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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think my SIL is over the top for this?

337 replies

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 08:57

In short, my nephew has been found, alongside a few other boys, to be calling a girl 'butchy' butch. This is their nickname for her and they found it hilarious to call her this. SIL was called into the school by head of year. The boys got nothing but a slap on the wrist, in reality. We suspect because they're all Set 1 (top set) and still in process of doing their mocks.

SIL says this is not enough. And she is punishing my nephew by saying he isn't coming on the family holiday - Which is also the wedding of my sister.

BIL is backing her.

AIBU to think this is too much? By all means yes, the school have been to soft here as a consequence. But, surely this is too much?

It means missing his aunt getting married. She is really upset and cried on the phone to me about this.

Knowing SIL, she is very likely to follow through.

It would mean him staying with his nan. And she would continue onto the holiday as planned with BIL

High chance she will see this thread of course. But the family is really upset. It's a wedding.

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theveryhungrybum · 06/07/2024 14:20

A similar thing happened at my son's school and the girl's boyfriend ended up bringing it to the attention of the school in defence of his girlfriend. My son was initially annoyed with the boyfriend for getting some of my son's friends in trouble, but it's this sort of behaviour that needs to be dealt with in no uncertain terms at the outset. Otherwise boundaries are not set and next time it's not just name calling, it's unwanted physical contact as well. And then the next time, something worse. I admire your SIL and think you and your family should stay out of it. I imagine this is all pretty hard for her as it is.

Facing40andfrazzled · 06/07/2024 13:26

coupebaby · 03/07/2024 19:14

Therapist? Over been called butch? 🫣 Totally 100% think what the boys done was wrong, school (as with most of them) are beyond useless at making sure the kids are punished enough to make sure it never happens again but preventing him from going to his aunties wedding abroad and been the only one missing out of the family and photos to look back on in future will have FAR more mental impact on that boys mental health than the girl who was called butch!! If I were in that boys position and I’d to look back on photos from a family wedding abroad I was prevented from going on because I called someone a name at school I’d still be MASSIVELY resentful towards my mother to this day. If she follows through with this I can tell you now this will damage their relationship. He’ll always think back to this family wedding for the rest of his life, he won’t think of it as a lesson learned been punished for calling someone names he’ll just feel deep anger towards his mother for this for the rest of his life.
Also that been said, an old friend of one of my mates at the time her parents used to be strict like that and OTT with punishments, her sister done something one time and they stopped her going to their grandparents anniversary party were a photographer was arranged for get family photos, she was the only one missing from the photo out of all the grandkids with the grandparents, the grandparents were heartbroken and begged their son to allow their granddaughter to come but they stood their ground and refused. About 8 months afterwards the girl was killed in a car accident…….guess who felt regret for life then after that, especially every time they saw that photo hanging on the wall in the grandparents house!
Theres better fitted punishments than banning him from attending a family wedding abroad!

My sister was called names in school by a group of boys, she was stunning looking kind funny smart but a bit curvy …she stopped eating carbs …then meat dairy…then tea coffee just water ….she weighed 5 stone when she was admitted to hospital she cut herself to lose blood so yay less weight (her words)…she lost years of her life in therapy, hospital beds ..inpatient eating disorder units …secure units when she tried to end her life ..we have many photos of family events including my wedding where she was missing due to hospitalisation, watching her nearly destroyed my family so yes words are weapons and yes words can lead to years of therapy…..as long as it is explained to this boy exactly why this is happening, why what he’d did was so wrong as long as his parents are there for him explaining and discussing with him he will understand

Facing40andfrazzled · 06/07/2024 13:03

Your sil is correct ..young girls are constantly bombarded by how they should look, dress, act etc and words are as dangerous a weapon as a knife or gun ….as long as she (sil ) explains exactly to her son why she is doing this, why name calling, body shaming, verbal harassment is bullying not banter, that it can lead a vulnerable person down a dark path mentally, leading to self harm, disordered eating, suicidal ideation, I’m also completely disgusted by the school prioritising the boys over the girl which sends a message that girls don’t matter and giving the boys the belief they can do say whatever and get away with it. Let him stay home, let him see actions have consequences

Safaribar · 03/07/2024 22:37

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 08:57

In short, my nephew has been found, alongside a few other boys, to be calling a girl 'butchy' butch. This is their nickname for her and they found it hilarious to call her this. SIL was called into the school by head of year. The boys got nothing but a slap on the wrist, in reality. We suspect because they're all Set 1 (top set) and still in process of doing their mocks.

