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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not understand what they expect me to do?

470 replies

bloodypublicservice · 03/07/2024 13:58

I was called up for jury service starting in less than two weeks from now. I work Saturdays only as I otherwise do all of the childcare whilst my partner works full time. Originally I stated I was available as my MIL was going to have our daughter, however MIL has experienced a significant and unexpected health issue resulting in being hospitalised for the foreseeable. I've contacted the relevant department to have received a response stating that my request to be excused from this call for service has been refused and that I must still attend at the stated day/time. It mentions appealing but that a hearing is likely to be called, and given the start date is so soon, it's realistically not going to be resolved before starting.

WIBU to show up on my start date with my child and ask what else they expected me to do? We have no other local family and no provision for external childcare.

OP posts:
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6
shearwater2 · 03/07/2024 16:15

It seems so unfortunate that they ask so many people (repeatedly) who can't do it because of childcare when I've never been asked and could easily get the time off work and do not have childcare issues. Shame you can't put your name on a list to volunteer to do it and get pre-vetted, then once you've done it twice you are automatically ineligible.

Crunchymum · 03/07/2024 16:15

ThatsAFineLookingHighHorse · 03/07/2024 16:12

Companies cannot require you to take jury duty as annual leave.

Don't ever be forced into that.

The suggestion was the OP's partner books two weeks annual leave to cover the OP being at J.S.

Epicaricacy · 03/07/2024 16:12

HappierTimesAhead · 03/07/2024 16:11

Just hand her baby over to the homeless man sitting outside the court.

exactly, why are people trying to make things harder than they need to be.

ThatsAFineLookingHighHorse · 03/07/2024 16:12

Crunchymum · 03/07/2024 14:41

Who is able to magic up two weeks of childcare with two weeks notice?

Who is allowed to book two weeks of annual leave with two weeks notice?

Who has a neighbour / friend who is willing and able to provide childcare for two weeks?

MN never ceases to amaze me.

Companies cannot require you to take jury duty as annual leave.

Don't ever be forced into that.

Aquamarine1029 · 03/07/2024 16:11

VolvoFan · 03/07/2024 15:10

If the court has refused then it means they cannot work around you. You've been summoned and your presence will be the difference between a violent offender going to prison or walking free. It sucks, but this is genuinely a case of 'it is what it is'. Good luck.

This is absolute nonsense. You clearly have no idea how jury selection works.

HappierTimesAhead · 03/07/2024 16:11

Gogogo12345 · 03/07/2024 16:09

But what do you actually expect her to do with the child?

Just hand her baby over to the homeless man sitting outside the court.

Aquamarine1029 · 03/07/2024 16:09

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 16:00

Giving staff time off for jury service

Is your husband aware of his rights?

Edited

The husband wasn't the one called for jury service.

Gogogo12345 · 03/07/2024 16:09

VolvoFan · 03/07/2024 15:10

If the court has refused then it means they cannot work around you. You've been summoned and your presence will be the difference between a violent offender going to prison or walking free. It sucks, but this is genuinely a case of 'it is what it is'. Good luck.

But what do you actually expect her to do with the child?

TheCrenchinglyMcQuaffenBrothers · 03/07/2024 16:08

LoneAndLoco · 03/07/2024 15:26

There are expenses for jury service and employers are also expected to allow you paid time off. Of course that’s no help to SAHMs.

Employers have to give you time off for jury service but they certainly don’t have to pay you for it.
The £64.95 loss of earnings payment is ludicrous and if, like me, you run your own business the timeout of being able to do so is even more financially crippling.
The £5.71 lunch allowance doesn’t even cover a lunch from the courts own cafe, let alone meal deal.
But yes, it’s our civic duty and an important one at that. The demographic of the juries, when I did service last month, already seemed skewed very much toward people my age (52) and older, and far more women than men. Hardly any young people at all. I imagine that there had been a lot of deferring or excusing, for reasons the OP has stated. Something needs to be done to overhaul the system if it is to remain fit for purpose.

MereDintofPandiculation · 03/07/2024 16:05

LoneAndLoco · 03/07/2024 15:26

There are expenses for jury service and employers are also expected to allow you paid time off. Of course that’s no help to SAHMs.

It is still unpaid. Although I'm retired, I am involved in several different voluntary activities, many retired people have caring roles - elderly parents who would cope without a visit but would find it distressing, or caring for GC, meaning that alternative childcare needs to be found, but unlikely to be compensated for because it's not the juror's own children requiring care. My time is valuable to me, the more so because I have so little left. But I am expected to give up 3 weeks or more with no recompense, and to travel for over an hour each way on unreliable public transport during rush hour, which I would find physically extremely difficult as I find it difficult to stand for any length of time. At least payment at minimum wage would allow me to take a taxi.

Kinshipug · 03/07/2024 16:04

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 16:00

Giving staff time off for jury service

Is your husband aware of his rights?

Edited

Those rights do not extend to spouses.

HappierTimesAhead · 03/07/2024 16:04

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 15:56

Move to Scotland! It's such a small population that we get called all the time (at least where I live)!

The relative crime rate must be higher (or relative need for a jury I suppose), otherwise a smaller population would also mean lower number of crimes.

In Scotland the jury in Criminal trials is made up of 15 people compared to 12 in England which would be a contributing factor I guess

Readingallthetime · 03/07/2024 16:02

JoyousPinkPeer · 03/07/2024 15:38

You must have been given plenty of notice and should have taken steps to get hubby to apply for parental.leave instead of just waiting and presuming you would not have to attend. Perhaps he should ask for leave or holiday now!
I don't understand why people are suggesting you get a sick note or claim you are breast feeding, that's just ridiculous. No wonder the country is in the state it's in ... people looking for excuses not to do things instead of just gritting their teeth and getting on with life's demands.

