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Original poster

To want to write to the governors about my DD's suspension?

265 replies

UndertheCedartree · 08/07/2024 11:47

I'm looking for a bit of help. Last week my 12 yo DD was suspended from school for half a day. She has autism and struggles. She didn't want me to leave her and was crying and clinging to me. I tried to get her to go with a member of staff for half an hour but she wouldn't. So the head teacher had to suspend her and send her home. They said I can write a statement to the governors. Does anyone know what I need to say? Is just that it was due to her ASD?

Also if the headteacher keeps suspending her can she be expelled? This is the one and only time she has ever been suspended but it just got me worried.

OP posts:
BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 20:47

In order to get any data about you rather than DD you would need to submit a SAR for your data.

Lougle · 15/07/2024 20:36

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 20:28

I can imagine 'UndertheCedartree is being annoying again' ,'UndertheCedartree has made another complaint! 'UndertheCedartree has sent me 10 emails in the last hour!' 😂 Hang on, would they have to show me what they have written about me?

Show quote history

If it relates to your DD, or names her, and I can't think why anything you email them wouldn't...

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 20:28

Lougle · 15/07/2024 19:51

Oh yes, a SAR is anything and everything that refers to your DD. Even if it just includes her on a list of pupils. They will redact anything that would identify someone else, but you'll be able to see what they are saying. So, for example, if the SENCO has said that the school can meet her needs, but someone has written an email saying '@UndertheCedartree's DD just isn't coping and I'm not sure there's much else we can do...' then you would have to be given a copy of that email (even if they redact the name of the teacher who wrote it). If they wrote a note that says '@UndertheCedartree's DD had to go home again because she was too anxious to stay. We decided that it would be best to suspend her so that her absence record doesn't worsen...' they would have to let you have that email.

Show quote history

I can imagine 'UndertheCedartree is being annoying again' ,'UndertheCedartree has made another complaint! 'UndertheCedartree has sent me 10 emails in the last hour!' 😂 Hang on, would they have to show me what they have written about me?

OP posts:
Lougle · 15/07/2024 19:51

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 19:19

Thank you for the advice.

When my DD was suspended in the letter it said I could ask for a copy of her school record. I asked for that thinking it would say something about the suspension. All it was was mainly stuff from Primary - all her old school reports. So is a Subject Access Request different? Do I ask the school for a Subject Access Request for DD?

Show quote history

Oh yes, a SAR is anything and everything that refers to your DD. Even if it just includes her on a list of pupils. They will redact anything that would identify someone else, but you'll be able to see what they are saying. So, for example, if the SENCO has said that the school can meet her needs, but someone has written an email saying '@UndertheCedartree's DD just isn't coping and I'm not sure there's much else we can do...' then you would have to be given a copy of that email (even if they redact the name of the teacher who wrote it). If they wrote a note that says '@UndertheCedartree's DD had to go home again because she was too anxious to stay. We decided that it would be best to suspend her so that her absence record doesn't worsen...' they would have to let you have that email.

BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 19:45

A subject access request is different to requesting DD’s school record. The SAR will include data DD’s school record won’t. Make SARs to the school, LA and any other professionals/agencies involved with DD.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 19:29

Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 19:26

You only need a mediation certificate. You don’t have to go to mediation. Just email the mediation company and ask for one.

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Right, ok, thanks.

OP posts:
Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 19:26

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:38

Thanks for the advice. From what I understand from the letter I have to go to mediation before I can appeal.

Show quote history

You only need a mediation certificate. You don’t have to go to mediation. Just email the mediation company and ask for one.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 19:19

Lougle · 15/07/2024 19:13

@UndertheCedartree don't worry about the fact that you've been turned down. Your DD meets the legal threshold so you should appeal. I found it useful to do a Subject Access Request - you'd get all the content of any information about your DD, including internal emails, etc. I had one for my DD which said 'can we take these pupils off the SEND register because they're getting their heads down and trying?' I also got the school nurse's notes of every time DD2 had gone to the sick room, every time I had emailed the school about DD2...it was worth its weight in gold, and I used it to show that despite the school refusing to apply for an EHCNA, they really couldn't meet DD2's needs, because if they could, they would have done so. I also pointed out that although the SEN Code of Practice suggests that Assess, Plan, Do, Review cycles are helpful, DD2 should not be penalised because of the school's failure to follow the SEN CoP.