SIL says this is not enough. And she is punishing my nephew by saying he isn't coming on the family holiday - Which is also the wedding of my sister.

BIL is backing her.

AIBU to think this is too much? By all means yes, the school have been to soft here as a consequence. But, surely this is too much?

It means missing his aunt getting married. She is really upset and cried on the phone to me about this.

Knowing SIL, she is very likely to follow through.

It would mean him staying with his nan. And she would continue onto the holiday as planned with BIL

High chance she will see this thread of course. But the family is really upset. It's a wedding.

This has nothing to do with you! Not only are you sharing a story that is instantly recognisable to your sister and BIL (I'm assuming they have facebook or their friends or family do) but you feel the need to stick your nose in. Its their decision.

countcalculia · 03/07/2024 22:20

Harry12345 · 03/07/2024 22:16

All these adults saying how wrong name calling is whilst calling a 15 year old all sorts of names

There’s nothing wrong with calling him a misogynistic little shit, it’s an anonymous forum.

But this girl they bulled is not anonymous, she has to look at their putrid faces every day.

Harry12345 · 03/07/2024 22:16

All these adults saying how wrong name calling is whilst calling a 15 year old all sorts of names

Wtafdidido · 03/07/2024 22:01

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 09:03

He's not my son. But he is generally a really good kid, Brother and SIL often say they're lucky with him as they haven't found him a 'terrible teen' and he's 15 now

I don't think he's ever been in trouble like this, nowhere near

Maybe he just hasn’t been caught before and is actually more of a bullying little shit than you all realise. Maybe his reaction to the schools lame ass approach has given her cause to think there is or has been more to it or that his attitude sucks. At least her consequence won’t be forgotten by the beginning of the next term.

Hididi11 · 03/07/2024 21:57

I agree.
My friend was called all sorts of names by guys in her class.
She is now in her 30's and struggles with eating disorder, anxiety, depression, can't build a relationship with anyone, socially anxious.

Been medicated on energy milkshakes due to severe anorexia.

It really is awful what got said and ruins ones life forever.

Your sister is a great mum. If only all mums understood the effect it has on the girls bullied.

At least she hasn't commited suicide or self -harmed because of it.

Onethinnyatatime · 03/07/2024 21:31

Your nephew needs to learn a huge lesson. The "He is generally a good boy" doesn't cut it. Good kids don't bully others. It looks like some of his family also need to learn a lesson.
Let your SIL parent her son.

And to everyone who "normalise" this behaviour please stop. It is not. It is harmful and must be addressed strongly.

Harry12345 · 03/07/2024 20:02

loropianalover · 03/07/2024 18:27

I’d be more gutted about the way my nephew/niece acted. Weddings are important for the bride and groom but there’s no onus on SIL to have her son attend if she doesn’t want him to.

You can be upset and disappointed and then move on from it and include him at a family event, leaving him out is cruel

coupebaby · 03/07/2024 19:14

Wormfanclub · 28/06/2024 09:51

A whole group of boys name-calling this girl is disgusting. Guaranteed she will remember it for the rest of her life. She’ll probably be talking about it to her therapist in ten years time.

I don’t think the punishment is too harsh. Your sister will survive getting married without her teen nephew there.

We are generally quite gentle parents, not strict about schoolwork, tidying etc. But kindness to others is the ONE thing we come down hard on.

Your sister is trying to shape her son into someone who is kind and considerate. There’s not really anything more important than that. It doesn’t matter a jot if he’s in top set, a good teen etc. That’s a load of crap. I’d rather a teen that was middle set and went to house parties, if they were kind to a fault. Maybe your sister has the same outlook.