Edited

No wonder the country's in the state it's in....with people like you not able to comprehend the OP's original post before spouting their judgemental opinions.

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 16:00

bloodypublicservice · 03/07/2024 15:09

Unless he takes unpaid time off, and without permission (effectively go AWOL), he can't. And we cannot afford for him to take two weeks off as I cannot claim pay through the courts on his behalf.

Giving staff time off for jury service

Is your husband aware of his rights?

WiddlinDiddlin · 03/07/2024 15:58

This is so shite... from so many angles.

DP's employer should permit emergency parental leave/compassionate leave, though this may be without pay.

Courts should have a better system for childcare than 'you sort it out or else'.

But also, if women don't, or won't do jury service, we end up with juries that are not a good cross section of society.

Add in all those people who won't go because of their job, and you further narrow that cross section to those who don't work for whatever reason, and don't have kids.

Theres already far fewer jurors with disabilities because most courts are in NO way accessible for disabled people...

A jury is really not a group of ones peers if all these people are excluded from jury duty!

Nanny0gg · 03/07/2024 15:58

AllotmentTime · 03/07/2024 14:09

What does no provision for external childcare mean? Can you offer some kind of proof of this? As that's what they will expect you to do- send your DD to a childminder or nursery.

Edited

Where do you think she'll find one with space for this?

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 15:58

FeatherBoas · 03/07/2024 15:52

I think you need to ask to defer not be excused, you would have to do it sometime in the next 6 months I think. You need a really good reason to be excused (I don't think child care problems would be sufficient), not so much to defer and I expect a temporary problem with childcare would be OK. My DH deferred because of work commitments and did it a few months later.

It's 12 months (just looked it up). You can give 3 dates within the next 12 months. That seems reasonable.

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 15:56

Move to Scotland! It's such a small population that we get called all the time (at least where I live)!

The relative crime rate must be higher (or relative need for a jury I suppose), otherwise a smaller population would also mean lower number of crimes.

BoredandLost · 03/07/2024 15:54

Childcare starts at £75 a day near me. That's the cheaper end. So the choice of spending £750+ or losing husbands wages for length of trial would literally mean we couldn't pay our mortgage or other bills. Pointing out that when you have a small child you provide the care for you can't reasonably do jury service isn't "trying to get out of something". There are people in this thread acting as if the country would fall apart without it. I am very menopausal and would be terrible on a jury at the moment!! It should be much easier to defer.

FeatherBoas · 03/07/2024 15:52

I think you need to ask to defer not be excused, you would have to do it sometime in the next 6 months I think. You need a really good reason to be excused (I don't think child care problems would be sufficient), not so much to defer and I expect a temporary problem with childcare would be OK. My DH deferred because of work commitments and did it a few months later.

Epicaricacy · 03/07/2024 15:52

JoyousPinkPeer · 03/07/2024 15:38

You must have been given plenty of notice and should have taken steps to get hubby to apply for parental.leave instead of just waiting and presuming you would not have to attend. Perhaps he should ask for leave or holiday now!
I don't understand why people are suggesting you get a sick note or claim you are breast feeding, that's just ridiculous. No wonder the country is in the state it's in ... people looking for excuses not to do things instead of just gritting their teeth and getting on with life's demands.

Edited

Your attitude is exactly why this country is in the state it's in.

Instead of gritting your teeth and putting up with any stupid nonsense, do something about it. At the very least, the absolute minimum, be vocal about how wrong it is.

CharlotteBog · 03/07/2024 15:52

I would call the Jury Central Summoning Bureau and explain that your request to be excused (did you ask for a deferral?) was refused and that you would like to appeal. You understand that there is likely to be an appeal hearing but as court date is so soon you don't think it will be resolved in time (did they tell you this, or is it what you assume?).

Jury service

What to do if you're asked to do jury service - taking time off work, delaying jury service, claiming expenses. Includes information from the withdrawn 5222, 5222A and Juror Charter guidance.

https://www.gov.uk/jury-service/delaying-or-being-excused-from-jury-service

Kinshipug · 03/07/2024 15:51

I would be the same OP. DH could not take time off now if he wanted a job to come back. My mum had a stroke recently. FIL is blind, MIL is on another continent. Friends,neighbors and siblings all have jobs. If by some miracle I could source temporary paid childcare, the allowance doesn't even cover my toddler, let alone the preschooler and wrap around for eldest. It seems very unfair, a deferral until kids at school would hardly be impossible.
If they want a truly impartial, not pissed off jury, compensation should not be capped.

pigsDOfly · 03/07/2024 15:50

Crunchymum · 03/07/2024 14:41

Who is able to magic up two weeks of childcare with two weeks notice?

Who is allowed to book two weeks of annual leave with two weeks notice?

Who has a neighbour / friend who is willing and able to provide childcare for two weeks?

MN never ceases to amaze me.

As above.

There are some really ridiculous suggestion on this thread.

Clearly some people have been living under a rock if they think that getting child care at the drop of a hat and time of work at a moments notice is that easy.

QuillBill · 03/07/2024 15:49

My dd just had hers deferred until she has finished university as she doesn't live here (although she does sometimes) but didn't change where she lived on the electrolnroll. So it's deferred for eighteen months.

Of course, that's not going to be an ideal time either because she should be getting her first proper job but everyone has something.