To think Joe Biden needs to be replaced as a candidate

Gives me some hope about our politics. Both Sunak and Starmer look a zillion times more capable than Biden and Trump. And neither of them plays golf!

It’s too much. People were avoiding it though, you could see on here when his speech and cognitive ability was discussed

Now his decline is more evident and difficult to deal with

I can’t finish watching the videos of him talking, it’s like watching someone in pain. How can’t they think putting him through this is worth it?

They should both be made to sit capacity tests specifically tailored to being fit for office, they would both fail.

Yes I agree Biden was awful. But Trump has also been pretty mad, odd, incoherent in his rallies.

Painful to watch Biden in the early moments but I think Biden got a lot better as the debate wore on. And his record as president is pretty good - done lots of good for US economy which is booming compared to Europe. Trump was a disaster. Who cares if he's a bit doddery as long as he makes the right decisions for US, which he has done so far. Because they are both ex presidents, surely you don't have to go on how they do in a debate. Just compare their records as presidents.

Unfortunately next to Biden in that debate Trump makes more sense

Biden was really bad

I heard a BBC journalist report on a podcast recently that Biden came down to talk to his supporters before some hustings event or other and he mingled with all of them, remembered their names, stayed for two hours, then went on to do the main event which involved a three-hour debate. He said he was totally on point throughout. So I don't think he's quite dead yet!

Are you serious about Trump sounding like he makes senses (even if he outright lies....?!?).

Does this make sense to you?

imo Starmer lacks some of what you list here.

Whether or not I agree with Labour policy you can't really argue that Starmer isn't intellectually capable and competent. He lacks the PR polish and charisma of a Blair, Cameron, Obama or Clinton but he is at least forensically bright, with integrity and public service ethics which might actually be preferable to those more blessed with the gift of the gab.

And I'm saying that from an objective independent not partisan viewpoint. I might have thought similarly of Sunak intellectually when he started but it's clear he's not got what it take as a statesman, leader and party manager to make the grade. He was a better Chancellor. But then who would want to manage the Conservative Party in its current state?

I think Biden suffers from the double whammy that he is struggling to present a fit vigorous image.

He might be able to carry that if he had a popular vice president, but Harris is anything but popular. In fact less popular than Biden.

So it basically comes down to vote for the old bloke that is losing his faculties, and if he dies in office or has to step down, someone who the public thinks is actually worse ends up getting parachuted in.

I think they need to replace him in short order if they want to maintain power.

I agree but in 2000 I said the same thing about not expecting a black president in the next 50 years. Things change quickly. The problem with Harris is the same as the problem with H. Clinton, neither of them are attractive propositions to voters.

The thinking some people seem to have is that because the current male candidates (Trump and Biden) are so utterly shit, a female candidate must automatically be better. That's not true. There are many men who would potentially be better than Biden or Trump and there are plenty of women who wouldn't be.

To get a female president elected, first there needs to be a female candidate who demonstrates to the public that they are vaguely electable. In the same way Obama or (Bill) Clinton were vaguely electable. They were awful in their own way, but you could just about see the logic of voting them into office.

I wonder if he will be

@cupcaske123

"It's crazy that in a country with a population of 333 million,these two are the best they can come up with."

I would add that in a country of 67 million it's crazy that the best they can offer to be PM is Sunak or Starmer.

I think we are witnessing the slow decline of democracy as a form of government.

What stands out in my mind is the quote by Alexander Tytler in the late 1700s and the Tytler Cycle

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."

We may have a couple of useless idiots to choose from, but at least neither is losing their marbles and neither is a dangerous lunatic.

It's crazy that in a country with a population of 333 million,these two are the best they can come up with.

It's unbelievable and shows how utterly incomprehensible their current system is

It's crazy that in a country with a population of 333 million,these two are the best they can come up with.

The thought of that orange menace getting in again is absolutely terrifying, but as time goes on Joe Biden is not looking like a credible, competent candidate either.

The polls suggest that if it was Trump v Newsom then Trump would win convincingly:

www.realclearpolling.com/polls/president/general/2024/trump-vs-newsom

The alternative of Gretchen Whitmer shows a narrower lead for Trump but he would still win.

I think it's now too late for an alternative to Biden who still offers the best polling against Trump but is still behind.

Basically I think that Trump will win.

I see. I originally said that there must be something wrong with US politics because of this situation. Someone said that the situation is similar in the UK to which I responded, who is comparable to the multiple rapist Trump. (In the UK).

I don't think much of Biden and am certainly not excusing any man's mistreatment of others.

The point I was responding to was that you called Trump an alleged rapist. That was the only point you made in your post I quoted.

Are you responding to a different point? I said there was something wrong with US politics for these two to be the only option. I didn't say that I supported him. And I certainly don't support his stance on foreign affairs.

Paul Chuckle would be better than Biden

I know a lot of folk on here think nothing could be worse than Trump. Or does it not really matter who is President as somebody else makes the big decisions anyway and the President is just a figurehead.

I think an essentially decent but mildly incompetent president would be miles better than Trump. Trump is also incompetent, but also dictatorial, criminal, misogynistic, racist, ableist, spoilt, prone to tantrums, and cruel. And stupid.

But I agree that it's gobsmacking that these are the two candidates they've come up with.