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Unauthorized dental work

59 replies

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 12:11

Ds(almost 5 and ND) broke a back molar and had a SS crown put on. While the dentist had him in the back(we were not allowed to be with him) she put an additional 3 fucking crowns on without our permission. I didn't notice this until we got home, as when I saw ds after the work was done he was in a lot of pain so I was more concerned with comforting him than inspecting the work the dentist did. I did check his mouth once we got home and settled and I was furious. Gums were a bloody mess. 3 unapproved crowns(I stayed in the waiting room the entire time, she had every opportunity to come tell me if he needed additional crowns. She had specifically said beforehand he wouldnt need anything else done, as the other teeth looked great) I cleaned his teeth with wet gauze the next few days, and as the goop the dentist put on his gums cleared away, I noticed 3 out of 4 crowns have gum recession. The broken tooth is the worst, with the gum on the inside almost completely receded. I have not called the dentist, as I'm not sure if I should contact a lawyer first before talking to them. Everything I've read says that he will need a gum graft, which is a horror show in itself to think of putting him through that. I'm just at a loss that a dentist can just "decide" to do unauthorized work on your child. I do not want her to even be in the same room as my child, let alone to try to fix what she's done. I am waiting on a call back from the local(different)dentist to have him looked at to see what her opinion is.
Yabu-call the dentist that did the work
Yanbu-call the lawyer

OP posts:
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catlovingdoctor · 07/07/2024 16:09

Stainless steel crowns are a VERY different treatment to regular crowns. They are usually a non-invasive way of managing mild decay in baby teeth which will be shed soon anyway. They are just cemented on to the teeth without any preparation to prevent deterioration. It is likely they were getting all necessary treatment done in one go while under anaesthetic. (As obviously, repeated anaesthetics carry a higher health risk).

FiveTreeHill · 07/07/2024 15:53

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:01

Oh ffs IT IS GUM RECESSION FROM THE CROWN. Why comment if you don't believe me. That's exactly what happened. Perfect gums, then after dental work they have pulled away from the crowns. That's what has happened. Full stop.
I do understand about wanting to get it all done in one go so he doesn't have to undergo anesthesia again. I don't understand how she can go ahead with work I didn't approve without telling me, and now here we are.

You don't need to shout. It's not gum recession from the crown. Children cannot have recession severe enough to cause them problems in the future. No gum graft will be necessary.

Gums may appear receeded for many many reasons e.g. seeing enamel at the base of the crown, the tooth has erupted more or gums are less inflamed and have shrunk back, even if there has been some 'recession' around a baby tooth, it is not a problem because the child is still growing and therefore will resolve once the adult tooth has erupted. The contour of the gum is formed when the adult tooth has fully erupted

AcrossTheOceanMissingHome · 07/07/2024 14:40

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:27

Ok thanks all but if no ones willing to believe his gums receded that quickly I won't get much good from this thread, because that's what happened.

They don't believe it because it's just not possible.

If your child's teeth had lots damage, which it sounds like they did, then it's possible that the gums were previously swollen due to plaque/bad oral hygiene, covering up the recession. Now the teeth will have been cleaned, the gums will be less swollen, allowing the recession to be seen.

fleabites · 07/07/2024 14:37

To be honest, you really should post this on a forum in the US. I'm not being funny about you posting here because anyone from anywhere in the world can post here - but the vast majority of people are posting from the UK and there are differences in dentistry procedures, consent and legalities between UK and US so I really don't think you're going to get anything particular helpful out of this.

Also people are going to start having a go at you about your child's dental health because it's AIBU and people like to have a go at posters, almost as a kind of sport. No one here knows what his dental health was like before the tooth broke and the crowns were put on. No one here knows what exactly you consented to - did you sign to consent to one tooth only or was it a more general consent to any necessary dental work?
Perhaps you could contact the hospital to ask for a copy of the consent form you signed as a first step and visit a different dentist for an examination to get an idea of the state of his teeth and gums.
But again, it's difficult for people to make suggestions because we have no idea how the children's hospital/dentistry services work in the UK.

ditalini · 07/07/2024 13:41

sarahc336 · 07/07/2024 13:27

I don't understand why the milk tooth wasn't just removed 🤔 dd1 has had milk teeth removed to make way for adult molars, what in earth is a dentist putting crowns on milk teeth for 😬😬

They're not crowns like you're thinking. More like caps that just fit over the tooth.

