To not understand the fixation on attendance?

Our schools focus on attendance is directed more towards having kids in school and knowing they’re safe and fed. Our school don’t come down hard on uniform although they prefer kids to be in school colours, but where we are is somewhat deprived and lots of kids sadly are safer in school than at home so we will always champion the attendance calls made. Unwell children are one thing, kids who are not in school because their parent didn’t get up is another

At a statistical population level, of course there is a correlation between attendance and grades.

What is not clear is whether there is any causation. Low attendance and low grades may both be caused by things we already know affect educational outcomes:

1. Health
2. SEN
3. Whether parents value education
4. Deprivation

We can’t fix the underlying cause by simply focusing on a different outcome of that cause.

I agree because of DD2 been struggling with the noise and behavior - (despite being in top sets the school has issues ) instead of dealing with behavior or talking to us about how we can help her - they issued a pass to get her out of lessons. So she left and we only know because she talks to us.

Obviously we've then step in with rescue remedy, calming apps, noise blocking headphones - fidget toys - stuff that helps her cope and stay in the actual lesson and emphasised how important that is. Even she admit not being in the lesson impacts her - though again she had parental support to catch up.

The school attitude is she on site and has a tick in the register - that it that's all they care about. They didn't seem bother her grades were dropping.

Some of her mates with slightly lower predications - also leaving lessons due to noise and behaviour they can't cope with - have found they've dropped so much they can't do what they want after school and some with unsupportive families are giving up now in Y10.

The assumption see to be attendance = learning and I agree if your not in school having lessons that that can drastically (depending on child and situation) impact outcomes so can see why it's a shorthand - but if being on site and ticking that box is enough it's pointless.

Or that too many children are being left behind, locked out of learning and school is beyond boring for them?
They have no motivation and can't see the point.

In what world do you imagine us parents are encouraging our children to be off school playing on screens.

Get real there is no world that parents do this. What actual benefit would there be to do this?

Some people haven't got a bloody clue

🤣

In Scotland there are no fines or penalties for unauthorised absence and we've still had a real problem with low attendance since Covid. Looking into why this is happening is important as it is a sign that something is wrong, either with support, society, mental health etc.

I personally think the rhetoric that kids need days off for their mental health, is not in their best interests (yes, blah blah blah, there will be exceptions but at the same rate as before Covid, it's all the extra ones that are the issue). It is short termist and stores up problems, but luckily for parents and schools these problems will kick in when they leave school and are no longer their problem.

These poor kids, being encouraged by the adults to stay home on screens when they feel a bit tired and then reaching 18 and trying to forge a path in the world with less qualifications, less resilience, less hobbies and interests, less friends etc. I work at a university and we're already picking up a lot of that slack, but the people really missing out are these kids unprepared for life and unaware that they can get more out of it.

It is harder for school and parents for children to make the most of their school years, to help them keep up and not fall behind their peers (making things worse) to make adjustments for kids who have got particularly stuck. Going to school when you are clinically well should be the default again, with all the challenges that brings for kids, parents and schools alike.

Obviously I don't agree with the schools having to target the compliant families who have had a bad year with bereavement or illness. These things have always happened though, it is the additional kids staying off that require the focus.

And of course that causes problems in the relationships between the parents and schools, which the LEA don't have to deal with but the teachers do. It's such a bad policy approach.

I found it useful to tell parents how many hours of maths or literacy (for instance), their child had missed during their time off. Most didn't realise.

Attendance isn’t a problem in the Private Sector.

What many parents perhaps also don't understand is that schools are obliged to send out letters about attendance on the instructions of LEA. It's not their choice to do so. Each class register is a legal document of record and each pupil's attendance therefore automatically logged with the LEA. Schools have to demonstrate to the LEA that they chasing up pupils who aren't coming in. The nuance of reasons why doesn't matter to the LEA though, for them it's just a numbers game.

It's because some people can't imagine how other people live and don't take 5 minutes to consider why someone might make the choices they do.

My thinking on this has changed after Covid. Schools were shut for years on and off unlike in most other countries. Two of my children didn't get to take their gcses/A levels. Thousands of "ghost" children never came back. Children were forced to wear soggy rags on their face all day which govt knew did nothing (but have admitted were just to compete with nicola sturgeon). It was obvious govt and some teaching unions did not value education. Still do my best but taking my Year 1 child out for a holiday end of this term and feel no guilt. I know they will be fine.

