/07/2024 18:55

Only the indigenously British should be allowed to vote

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 18:55

Hatfullofwillow · 09/07/2024 18:35

Democratic norms? We've got unelected bishops sat in the House of Lords.

Yes but we don’t have actual priests that normal people visit x number of times a week legally telling them how to actually vote. It is leveraging a personal spiritual relationship between priest and congregation for political means and allowing religious authorities to press gang captive audiences into voting the “correct” way. It’s sinister that anyone thinks that should be removed.

TooBigForMyBoots · 09/07/2024 18:54

TeenagersAngst · 09/07/2024 18:52

There's a reason why we have separation of Church and State. Religion has no place in politics.

We don't in the UK.

Mummy2024 · 09/07/2024 18:54

Worrydon · 09/07/2024 18:37

It’s much more than that. It’s not just encouraging people to vote, but telling them explicitly who to vote for. If you type in your postcode, it gives you the specific MP to vote for based purely on whether they voted for a ceasefire or not.

I’d also be against any other religion dictating to their followers which candidate they should be voting for.

They didn't March them down to the polling office or send them threatening notes....

Whilst I sort of understand your sentiments on election swaying so to speak, it happens on many none religious websites also, people vote for a candidate they normally wouldn't vote for to gain the result they want.

I don't think it's unreasonable to vote for a candidate that wants a ceasefire either, I'd be more inclined to vote for anyone who voted for one and I'm not religious.

TeenagersAngst · 09/07/2024 18:52

There's a reason why we have separation of Church and State. Religion has no place in politics.

Echobelly · 09/07/2024 18:48

I'm Jewish and I have no problem with this. If people wanted to vote on the Gaza issue they are entitled to do so.

Also I don't like this attitude I'm seeing in some places (not implying it was @Worrydon 's intent though, I don't believe it was) that Muslims are some sort of political threat in this country. Many people, especially right wingers in the US (and we've seen this from DH's cousins there) are trying to push a divisive line that Muslims are this massive political force in the UK and this has to be bad for Jews, which I find deeply disingenuous.

WindsurfingDreams · 09/07/2024 18:46

Half of Mumsnet seemed to be voting purely on trans rights issues or whether or not private education would cost them a little more.

Hatfullofwillow · 09/07/2024 18:44

TeenagersAngst · 09/07/2024 16:30

I didn't see any of those groups harassing voters at polling stations.

Trump supporters stormed the Capitol building in an attempt to overturn an election.

changefromhr · 09/07/2024 18:42

Muslims not voting: "omg, look at them not accepting democracy, not integrating!"

Muslims vote: "omg, look at them voting! Sectarian voting! It's a threat!"

We can't effing do anything right can we.

Hatfullofwillow · 09/07/2024 18:40

VolvoFan · 09/07/2024 18:30

America is also funding the Middle East (not just Israel). Is there a prominent political organisation over there like 'The Muslim Vote'? like there is over here?

CAIR?

TooBigForMyBoots · 09/07/2024 18:38

People voting how they wish is not a threat to democracy. They ate exercising their democratic right.

Those who intimidate and threaten politicians and voters are breaking the law and must be made to pay for that. There's a huge difference between the two.

Worrydon · 09/07/2024 18:37

BakeOffRewatch · 09/07/2024 18:26

That’s absolutely not what the website is doing. https://themuslimvote.co.uk/. mainly encouraged communities to get together and actually talk about voting as they’re mostly disengaged, such as asking people to ask their family members to register to vote. The suggested candidate isn’t based on one policy, it’s what the community have fed up, that’s if they have.

I’ma bit concerned by the posts on MN that fear monger about British Muslims acting together as a community, in this instance just to mobilise to get people voting and talking about it. It’s no different to any other initiative to encourage demographics, such as young people, to become democratically engaged.

It’s much more than that. It’s not just encouraging people to vote, but telling them explicitly who to vote for. If you type in your postcode, it gives you the specific MP to vote for based purely on whether they voted for a ceasefire or not.

I’d also be against any other religion dictating to their followers which candidate they should be voting for.

OP posts:
Hatfullofwillow · 09/07/2024 18:35

Chickenuggetsticks · 09/07/2024 16:42

They want to remove the spiritual influence statue from legislation because it’s “archaic”, apparently your Imam/Rabbi/ priest telling you you are going to hell unless you vote for x party is not archaic. That is definitely an assault on democratic norms.

Democratic norms? We've got unelected bishops sat in the House of Lords.

VolvoFan · 09/07/2024 18:30

Hatfullofwillow · 09/07/2024 18:26

Well, we're arming Israel at the same time as funding aid to both the West Bank & Gaza, so not absolutely nothing.

America is also funding the Middle East (not just Israel). Is there a prominent political organisation over there like 'The Muslim Vote'? like there is over here?

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