Ds1 had one and it wasn't a big job at all because he was able to tolerate the procedure with the usual local, so actually less traumatic than removal plus it kept space for the adult tooth.

StephenHawkingsDiscoMachine · 07/07/2024 13:28

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

MillyMollyMardy · 07/07/2024 13:28

@dragonmumof2 I used to carry out kids' general anaesthetic lists years ago. As others have said it is normal to consent for examination under anaesthetic and for any additional work found to be carried out to reduce the risk for another anaesthetic.
Stainless crowns are premade they slot over the tooth with no preparation so often don't reach all the way down so there can be visble tooth below the crown edge. Staight after fitting the gums can look irritated and but normally will heal quickly and be back to looking fine.
The person you need to talk to is the dentist, we can all speculate what might have happened. If they have been remiss in their consent procedure you need to talk to them. You are perfectly within your rights not to have them carry out any more treatment but at the moment they don't even know you are so upset.

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:27

Ok thanks all but if no ones willing to believe his gums receded that quickly I won't get much good from this thread, because that's what happened.

OP posts:
sarahc336 · 07/07/2024 13:27

I don't understand why the milk tooth wasn't just removed 🤔 dd1 has had milk teeth removed to make way for adult molars, what in earth is a dentist putting crowns on milk teeth for 😬😬

itsmylife7 · 07/07/2024 13:26

You're in the USA so unfortunately we can't advice you OP

Balloonhearts · 07/07/2024 13:25

Gums cannot recede that quickly. The crown will make it more obvious but it doesn't happen that fast. They will not do a gum graft on a 5 year old. They will wait until his permanent teeth come in and then reassess the situation.

SurferRona · 07/07/2024 13:24

Sorry, just seen you are US! The doc I linked too still of interest to you, it would ofc be most sensible to speak to your dentist to ask Qs, but given the litigious environment in the US, sure, call your lawyer instead….

SlugGloves · 07/07/2024 13:22

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 12:47

I don't want a payout, I want my child to not have to have gum grafts at the age of 4. If I'm truly honest I'm furious and want her to be held accountable for this. My dm told me not to have it done, but I didn't listen. I wanted to make sure he had no problems in the future and now here he is with more problems than he started with.

Can you just clarify that you have discussed this with the involved dentist? And that they have confirmed that they have done three crowns? And what was the outcome of that conversation?

Are you trained in dentistry? How can you be sure that you’re seeing what you think you are? Are you seeing three crowns, or just that the one clinically indicated crown has been supported/secured onto two other adjacent teeth?

SurferRona · 07/07/2024 13:19

Gums don’t recede in days OP. The treatment of your poor child’s teeth sounds essential, SS crowns wholly appropriate and will help their development, nutrition and learning. Sounds like if DC teeth were that bad, gums would be an issue too. Perhaps review this before speaking to a lawyer: https://www.sdcep.org.uk/media/2zbkrdkg/sdcep-prevention-and-management-of-dental-caries-in-children-2nd-edition.pdf And don’t forget, permanent teeth yet to come through. Please speak to your child’s dentist for an explanation before you do anything as PPs have said.

https://www.sdcep.org.uk/media/2zbkrdkg/sdcep-prevention-and-management-of-dental-caries-in-children-2nd-edition.pdf

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:10

RantyMcRanterton · 07/07/2024 13:06

You weren't cross about this on the 2nd of July, what's changed, OP?

His gums. I told my dh the same as pp have said, maybe she found problems she wanted to correct all at once. Once his mouth was healed and his gums still a mess I was completely turned around about it.

OP posts:
NeverDropYourMooncup · 07/07/2024 13:07

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:01

Oh ffs IT IS GUM RECESSION FROM THE CROWN. Why comment if you don't believe me. That's exactly what happened. Perfect gums, then after dental work they have pulled away from the crowns. That's what has happened. Full stop.
I do understand about wanting to get it all done in one go so he doesn't have to undergo anesthesia again. I don't understand how she can go ahead with work I didn't approve without telling me, and now here we are.

Swollen gums can hide a lot of problems, even if they look pink and healthy. He's already had enough decay to necessitate one crown, it's not a far reach to conclude that the same circumstances that led to one molar breaking were also found to be affecting the other teeth and gum in the area once he was under anaesthesia and she was able to examine him more easily and clean up/trace further infection.