Thank you for the advice.

When my DD was suspended in the letter it said I could ask for a copy of her school record. I asked for that thinking it would say something about the suspension. All it was was mainly stuff from Primary - all her old school reports. So is a Subject Access Request different? Do I ask the school for a Subject Access Request for DD?

OP posts:
BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 19:17

SENDIST is the Special Educational Needs and Disability Tribunal.

The mediation certificate. In order to submit your appeal to SENDIST you need a mediation certificate. The details of the mediation company should be in the LA’s decision letter.

An IEP doesn’t require a medical professional or medical evidence. DD should have some kind of SEN plan whether that is an IEP, My Support Plan or whatever else the school’s SEN support plans are called.

IHCPs are mostly written with medical input but they aren’t the same as IEPs.

It isn’t uncommon for different members of staff to say different things to different people. It is why it is important to follow up verbal conversations with emails so you have a paper trail.

Lougle · 15/07/2024 19:13

@UndertheCedartree don't worry about the fact that you've been turned down. Your DD meets the legal threshold so you should appeal. I found it useful to do a Subject Access Request - you'd get all the content of any information about your DD, including internal emails, etc. I had one for my DD which said 'can we take these pupils off the SEND register because they're getting their heads down and trying?' I also got the school nurse's notes of every time DD2 had gone to the sick room, every time I had emailed the school about DD2...it was worth its weight in gold, and I used it to show that despite the school refusing to apply for an EHCNA, they really couldn't meet DD2's needs, because if they could, they would have done so. I also pointed out that although the SEN Code of Practice suggests that Assess, Plan, Do, Review cycles are helpful, DD2 should not be penalised because of the school's failure to follow the SEN CoP.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 18:15

BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 17:39

Glad you have the formal decision letter as well as the phone call.

You don’t have to partake in mediation. As Ellie posted, you only have to consider it. LAs use mediation as a delaying tactic. Get the certificate and submit to SENDIST. If the LA is going to concede they will do so whether you actively partake in mediation or just get the certificate and submit straight to SENDIST.

A My Support Plan is the name for a non-statutory plan in some schools/areas. Your school may call it something else such as an IEP.

What is 'the certificate', please? And SENDIST is the tribunal?

DD does not have an IEP as 'the school has not seen medical evidence and they are written with a medical professional.'

OP posts:
fernfriend · 15/07/2024 18:11

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:32

What is a 'My Support Plan', please?

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We use them in my school. They are a formal way of recording the Assess, Plan, Do, Review outlined in the SEND Code of Practice. We also use them to formalise and evidence the support we have offered a student. Students and parents are involved in the writing of it.

Someone up thread mentioned that they aren't implemented in all schools. I didn't realise that.

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 17:45

Ellie56 · 15/07/2024 17:23

You are required to consider mediation. You don't actually have to go through with it; you can go straight to appeal if you want.

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/mediation

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/mediation-things-to-consider

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Right, ok, thank you.

OP posts:
BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 17:39

Glad you have the formal decision letter as well as the phone call.

You don’t have to partake in mediation. As Ellie posted, you only have to consider it. LAs use mediation as a delaying tactic. Get the certificate and submit to SENDIST. If the LA is going to concede they will do so whether you actively partake in mediation or just get the certificate and submit straight to SENDIST.

A My Support Plan is the name for a non-statutory plan in some schools/areas. Your school may call it something else such as an IEP.

Ellie56 · 15/07/2024 17:23

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:40

They have formally refused. I have to do mediation before I can appeal.