I had such an unpleasant time at secondary school - bullying (not particularly targeted at me, but widespread), sexual harassment, inadequate bathroom facilities, no time or place to buy or eat lunch, poor behavour, not enough teachers - being taught by subs for entire years. There are major issues in schools that aren't going to be fixed by simply demanding parents force their kids into school. Little wonder parents and kids aren't all thrilled to attend.

Why, thank you, kind lady, for your unimaginative and unimaginative reply.
Of course, I forgot we are now in the 'me, me, me' generation, where your needs are paramount and bugger everyone else.

Yes and the "good" parents will get stressed and annoyed and demoralised by these responses from school whereas the "bad" parents probably don't even read them and don't even care as they have bigger problems, probably are used to dealing with debt collectors, drug dealers and other much more threatening people. The approach shows a lack of understanding of the variety of people in society and pretty obviously wasn't the idea of anyone who's worked with problem families

The thing is it's not black and white.

I used to have a few days when I had friendship issues or felt anxious about school and dragged myself in.

DD2 on the other hand was absolutely fine at primary school but developed stomach ache on the second day of secondary school. Of course we just thought it was settling in issues and "made" her go in.

However when she was having full on panic attacks, fighting us and running away - anything to avoid school, we thought there may be something more to it.

I really can't stand the "just make them go" parent. They haven't a fucking clue.

how is that our fault? if they send then home under their attendance rules it shouldn't count as absence because its clearly not truancy).

It never use to be this bad.

That's the difference though. Schools used to care about truancy. Kids skipping class without parents knowing or parents keeping kids off cos they couldn't be bothered / were hiding something.

Now the focus is on attendance it doesn't just look at those kids, it wastes time on the kids with legitimate reasons for being off. And it's so obsessed with EVERYONE'S attendance, it's surely missing focus on the kids who need it most

Every time these threads come up, I always say the same thing, Wales have got it right. They allow term time holidays at my kids shcool. 1 week(5 days off school) every year is fine, as long as they generally have good attendance.**

Obviously if a child is off persistently, that's different and needs to be dealt with appropriately.

However, the school can’t manage this in a bespoke way, so I think you have to accept the odd ‘telling off’ or small fine in the interests of everyone else.

People don't have to, is the thing. What you're saying here is that you think it would be easier if they did. A very different argument.

Policy choices have consequences, and those will also have to be accepted. A system that obliges already hard pressed schools to send out attendance letters when kids have been eg hospitalised with diabetes (an example given on this thread) is going to lead to some of those parents being alienated and pissed off. Fining can severely undermine trust. We don't get to opt out of the consequences of the system we have.

My experience ( various counties) is that local authorities do in fact spend an absolute fortune on home tutors, on line and face to face mentors and well being practitioners for SEN children that are out of school. Forget £50 an hour for a private mainstream tutor - LA are invoiced nearer £100 an hour.

Academic engagement from children is generally low, parental expectation sky high. The LA can only use what's out there. But kids are disengaged for a reason and that's very often not something that's fixed by people in the house offering ASDAN courses.

This is something that’s starting to change in Scotland. As well as the usual academic school work many schools are starting to offer alternative routes. Healthcare courses with no exam but lots of practical skills and work experiences built in.
Hair dressing courses that link with the local college.
Foundation apprenticeships in construction. Again with no exam but continual practical assessment and work experience with local companies
Child care courses. Retailing courses. Introduction to engineering courses. There are many of these alternative options on offer in more and more schools.

The main issue with them at the moment ironically is persuading parents that it might be a better option for their non-academic child than trying to get them through an exam in French. That it’s a totally viable qualification and for many will lead them directly into a career.

I don't think we have to put up with any such thing when a policy is so clearly wrong-headed and causes kids such utter misery.

Particularly not when we have a new government. I will certainly be writing to them and making my views known on how the education system needs to be changed.

I should've clarified that I wasn't talking about parents with children who have physical or mental health issues. Our DD went through a period of acute anxiety where she didn't want to go to school. We did manage to get her in every day, knowing it might escalate if she stayed off, but it was bloody hard, so I do sympathise. I meant the parents who just let their kids stay at home because they don't fancy it or take term-time holidays that are the issue for schools.

But it's not schools failing children like yours, it's the lack of central funding from the last Govt that has led to a recruitment and retainment staffing crisis. There simply aren't enough teachers and specialist TAs to adequately serve pupils with additional needs.

It always interests me how often these threads veer into overt classism. Happens nigh on every time, invariably from someone who thinks they're occupying the moral high ground.