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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To pay less?

61 replies

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 15:26

I did another thread some days ago about how our cleaner that we booked to do a deep clean of our new house and they did not do a satisfactory job. Doing a new thread as it’s a different question and not many will come back for the update I’ve just done

She said they work in pairs and would stay for as long as it took to do the job. £23 an hour each. I requested they prioritised the kitchen and the bathroom, particularly the toilet and the bath.

They arrived an hour late after running over from another job. She stayed for just under 1.5hrs before going home because they were ‘hungry’ and hadn’t eaten since breakfast. This was despite telling me they’d stay however late because they’d sorted childcare and so weren’t in a rush.

Now have a bill for nearly £70 for 1.5hrs of the two of them ‘cleaning’ my house. Our bathroom is small, 2mx2.5m max. They cleaned the bathroom walls (apparently there was loads of limescale), bath, sink and half of an IKEA wardrobe. The other half of it was dirty and covered in pet hair. They didn’t clean the toilet or the bathroom floor. There were two of them. Before they left, they said ‘we’ll come back tomorrow’ to DH. DH hadn’t booked them so just agreed, he was decorating and I was at work so nobody directly watching over them. I text her in the evening to thank her for what she’d done (before I saw how little they’d done) but please not to come back as we needed it that day, so I was going to have to tackle it myself in the morning instead

I’ve reasonably approached her and said we are dissatisfied with the service and she is refusing to budge on price saying they’d be working for less than the minimum wage. She has also said I’m lucky she hasn’t charged a late payment fee as we haven’t cleared the invoice 24hrs after the work was done.

Is it reasonable to pay them for 1hr each instead, or even just minimum wage for the time they were there?

I don’t know where I stand on it legally and don’t want to invite trouble given that they know my address- maybe overthinking here

WWYD?

YABU - you’ve got to pay the £70 and chalk it up to experience

YANBU - pay less / will comment

OP posts:
WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 19:49

She’s told me I need to pay by 9pm tonight otherwise there will be a late payment fee….

OP posts:
Witchtower · 08/07/2024 19:46

Sosorryliver · 08/07/2024 15:58

I've been a cleaner and it's not just business insurance, car with business insurance, travel time between jobs needs paid. I fthey didn't work the full 3 hours don't pay for it but I'd stump up for 2.5 and just write it off and write a shit review.

@Sosorryliver to be expected to be paid travelling time is absolutely ridiculous.
If it was the same employer then yes I agree, but to travel from client to client and you are self employed then absolutely not.

BlueMum16 · 08/07/2024 18:13

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:21

I don’t want to pay them for 3 hours / 1.5hrs each. I don’t think what they did was £70

So you think they worked 1 hr 20 each. They've charged you 1 hr 30 mins each.

I can't see why you are not paying them? You pay for the time they were there.

JoBoJoBo · 08/07/2024 18:05

When was the bathroom last cleaned if it was so bad they would have had to scrub it for hours ?.Also why would a wardrobe be filthy in the first place with pet hair.Maybe the house is never cleaned / hoarder so was hard work ?

FactoryResetNeeded · 08/07/2024 18:03

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:32

One half clean and the other half untouched.

That’s my point.
So the whole thing was dirty and covered in pet hair, in which case, if the place was that dirty, it really could have taken them that long to clean. I don’t think I could ever describe my wardrobes as dirty, in need of a dust -maybe, but dirty and covered in pet hair sounds quite a lot of work tbh so if the bathroom was as bad as they say it’s possible it did take them that long and they had no chance to do as much as you expected.

Skyrainlight · 08/07/2024 17:48

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 16:55

Do you think? Like what?

I guess the first thing that comes to mind would be keying your car. I'm not a scary aggressive type though so I don't know what else they would come up with.

HolyMolyMan · 08/07/2024 17:45

NewName24 · 08/07/2024 17:30

I think the point is, the very small amount of work they completed in that time, should not have taken more than a fraction of that time.
How can 2 people spend an hour in a bathroom and not even clean the toilet ? Confused

My cleaner manages to properly clean 2 bathrooms, a downstairs toilet, a kitchen, hallway and 2 landings, 2 sets of stairs, and a living room in under an hour. She is one person and doesn't charge anything like £23ph.

OP has said there was limescale etc....we have no idea what could have been completed in that time as we didn't see a before and after photo.

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:32

FactoryResetNeeded · 08/07/2024 17:23

Maybe if you post before and after pictures we could actually advise, it’s impossible to say they weren’t worth what they are asking if it was encrusted. How much limescale was actually on the walls?
I had to clean an aunts bathroom of limescale and I can tell you it took me forever, I’m talking a couple of hours each day for a week!

you said The other half of it was dirty and covered in pet hair
so the half they haven’t cleaned is that dirty? Or are you saying the half they cleaned is dirtier than when they started?

Edited

One half clean and the other half untouched.

OP posts:
NewName24 · 08/07/2024 17:30

HolyMolyMan · 08/07/2024 17:20

If they did 1 hour 20 mins each is it really worth arguing the 10 mins each?

I think the point is, the very small amount of work they completed in that time, should not have taken more than a fraction of that time.
How can 2 people spend an hour in a bathroom and not even clean the toilet ? Confused

My cleaner manages to properly clean 2 bathrooms, a downstairs toilet, a kitchen, hallway and 2 landings, 2 sets of stairs, and a living room in under an hour. She is one person and doesn't charge anything like £23ph.

