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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that customers / members of the public have become increasingly rude post Covid?

114 replies

BusyTeal · 26/06/2024 11:45

Without posting too much info to be outing - I work in a public facing role where I am required to issue reports & other documents to members of the public or companies etc. These documents can take some time to process and (as with many other companies / sectors) we are seeing greatly reduced staffing levels and thus higher volumes of work for existing staff.

Many of my colleagues have mentioned this while we’re together, but it is becoming increasingly more common for members of the public (predominantly) but also other professionals who use our service to send ratty emails and call constantly to moan about the poor service we are providing. Pre-Covid, this was a fairly rare occurrence (maybe once a month) but it’s more like nearly daily now despite being completely transparent about the difficulties our organisation / service is facing. Side note: we have experiences recruitment difficulties long before Covid, in 2018 I was only one of two team members on a team that should have been 8 strong!

Not only are we seeing higher numbers of “complaints” but also the tone of the correspondence is much more tense, often to the point of being blatantly rude, disrespectful and downright offensive to staff and the organisation as a whole.

Am I being unreasonable to see this as a “post Covid” after effect, or have others seen this trend too?

OP posts:
MereDintofPandiculation · 27/06/2024 11:44

spikeandbuffy · 26/06/2024 18:24

@MereDintofPandiculation not really

It's the equivalent of ringing kwik fit and yelling at them because they don't have an MOT slot
You could pick from a thousand other places, it's not bad customer service to say we can't do it because we are full
I don't yell at my hairdresser because he books 4 months in advance

If it's genuinely like quikfit/MoT I agree, it's matters outside your control. But if your organisation is in control of appointments, and can't provide a timely appointment, then that is poor customer service. In some cases (Michelin starred restaurant) people accept the poor customer service, if it's a large central heating company saying, yes we can look at your non-functioning boiler in 8 weeks from now, I think most people would walk away and find another company. Or your GP saying "I need to see that again, make an appointment for three weeks time, and the receptionist saying "sorry, the earliest I can do you is 6 weeks/sorry, you'll have to ring up on the day.

JenniferBooth · 26/06/2024 21:55

PeonySeasons · 26/06/2024 21:11

Yep. My brother has a small gift type business and part of it is selling his products online (the rest is wholesale sales).

The number of people who order on a Saturday night and are furious when nothing arrives on Sunday are unreal. Especially at Christmas.

We had a guy order on 23rd December which was after they closed for Christmas and he ignored the huge warning about it not being shipped until they reopened in the new year - apparently we ruined Christmas for all his kids. I wasn't allowed to tell him to plan ahead next year. Prick.

They don't read any of the information about shipping being done Mon-Fri as a small business!!

This isnt new at all.. I worked for a well known electrical hire business and at Christmas 2003 we had a big banner across the window. Order Sky TV fitted for Christmas by 10th December. End of October that banner was put up. Come 23rd December a bloke came in the shop and moaned and griped that he couldnt order Sky there and then to be fitted on Christmas Eve

PeonySeasons · 26/06/2024 21:11

TroysMammy · 26/06/2024 21:02

You can shop, watch tv, eat, order food online 24/7 but when it comes to things that are not available at the touch of a button people become nasty, entitled and unreasonable. I call it the Amazon effect.

Yep. My brother has a small gift type business and part of it is selling his products online (the rest is wholesale sales).

The number of people who order on a Saturday night and are furious when nothing arrives on Sunday are unreal. Especially at Christmas.

We had a guy order on 23rd December which was after they closed for Christmas and he ignored the huge warning about it not being shipped until they reopened in the new year - apparently we ruined Christmas for all his kids. I wasn't allowed to tell him to plan ahead next year. Prick.

They don't read any of the information about shipping being done Mon-Fri as a small business!!

Topofthemountain · 26/06/2024 21:08

TroysMammy · 26/06/2024 21:02

You can shop, watch tv, eat, order food online 24/7 but when it comes to things that are not available at the touch of a button people become nasty, entitled and unreasonable. I call it the Amazon effect.

I think that is very true. Many things can be delivered within the hour, people just expect that everything will be given to them as soon as they ask.

TroysMammy · 26/06/2024 21:02

You can shop, watch tv, eat, order food online 24/7 but when it comes to things that are not available at the touch of a button people become nasty, entitled and unreasonable. I call it the Amazon effect.

Topofthemountain · 26/06/2024 20:56

Companies & service providers are reaping what they sowed.

There is no need for people to take it out on the staff though.

Livelovebehappy · 26/06/2024 19:53

MariaVT65 · 26/06/2024 14:06

I used to work in complaints for a large company, and nothing you’ve said sounds of of the ordinary. However i think some people are just still angry, and i’m aware that kids’ behaviour has got worse since covid, as people and kids were treated like shit during covid.