Show quote history

You are required to consider mediation. You don't actually have to go through with it; you can go straight to appeal if you want.

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/mediation

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/mediation-things-to-consider

Mediation

Mediation is a more informal way of trying to settle the dispute between you (a parent or young person) and the local authority (LA), compared to an appeal. It may also involve the health authority, known as the integrated care board (ICB) (previously...

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/mediation

Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:50

Anyone know what the school is playing at? I've got the head teacher saying she needs an EHCP asap and saying we need a meeting with the LA to see if other school can meet her needs as we are a main stream school and we can't do anymore! Then apparently the SENCO is saying - we can meet her needs!! I'm so confused!

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:40

BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 14:04

The school should be providing support and shouldn’t be discriminating against DD, but that doesn’t mean DD doesn’t meet the legal test for an EHCNA. She does. Request the LA formally refuse so you can appeal the refusal to assess.

My Support Plans don’t exist everywhere.

They have formally refused. I have to do mediation before I can appeal.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:38

Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 14:02

Save a lot of time and appeal this decision - three cycles of assess, plan, do, review is not a requirement. The legal test for an assessment is that they MAY have SEN that require a plan. There is also case law (precedent) that says even if a child shouldn't have to have an EHCP to make provision, if school show an unwillingness to provide the basics, then LA must issue an EHCP.

Thanks for the advice. From what I understand from the letter I have to go to mediation before I can appeal.

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:36

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:37

With reference to your daughter's exclusion from school, and exclusion from school trip, it does not sound like either of those incidents are legal.

www.ncb.org.uk/resources/all-resources/filter/inclusion-send/school-exclusions-what-legal

I have made a formal complaint about the trip. The school tried to wriggle out of it by saying she wasn't eligible for the trip which was not the case. I have escalated it to the governors.

Hopefully when we have a meeting with the SEN department person they will tell the school they cannot suspend her and we can get a sensible plan in place.

DD was really anxious this morning about a Science assessment. I kept her at home as didn't want them to suspend her again. It's the last week so I though sod it!

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:32

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:29

Sorry if you have already answered this, but does your daughter have a My Support Plan in place?

What is a 'My Support Plan', please?

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:31

Ellie56 · 15/07/2024 12:22

They can't just ring you up and tell you your request has been turned down. And while LAs may want to see what the school has been doing, this is not part of the legal test. See here:

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/asking-for-an-ehc-needs-assessment

The LA needs to put its decision in writing and inform you of your right to appeal.

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/appealing-to-the-send-tribunal
https://www.ipsea.org.uk/general-advice-for-all-appeals
https://www.ipsea.org.uk/refusal-to-assess-appeals

I have been sent an email and it put on the Hub too. But she rang me on top of that. It says they do not think she needs special educational provision. Then on the other hand the head teacher is saying she should be in a special school!

OP posts:
Original poster
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:29

Mumofoneandone · 15/07/2024 12:22

Sounds like some progress is being made.....but so much other stuff happening with different agencies that doesn't seem to add up.
Good to hear a plan is being put in place - hopefully all sorted ready for the start of next year!

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I don't know when we'll be able to have the meeting but hopefully as early in September as possible.

OP posts:
BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 14:04

The school should be providing support and shouldn’t be discriminating against DD, but that doesn’t mean DD doesn’t meet the legal test for an EHCNA. She does. Request the LA formally refuse so you can appeal the refusal to assess.

My Support Plans don’t exist everywhere.

Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 14:02

Save a lot of time and appeal this decision - three cycles of assess, plan, do, review is not a requirement. The legal test for an assessment is that they MAY have SEN that require a plan. There is also case law (precedent) that says even if a child shouldn't have to have an EHCP to make provision, if school show an unwillingness to provide the basics, then LA must issue an EHCP.

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:37

With reference to your daughter's exclusion from school, and exclusion from school trip, it does not sound like either of those incidents are legal.

www.ncb.org.uk/resources/all-resources/filter/inclusion-send/school-exclusions-what-legal