FactoryResetNeeded · 08/07/2024 17:23

Maybe if you post before and after pictures we could actually advise, it’s impossible to say they weren’t worth what they are asking if it was encrusted. How much limescale was actually on the walls?
I had to clean an aunts bathroom of limescale and I can tell you it took me forever, I’m talking a couple of hours each day for a week!

you said The other half of it was dirty and covered in pet hair
so the half they haven’t cleaned is that dirty? Or are you saying the half they cleaned is dirtier than when they started?

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:21

HolyMolyMan · 08/07/2024 17:20

If they did 1 hour 20 mins each is it really worth arguing the 10 mins each?

I don’t want to pay them for 3 hours / 1.5hrs each. I don’t think what they did was £70

OP posts:
HolyMolyMan · 08/07/2024 17:20

If they did 1 hour 20 mins each is it really worth arguing the 10 mins each?

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:19

WillimNot · 08/07/2024 17:18

No tell them you will not be paying as they turned up late, left early, did not complete the required tasks and what they did do was of such poor standard that you had to redo and complete yourself.

Tell her to take you to court. Tell her you will contact trading standards. She will soon jog on.

Total chancer.

This is my instinct too. Would you not pay anything then? I feel as though I have to compromise with them morally. I would worry they’d hold a grudge - usually I’d put this down to my own anxiety but the fact a couple of posters have said it now is making me question.

OP posts:
WillimNot · 08/07/2024 17:18

No tell them you will not be paying as they turned up late, left early, did not complete the required tasks and what they did do was of such poor standard that you had to redo and complete yourself.

Tell her to take you to court. Tell her you will contact trading standards. She will soon jog on.

Total chancer.

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:14

She also said (after I said I wasn’t happy) that she didn’t cover our area and was doing so out of goodwill so we should feel fortunate she didn’t charge for petrol. This was never mentioned, our house is 2.5 miles / 10 minute drive from her home address…

OP posts:
WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:02

Sosorryliver · 08/07/2024 15:58

I've been a cleaner and it's not just business insurance, car with business insurance, travel time between jobs needs paid. I fthey didn't work the full 3 hours don't pay for it but I'd stump up for 2.5 and just write it off and write a shit review.

They prob did 1hr 20 ish each

OP posts:
WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 17:00

JoBoJoBo · 08/07/2024 16:05

So they only worked there for 1.5 hours .I would only pay them for the hours they worked.

Edited

1.5hrs each so 3 x £23

OP posts:
WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 16:55

Skyrainlight · 08/07/2024 16:26

I would just pay. They can do a lot more than £70 damage pretty quickly and you really don't know what type of people they know. But if they work for an agency I would complain to the agency.

Do you think? Like what?

OP posts:
WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 16:55

NewName24 · 08/07/2024 16:31

I can't get my head round why you'd agree to such a contract in the first place.

I was initially thinking 'you have to pay and chalk it up to experience' but then I re-read OP. Are you really saying that 2 people, cleaned part of a bathroom, between them in 1.5 hours? That can't be the case.

Surely whoever let them in had an inkling of what they were/ weren't doing ?

Yep, that’s exactly right unfortunately. And half of a large wardrobe

OP posts:
ByCupidStunt · 08/07/2024 16:38

If you're worried about upsetting them then just pay them. THEN, in November, write to the HM Tax Revenues and advise them that you have paid a cleaning company in your area and show them the evidence. But don't advise HM Tax before November because the cleaners have until the end of October to advise the tax people themselves. So come November, if they haven't, and you show evidence to the Tax Man (and it only takes a quick email) then they'll be in trouble.

NewName24 · 08/07/2024 16:31

I can't get my head round why you'd agree to such a contract in the first place.

I was initially thinking 'you have to pay and chalk it up to experience' but then I re-read OP. Are you really saying that 2 people, cleaned part of a bathroom, between them in 1.5 hours? That can't be the case.

Surely whoever let them in had an inkling of what they were/ weren't doing ?

Skyrainlight · 08/07/2024 16:26

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 15:32

PP on other thread brought up the point that it’s better not to piss people off, as if they know where you live and hold a grudge… I dunno what I think they’d do though. We have home security alarms and cameras.

I would just pay. They can do a lot more than £70 damage pretty quickly and you really don't know what type of people they know. But if they work for an agency I would complain to the agency.

TinyYellow · 08/07/2024 16:23

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 15:34

Would you have reservations about paying less in terms of annoying them though?

I would have reservations because I hate upsetting people but my hopefully the anger I felt at them taking the piss would carry me through!

Like you said, there’s not much they can do without becoming criminals. They’re unlikely to take you to court but if they do you can defend it.

JoBoJoBo · 08/07/2024 16:05

So they only worked there for 1.5 hours .I would only pay them for the hours they worked.

Sosorryliver · 08/07/2024 15:58

WWYDwiththisone · 08/07/2024 15:49

They said if I pay less than £69 they’d be working for less than minimum wage because their insurance is expensive……. Lol

I've been a cleaner and it's not just business insurance, car with business insurance, travel time between jobs needs paid. I fthey didn't work the full 3 hours don't pay for it but I'd stump up for 2.5 and just write it off and write a shit review.