To like Keir Starmer?

You also get clarity around polling over voting intention motivation - get the Tories out outweighed just about everything else for both Labour and LD voters. And then there's polling from end of June around intention to vote tactically - around 20% overall but they are overwhelmingly Labour and Lib Dem voters. 29% of Labour voters said they were voting tactically; 39% of those voting Lib Dem.

And that's before you also look at the resources the parties themselves put into target seats, and the actual votes themselves compared to historical patterns.

There's far more evidence for the proposition that tactical voting played a more significant role in the election outcome than usual.

As with anything electoral you can never, ever know exactly what the motivation behind every vote was. So, like any other conclusion reached on voter behaviour, you look at the evidence and see what the most likely conclusion is.

“I asked you, on this thread, why you thought it was.
I’m pretty confident that if Starmer says the plans are ECHR compatible, then they are.“

@cardibach - Pannick will argue that singling out private schools only for VAT is discriminatory. Why only private schools and not other forms of education?
And within those private schools there are SEN kids or Jewish kids etc - so it is far from straight forward. And for some kids, private education was their only option because state has failed them.

If the challenge wins, I do not want to live in a country where Strasbourg is not respected. That much you agree with right?

Something that is quite refreshing after the election is that when you disagree with one of Starmer’s policies now, nobody calls you a Tory bot. Before the election, anyone disagreeing with Starmer’s policies on her got called Tory bot.

That’s the only good thing I can say about this election.

I agree Op. I like politicians who have had careers and earned their place.

I’m actually not embarrassed by British politics for once, when you look at Biden and trump and the mess in France, for once we look alright.

Aye, ok.
There’s no way to prove it either way. I’m able to extrapolate a bit from events when necessary to make sense of things. If you don’t want to do that, it’s fine.

Oh he is a proper grown up. He’s much more respectable than Bojo etc.

But rather unfortunately he will force his inflexible ideology on us.

All of this.

So, speculation, informed or otherwise

I don't disagree. But seats still are not votes.

Good for him if he's wealthy and capable. Would you want an idiot running the country? I couldn't care less about his background if he actually brings positive change and is able to fund it without a mass exodus of wealth generators.

Indeed.

1 in 3 of the people who voted chose Labour.

Less than 60% of adults voted.

So only 2 in 10 people who could have voted chose Stamer’s Labour.

Although he has a stonking great majority of seats, the fact that 2 in 10 people bothered to vote for him does mean that an itty bitty amount of votes is a fair assessment.

There was a referendum in 2011

Agree!

Remind me which our electoral system is built on?

And which system the Labour and Lib Dem strategies were designed around?

But they are all that matter in our system. He targeted, and got, the votes he needed.

I asked you, on this thread, why you thought it was.
I’m pretty confident that if Starmer says the plans are ECHR compatible, then they are.

Seats are not votes.

I do too so hopefully he will be a good PM.
A barrister relative knew him through work and thought quite highly of him.

What’s wrong with Rayner? Are you still hung up on the ‘scum’ comment? That was about Tory MPs, not voters, when they very evidently were acting like scum, so….

Yesterday I looked up the news online, and saw a bunch of stuff on specific policies being implemented, and it felt like a breath of fresh air. It wasn’t just yelling and having a go at people. They were actually working for the people. It felt positive.

This morning I’ve seen that Suella Braverman has flown to a conference in America to scream about ‘wokism’. Thank God she is unlikely to ever be in high office ever again. Unbelievably negative.

Agreed - i actually feel like the country is in competent hands - it’s a massive relief.

There is a whole thread on why taxing private schools VAT is likely illegal already. We do not need to rehash it. Breach of Art 1 and 14, likely. Is the act still directly enforceable in the UK, no.
Is it morally reprehensible to be a party that champions the HR act and then breach it knowingly, yes.
It is complicated. There will be challenges. I would be interested in Keir’s legal arguments, of course.

And only a small handful of people are homeless. Should we just say fuck them then?

Small numbers of people is how he’s getting away with the private school gig. That, paired with complete ignorance of the sector in general and large numbers of people who think everyone else should pay for their life/offspring.