Therapist? Over been called butch? 🫣 Totally 100% think what the boys done was wrong, school (as with most of them) are beyond useless at making sure the kids are punished enough to make sure it never happens again but preventing him from going to his aunties wedding abroad and been the only one missing out of the family and photos to look back on in future will have FAR more mental impact on that boys mental health than the girl who was called butch!! If I were in that boys position and I’d to look back on photos from a family wedding abroad I was prevented from going on because I called someone a name at school I’d still be MASSIVELY resentful towards my mother to this day. If she follows through with this I can tell you now this will damage their relationship. He’ll always think back to this family wedding for the rest of his life, he won’t think of it as a lesson learned been punished for calling someone names he’ll just feel deep anger towards his mother for this for the rest of his life.
Also that been said, an old friend of one of my mates at the time her parents used to be strict like that and OTT with punishments, her sister done something one time and they stopped her going to their grandparents anniversary party were a photographer was arranged for get family photos, she was the only one missing from the photo out of all the grandkids with the grandparents, the grandparents were heartbroken and begged their son to allow their granddaughter to come but they stood their ground and refused. About 8 months afterwards the girl was killed in a car accident…….guess who felt regret for life then after that, especially every time they saw that photo hanging on the wall in the grandparents house!
Theres better fitted punishments than banning him from attending a family wedding abroad!

loropianalover · 03/07/2024 18:27

Harry12345 · 03/07/2024 18:03

Em because he’s a well loved family member! I’d be gutted if my niece was excluded

I’d be more gutted about the way my nephew/niece acted. Weddings are important for the bride and groom but there’s no onus on SIL to have her son attend if she doesn’t want him to.

Harry12345 · 03/07/2024 18:03

loropianalover · 03/07/2024 16:25

I think SIL is right. It’s her child anyway so butt out.

Why are the family so anguished about a 15 year old nephew missing a wedding? 🤦🏼‍♀️ if he’d not been a bully he’d be there, be mad at him and not SIL!

Em because he’s a well loved family member! I’d be gutted if my niece was excluded

CheltenhamLady · 03/07/2024 16:31

SherlockStones · 29/06/2024 20:30

He got the obligatory slap on the wrist at school and a more severe punishment at home, it's called good parenting.

The school should have done much more to discipline the boys. If I were your SIL I would have insisted upon it.
The absence from the wedding is a step too far imo, but he does need to know there are severe consequences. I would be exploring other options.

tennesseewhiskey1 · 03/07/2024 16:27

i still fail to see how your sister in law punishing her child, has any bearing on you - this isn't your business, at all. Ive been on the side of this girl, and ive met nephews like yours - absolute shits. They damage people - the ramifications of which i am still feeling till this day. A fiends niece is going though this, she has attempted to take her life twice, because of people like your top-set nephew. So, no i dont think shes being OTT.

loropianalover · 03/07/2024 16:25

I think SIL is right. It’s her child anyway so butt out.

Why are the family so anguished about a 15 year old nephew missing a wedding? 🤦🏼‍♀️ if he’d not been a bully he’d be there, be mad at him and not SIL!

EmmyA87 · 03/07/2024 16:22

I have a 15 year old and if he had done this I don’t think I’d be as extreme and not allow him on our upcoming family holiday. I’d insist he write her an apology letter and be made to take part in some school related activity as set either by mum or the school. I’d definitely be taking his phone too just for good measure.

Iwasafool · 03/07/2024 16:21

binkie163 · 03/07/2024 11:10

@Iwasafool my brain must be on satellite link today! 😂of course it must be the other nan, the op doesnt say but that must be it. I was thinking poor mum!

You had me going, I was going through the OPs posts and trying to figure out what I was missing so my brain was probably having a break.

beanii · 03/07/2024 15:55

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 08:57

In short, my nephew has been found, alongside a few other boys, to be calling a girl 'butchy' butch. This is their nickname for her and they found it hilarious to call her this. SIL was called into the school by head of year. The boys got nothing but a slap on the wrist, in reality. We suspect because they're all Set 1 (top set) and still in process of doing their mocks.