How were kids and people treated like shit? I know the kids were homeschooled for large parts of it, but surely parents are responsible for their kids behaviour.

StripedPiggy · 26/06/2024 19:49

Given the shocking decline in levels of customer service across all consumer facing businesses, the rise of useless chatbots, infuriating self-service checkouts, endless waits for calls to be answered, the impossibility of seeing a GP etc etc, it’s hardly surprising that there are more pissed off customers around.
Companies & service providers are reaping what they sowed.

Livelovebehappy · 26/06/2024 19:49

Service though everywhere is abdolutely crap. It went downhill during Covid, and then afterwards companies just maintained poor service. Eg, GPs just had phone consultations during covid, liked it so much that now theyre happy to not physically be in the same room as a patient unless they have to be. Some companies had to work with a skeleton staff during covid, and have just carried on with less staff once covid restrictions lifted.

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 19:40

TiddlyCove · 26/06/2024 19:21

Because they hope people will give up and then they won't have to deal with the enquiry/complaint.

Yes I get that.

But then they get people like me who go straight to Trustpilot with a 1star review after the first unsuccessful communication. And end up with 300 negative social media reviews and even debt collectors onto them, on one occasion.

They still have yo deal with md do why not do it politely and efficiently the first time?

Auburngal · 26/06/2024 19:40

Had customers think it’s disgusting staff shouldn’t have asthma and other life threatening conditions.

Expect fewer staff then

MissAmbrosia · 26/06/2024 19:28

TiddlyCove · 26/06/2024 19:21

Because they hope people will give up and then they won't have to deal with the enquiry/complaint.

It comes down to money. It's one thing that AI should actually improve if done properly.

BusyTeal · 26/06/2024 19:27

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 19:10

So can I ask @Busyteal, I've always wanted to know. Why do organisations persist with the crappy automated phone systems? Do they enjoy winding people up or something? I don't listen to any of it and just cannot be arsed with security questions and just go through to Option 47 or have to receive 45 emails and codes or whatever, thus prolonging the agony for both sides.

It was better 20 years ago without all this digitalised shite.

Good question and I wish I knew the answer! In our organisations case we have one “central” number where a member of customer service will put you through to the correct department, but I know a lot of similar organisations have that system automated. I wonder if that’s a cost cutting exercise as realistically that’s 10 people’s wages (in a company of our size), that can be completely cut out. Or alternatively, the system is so outdated and there are so many departments that new numbers can only be allocated to one “section” of the system. Next time I speak to BT / Sky I will ask the question haha!

OP posts:
TiddlyCove · 26/06/2024 19:21

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 19:10

So can I ask @Busyteal, I've always wanted to know. Why do organisations persist with the crappy automated phone systems? Do they enjoy winding people up or something? I don't listen to any of it and just cannot be arsed with security questions and just go through to Option 47 or have to receive 45 emails and codes or whatever, thus prolonging the agony for both sides.

It was better 20 years ago without all this digitalised shite.

Because they hope people will give up and then they won't have to deal with the enquiry/complaint.

TiddlyCove · 26/06/2024 19:20

Front line staff need higher wages so they can be retained and are motivated to stay and develop in their role.

Chatbots, endless phone menus need to go unless it is the customer's choice to use them.

Customers need to remember that the person serving them is a human being with feelings.

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 19:10

So can I ask @Busyteal, I've always wanted to know. Why do organisations persist with the crappy automated phone systems? Do they enjoy winding people up or something? I don't listen to any of it and just cannot be arsed with security questions and just go through to Option 47 or have to receive 45 emails and codes or whatever, thus prolonging the agony for both sides.

It was better 20 years ago without all this digitalised shite.

SocoBateVira · 26/06/2024 19:06

UnimaginableWindBird · 26/06/2024 18:35

I think that part of the problem is that people want good customer service, with enough staff, but they don't want to pay the higher taxes/ higher prices that would be needed to actually hire more staff, or in many cases, to fund the investment in housing that is needed to retain staff in areas without affordable housing.

That's part of it. Public facing roles are less attractive than they used to be, and people have more choices.

BusyTeal · 26/06/2024 18:59

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 14:38

It's a two-way street, I'm afraid. Nearly all organisations need to radically change the way they speak to people.

I used to be friendly and polite to everyone I spoke to. But all my goodwill has been eroded by call centre queues and protocols.

They need to stop the use of pointless chatbots, AI and the unbearable 3-minute recorded intros with 47 different call options.

And stop saying "Y'ok?". Just. Stop.

