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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To like Keir Starmer?

556 replies

Emmanuelll · 09/07/2024 09:02

Unlike Tony Blair, he comes from a working class background - his siblings would still call themselves working class.

As a very bright lawyer, he could have sought a path which made him rich quickly but instead chose human rights which isn’t an easy route to take and he’s defended ‘the little guy’ against corporations. He’s also anti-death penalty.

Ok, he’s a Sir, and I’ve heard people (perhaps not unreasonably) question why the leader of the Labour Party would have a title like that. But he earned it through work for the criminal justice system.

On the face of it, it seems as though he deserves a chance.

I would much rather have him as PM than a former Bullingdon club member who used to burn money in front of homeless people for the fun of it.

OP posts:
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HRTQueen · 09/07/2024 13:55

Icanwalkintheroom · 09/07/2024 09:37

YANBU.

Have found all his briefings so far refreshingly action focused, clear and free of party dogma.

I agree

Starmer is dedicated and hard working he doesn't have time for PR stunts or getting caught up in ideology

I believe he shall prove to be a very good PM

ilovesooty · 09/07/2024 13:53

LakeTiticaca · 09/07/2024 13:22

Many of us will be paying more "involuntary tax" when he gets his claws in. Just wait and see.
The only other 2 words I will say right now are Jimmy and Savile

Show quote history

And what would you like to say about those two words then?

Houseplanter · 09/07/2024 13:51

So strange how we perceive people differently.

To me he comes across as weak and slimy and makes my skin crawl a bit.

I'm also not taken in my his constant referrals to wanting to 'serve'. Does he bollocks. He wants status and power and the big bucks like all of them.

Will he be a good prime minister? I hope so, for all our sakes.

strawberryteacake · 09/07/2024 13:49

He seems like a genuinely decent bloke, which makes an astonishing change.

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:48

altmember · 09/07/2024 13:39

Do as I say, not as I do. But an extreme version of it.

Just one example:
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-65037136.amp

So he took the pension that was standard for his job? I don’t see any hypocrisy there, genuinely. Armed Forces pensions are tax free too. Most of the others have always been taxable - it’s just that the state pension alone wouldn’t have taken you over the tax threshold until Tories refused to raise the threshold and then did what they did to inflation…

Champagnesocialismo · 09/07/2024 13:46

Judge him on what he delivers. Impressed so far on the set up. V good

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:45

Viewfrommyhouse · 09/07/2024 13:34

What do you assume it implies?

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Oh stop being obtuse. I genuinely can’t be bothered.
Have it your own way. It was a random mention of a dead paedophile with no intention to imply anything. Happy?

tobee · 09/07/2024 13:42

SnowFrogJelly · 09/07/2024 10:01

YABVU. I think it's very dangerous to get warm and fuzzies for politicians

I like warm fuzzies

And warm and fuzzies can easily turn to cold and spikies

OP posts:
tobee · 09/07/2024 13:41

FinalCeleryScheme · 09/07/2024 09:58

If you read MN, Starmer can walk on water. And the Apostles in the cabinet are all shining beacons of rectitude, selflessness and humility.

The truth of it is that he and Labour generally are no better and no worse than any other ambitious politicians. I hope he’ll be sensible. And I hope he’ll admit his mistakes and failures. But that’s rare in any politician so it seems unlikely.

You must be reading different bits of Mumsnet to me.

Original poster
Emmanuelll · 09/07/2024 13:40

I've just found an article which says that he was criticised for failing to prosecute jimmy savile.

OP posts:
MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/07/2024 13:39

Viewfrommyhouse · 09/07/2024 13:34

What do you assume it implies?

Show quote history

I think if you're going to make a Jimmy Savile analogy you need to be crystal clear about what you are saying.

altmember · 09/07/2024 13:39

Do as I say, not as I do. But an extreme version of it.

Just one example:
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-65037136.amp

Champagnesocialismo · 09/07/2024 13:34

LakeTiticaca · 09/07/2024 13:22

Many of us will be paying more "involuntary tax" when he gets his claws in. Just wait and see.
The only other 2 words I will say right now are Jimmy and Savile

Show quote history

This is more revealing of you than him, isn’t it? And if it were an assessment widely agreed with, then he would not have won the election. Even the Conservatives realised that this did not merit sn attack.

Viewfrommyhouse · 09/07/2024 13:34

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:26

I didn’t say libellous. I said close to it. It implies something very, very unpleasant and also untrue. And you know it.

Show quote history

What do you assume it implies?

FredFredandFreddie · 09/07/2024 13:29

I wasn’t sure about him but I think the last few days his intelligence and emotional maturity seem to have shone through.

someone once said to me it’s important not to “love” your politicians because it can border on idolatry and we all know where that’s led to historically. I think this is a great point.