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:06

StormingNorman · 07/07/2024 13:03

Where are you OP? Giving your country isn’t going to be outing.

Sorry US. Was responding to people saying it wasn't gum recession

OP posts:
RantyMcRanterton · 07/07/2024 13:06

You weren't cross about this on the 2nd of July, what's changed, OP?

AgeingDoc · 07/07/2024 13:05

I'm an anaesthetist not a dentist, but a considerable part of my workload was anaesthesia for paediatric dentistry so ai do know a bit. It's not that uncommon for a treatment plan to change intraoperatively once the dentist gets to have a really good look around. Lots of children aren't the most cooperative when it comes to dental examination and once they are anaesthetised and the dentist gets a clearer view other things do sometimes show up. Obviously it makes sense to deal with what you find at the time rather than subject the child to another procedure.
However, every dentist I have ever worked with always explained* this possibility *to parents beforehand and if there was anything majorly different to what was originally planned then someone would generally go out of theatre to let the parents know, and they were always seen immediately afterwards to explain again.
So based on my experience I do think that it is potentially an issue that things were not properly explained and you may indeed have valid concerns over both the consent process and the quality of care - nobody can tell you that for sure on a forum like this though.
However, as you haven't told us where you are I can only suggest what would be the best course of action in the UK NHS and that would indeed be to raise concerns with the clinicians directly or via PALS. Normally people would do that, then escalate to the hospital's formal complaints procedure rather than going straight to a lawyer as many complaints can be resolved without recourse to legal action. Obviously it may be different elsewhere but I do think that if you are unhappy with any health care or indeed service of any other kind, the best place to start is usually by talking to the person who provided it.

StormingNorman · 07/07/2024 13:03

Where are you OP? Giving your country isn’t going to be outing.

zeibesaffron · 07/07/2024 13:02

Why would you be instructing a lawyer when you haven’t even spoken to the dentist?

Speak with the hospital/ dentist first - normally UK anaesthetic consent forms say that they will undertake procedure A but if urgent they can deviate from the consented plan. Are you in the UK?

Talk to them first, lodge a complaint there - then speak to a lawyer if needed? But not sure what you are hoping to get from that process - money? If this is about the dentist’s practice then complain to the hosital and their regulatory body.

dragonmumof2 · 07/07/2024 13:01

FiveTreeHill · 07/07/2024 12:49

If a child is having a GA for dental work it's normal to do an exam under anaesthesia and do all the work needed, this is to prevent repeat GAS. I would be surprised if any community/peadiatric dentist did not consent for work as needed because if a child needs an anaesthetic for as simple a procedure as a halls crown then you would not be able to do a thorough exam before they were asleep, and also chances are they would need further GAs for every procedure.

There's no such thing as gum recession in a 4yo. He will not need grafts, he is still growing.

Oh ffs IT IS GUM RECESSION FROM THE CROWN. Why comment if you don't believe me. That's exactly what happened. Perfect gums, then after dental work they have pulled away from the crowns. That's what has happened. Full stop.
I do understand about wanting to get it all done in one go so he doesn't have to undergo anesthesia again. I don't understand how she can go ahead with work I didn't approve without telling me, and now here we are.

OP posts:
Toddlerteaplease · 07/07/2024 12:59

Anotherparkingthread · 07/07/2024 12:21

m receession is associated with poor oral hygiene and will not be the result of crowns just being fitted. Meaning the gums were recessed before. If the molar broke it probably had a very large cavity.

She may have realised the other teeth were also in a state and decided to do the work there and then so as not to risk anaesthetic twice. Which is very sensible.

Why are your child's teeth in this state in the first place?

Consent still beefs to be obtained. They can't just do it.

Spirallingdownwards · 07/07/2024 12:57

Have you reread your consent form because I suspect there may have been a clause stating that you consented to further work that was ascertained to be required whilst under anesthetic.

Bushmillsbabe · 07/07/2024 12:56

I presume that when she did the original work it exposed weakness in the other teeth and then needed to crown.
If she had left theatre to come speak to you, it would have meant your child being under GA for even longer, placing him at greater risk of complications. Or she could have stopped and then had you come back for another GA, which she may have felt would be more traumatic for him.
So yes, she should have the discussion with you beforehand that more extensive work may have been needed, but sometimes they don't know what will find until in there.

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