End of rant

Haha I’m going to use y’ok from now on for all customer calls 😂 On a serious note though, I totally get the two way street comment - it’s human nature to feel defensive if you start a call / email off on the back foot with someone immediately going for the jugular, and then our tone of voice shifts etc and it just escalates things. Let’s all just be nice 😭😂

OP posts:
BusyTeal · 26/06/2024 18:53

JenniferBooth · 26/06/2024 17:52

Boy are you gonna look stupid when all this comes out.

I had a visit from my housing association income officer on Monday . Insisting we owe rent when we dont.

Get a load of this.

"OneSanctuary SAP is the name of a multi-million pound software system brought in by Sanctuary in 2016, designed for use by all areas of the business. It has been an unmitigated failure, and is a huge drawback of working for this company.
The issues caused by SAP are staggering and difficult to keep track of. Because SHA tried to implement SAP in a cost effective manner, they ended up vastly under-investing in critical elements. There is no tailoring of the generically presented system ('vanilla SAP'), which is an issue as social housing is a unique environment from a service delivery and CRM perspective, whereas vanilla SAP is more geared towards providing a solution for manufacturing industries. Thus, the system uses corporate nonsensical buzzwords and methods of handling accounts which absolutely do not reflect industry practice.
Here are just some examples of the more specific issues faced by staff:
No rent statements have been issued since it was implemented in August 2016, and if a resident insists on a rent statement it has to be prepared manually in a spreadsheet
The rent and calculations for accounts are hard to use, and often completely wrong. Mostly because the system was never designed to understand housing benefit payments, and this has a very convoluted workaround which a computer cannot make sense of.
SAP cannot interface with Local Authorities Housing benefit systems so payments are missed, lost or misattributed
Direct debits do not work reliably, and for a long time following the implementation did not work at all. Front line staff are now preferring standing order.
The front end system of SAP requires far more testing and money spent on it. Each customer account is a total mess of information, with no discernible way to separate notes left between differing departments, with information left by staff often going into the wrong account entirely. This needs looking at as from a compliance (DPA) point of view the breaches are serious
From a usability point of view, the view of a customers account within SAP CIC does not display appropriate information to the user (as stated before this is likely because the system was never designed to be used by a HA) and the user often has to go trawling around back end systems to find obviously relevant data (e.g tenancy start date, account balance, property type etc). This is a seemingly minor but considerable waste of resources"

And just like Horizon and the PO they will not admit that anything is wrong.

He stood at my door on Monday and pretended to look bewildered when i told him i knew all about their SAP. He also gaslighted me when i reminded him that this harassment has been going on for seven years and we have had previous letters demanding rent we dont owe and he had the gall to tell me that they were just general rent increase letters I can read. i know what they are and have kept them all. The first ones are tucked inside my 2017 diary with all the notes about their lies and obfuscation when all this started which is still going on.

I’m so sorry to read this and can totally see why you are frustrated! Even from my perspective as a very tired employee, the members of the public who come to us with evidence, paper trails etc are usually the easiest to help as we have clear evidence in front of us and a timeline to work on - much easier than starting from scratch! Hope it all gets sorted for you soon x

OP posts:
BusyTeal · 26/06/2024 18:50

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 26/06/2024 18:06

Absolutely agree with this - we are lucky in a sense that we have direct phone lines to staff publicised so it’s never a queue situation

As in, people can get straight through, or they have a direct line but it is always engaged/ansafone?

Yes people can get straight through to us (well, I know they definitely do to me the amount my phone rings 😂). We’re currently going through an IT upgrade too - it wouldn’t surprise me at all if some of the phone numbers people have / are floating around online aren’t even “live” anymore (as in, the person who had that phone has left, and the phone is sat in a desk drawer…) But at least we are actively working on it and trying to make things better!

OP posts:
Topofthemountain · 26/06/2024 18:47

I agree OP. This thread has provided many examples of posters justifying rudeness.

I think everyone is just out for themselves, no-one is more in need of the service then they are and it's fine for others to wait, just not them.

UnimaginableWindBird · 26/06/2024 18:35

I think that part of the problem is that people want good customer service, with enough staff, but they don't want to pay the higher taxes/ higher prices that would be needed to actually hire more staff, or in many cases, to fund the investment in housing that is needed to retain staff in areas without affordable housing.

thisfilmisboring123 · 26/06/2024 18:34

Completely agree.

People are rude entitled arseholes.

spikeandbuffy · 26/06/2024 18:24

@MereDintofPandiculation not really

It's the equivalent of ringing kwik fit and yelling at them because they don't have an MOT slot
You could pick from a thousand other places, it's not bad customer service to say we can't do it because we are full
I don't yell at my hairdresser because he books 4 months in advance

JenniferBooth · 26/06/2024 18:16

SlothOnARope · 26/06/2024 18:12

Solidarity @JenniferBooth, I hope you can get this sorted and nail their lying arses.

Thank You Flowers

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