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:26

Viewfrommyhouse · 09/07/2024 13:24

What's libellous about their post?

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I didn’t say libellous. I said close to it. It implies something very, very unpleasant and also untrue. And you know it.

Original poster
Emmanuelll · 09/07/2024 13:24

LakeTiticaca · 09/07/2024 13:22

Many of us will be paying more "involuntary tax" when he gets his claws in. Just wait and see.
The only other 2 words I will say right now are Jimmy and Savile

Show quote history

What about Jimmy Savile?

OP posts:
Viewfrommyhouse · 09/07/2024 13:24

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:23

You’re showing your ignorance then. And possibly coming close to committing libel. Don’t you people ever learn?
And for the 18366483738293th time, taxes NOW after a Tory government, are t(e highest since the Second World War.

Show quote history

What's libellous about their post?

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:23

LakeTiticaca · 09/07/2024 13:22

Many of us will be paying more "involuntary tax" when he gets his claws in. Just wait and see.
The only other 2 words I will say right now are Jimmy and Savile

Show quote history

You’re showing your ignorance then. And possibly coming close to committing libel. Don’t you people ever learn?
And for the 18366483738293th time, taxes NOW after a Tory government, are t(e highest since the Second World War.

LakeTiticaca · 09/07/2024 13:22

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/07/2024 09:37

How does one "voluntarily pay extra tax"?

Show quote history

Many of us will be paying more "involuntary tax" when he gets his claws in. Just wait and see.
The only other 2 words I will say right now are Jimmy and Savile

Original poster
Emmanuelll · 09/07/2024 13:21

Araminta1003 · 09/07/2024 13:09

“I asked you, on this thread, why you thought it was.
I’m pretty confident that if Starmer says the plans are ECHR compatible, then they are.“

@cardibach - Pannick will argue that singling out private schools only for VAT is discriminatory. Why only private schools and not other forms of education?
And within those private schools there are SEN kids or Jewish kids etc - so it is far from straight forward. And for some kids, private education was their only option because state has failed them.

If the challenge wins, I do not want to live in a country where Strasbourg is not respected. That much you agree with right?

Starmer has said that children in independent specialist schools for SEN will be exempt (my dd1 would have been one of those- she’s grown up now). My dd4 wouldn’t be exempt but as I’ve already said, she’d probably have been able to go to the state school near me if the Tories hadn’t cut council budgets by 50%. The knock on impact of this in itself has been that children who need to go to specialist schools are being left to sink or swim in a MS classroom with not enough support.

I’ve seen parents saying that they intend to challenge the VAT increases but won’t that potentially cost even more than just paying it? I think if you really believe that something is legally wrong then challenging it is reasonable but some of these people also argue that their child would have to leave their private school due to VAT costs so it doesn’t make total sense.

I read a thread from last year where people using private schools were asked to say how much their household income is and for many of them, it was at least £100k, sometimes a lot more.

OP posts:
cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:19

Iffx · 09/07/2024 12:59

Oh he is a proper grown up. He’s much more respectable than Bojo etc.

But rather unfortunately he will force his inflexible ideology on us.

Show quote history

What inflexible ideology is that then?
Honestly, he’s criticised for changing his mind then criticised for sticking to stuff.

cardibach · 09/07/2024 13:18

Araminta1003 · 09/07/2024 13:09

“I asked you, on this thread, why you thought it was.
I’m pretty confident that if Starmer says the plans are ECHR compatible, then they are.“

@cardibach - Pannick will argue that singling out private schools only for VAT is discriminatory. Why only private schools and not other forms of education?
And within those private schools there are SEN kids or Jewish kids etc - so it is far from straight forward. And for some kids, private education was their only option because state has failed them.

If the challenge wins, I do not want to live in a country where Strasbourg is not respected. That much you agree with right?

If the challenge wins, then Labour won’t do it. I’m confident of that.
I don’t think it’s discriminatory to charge VAT on independent schools as they are a choice - there is a free system. If that’s failing, it should be sorted, not allow people with money to opt out of it and make all the rest suffer. Don’t you think that’s discriminatory?
It’s very straightforward. Schools which charge for an education that is provided free at the point of use are different from those who don’t. Fundamentally different.

TheCrenchinglyMcQuaffenBrothers · 09/07/2024 13:16

Emmanuelll · 09/07/2024 12:52

The thing about seats vs votes though - if it’s such a bad system why hasn’t any government moved to change it?

Why would they when they won an election on the back of it? That's true of Tory and Labour governments. It's only the smaller parties, who don't get a say, that have a vested interest in changing the system. Which is why the Lib Dems made it a condition of their coalition that there was a public vote. That was hashed though, it wasn't about PR.