SIL says this is not enough. And she is punishing my nephew by saying he isn't coming on the family holiday - Which is also the wedding of my sister.

BIL is backing her.

AIBU to think this is too much? By all means yes, the school have been to soft here as a consequence. But, surely this is too much?

It means missing his aunt getting married. She is really upset and cried on the phone to me about this.

Knowing SIL, she is very likely to follow through.

It would mean him staying with his nan. And she would continue onto the holiday as planned with BIL

High chance she will see this thread of course. But the family is really upset. It's a wedding.

Does she secretly want to holiday alone with dh and this is an excuse?

CosyLemur · 03/07/2024 15:44

Creamteasandbumblebees · 03/07/2024 15:29

I think your SIL is doing a great job and I don't think it's your place to question her parenting

My niece was verbally bullied by a group of boys at school when she was 13, she withdrew completely, refused to go to school and started self harming. The school and the boys parents did nothing. Fortunately with great counselling and sympathetic parenting she came out the other side and is now doing well, but the outcome could have been much worse.
Words have consequences and your SIL is making sure her son learns that lesson.
Good on her.

I hope your niece is okay, I went through similar at school and at 43 I'm still affected by it :(

CosyLemur · 03/07/2024 15:42

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 08:57

In short, my nephew has been found, alongside a few other boys, to be calling a girl 'butchy' butch. This is their nickname for her and they found it hilarious to call her this. SIL was called into the school by head of year. The boys got nothing but a slap on the wrist, in reality. We suspect because they're all Set 1 (top set) and still in process of doing their mocks.

SIL says this is not enough. And she is punishing my nephew by saying he isn't coming on the family holiday - Which is also the wedding of my sister.

BIL is backing her.

AIBU to think this is too much? By all means yes, the school have been to soft here as a consequence. But, surely this is too much?

It means missing his aunt getting married. She is really upset and cried on the phone to me about this.

Knowing SIL, she is very likely to follow through.

It would mean him staying with his nan. And she would continue onto the holiday as planned with BIL

High chance she will see this thread of course. But the family is really upset. It's a wedding.

Your nephew is lucky that the girl and her parents went to the school and not the police.
Butch is classed as a homophobic slur - and as such is taken seriously by the police your nephew is very lucky he doesn't have a police record, and the school probably said as much.
Would you still have thought his parents were being too hard on him if the police had have been involved?

CosyLemur · 03/07/2024 15:39

Bunnyannesummers · 28/06/2024 09:09

All that said, if they were using butch as a homophobic slur, then that changes things.

Butch is only ever used as a homophobic slur!

Creamteasandbumblebees · 03/07/2024 15:29

I think your SIL is doing a great job and I don't think it's your place to question her parenting

My niece was verbally bullied by a group of boys at school when she was 13, she withdrew completely, refused to go to school and started self harming. The school and the boys parents did nothing. Fortunately with great counselling and sympathetic parenting she came out the other side and is now doing well, but the outcome could have been much worse.
Words have consequences and your SIL is making sure her son learns that lesson.
Good on her.

beanii · 03/07/2024 14:59

killingpeeve · 28/06/2024 08:58

Just to clarify SIL has been asked to say why this extreme reaction is happening

She says it's because there's no way in hell her son is contributing to a vulnerable young girl developing an eating disorder or other mental damage. She says she 'has to come down on him hard'

Butch means manly/lesbian not fat 🤷🏻‍♀️

So your SIL argument falls flat.

user1492809438 · 03/07/2024 14:59

I am not able to agree or disagree with the punishment as I don't know the child involved, but it seems to me you and your family should be backing your SIL to the hilt, whatever your feelings. You are putting your own concerns and wishes over him learning a hard lesson, his behaviour was appalling. In addition, once a punishment is issued it is fatal not to follow through, the future consequences would be disastrous. Back your SIL and keep your views to yourself.