Page 3 | to wonder if a high ponytail sends a message I'm unaware of?

AuntieWithAttitude · 2024-06-21T11:19:48+00:00

I was watching a friend's kid after school and told her about a summer camp where I used to work. We often helped the kids put their hair in 'camper buns'—a messy bun right on top of their heads. She asked me to do it for her, but didn't like it, so we ended up with a super high ponytail instead. She loved it and had fun swishing it around. When her mum saw it, she commented on how high it was and then lowered it. I didn't really think too much of it, until today on TV a character wore a high ponytail, and other characters remarked on how high it was, saying things like 'erm, are you sure you want to wear your hair like that?'. Am I missing something about the significance of high ponytails? I can be bad at this stuff, subtle cues and such, I'm wondering if I've caused offence to my friend somehow. She seemed really weird about it. Don't want to make the same mistake again if I've misunderstood the significance of something.

Original poster

AuntieWithAttitude · 23/06/2024 09:43

@quantumbutterfly I'd really recommend it! They have some in the UK too I think so don't necessarily need to go all the way to the states. I learned a lot about myself, made great friends some of whom I was in business with in later life. Still in touch with some of the campers even (thanks to the connectivity of the modern world!). People went back every summer for years. Was kind of a gentle intro to travelling, we met a group at the airport so flew over together, they told us the transfers/how to get to camp so we had a bit of adventure (rather than being picked up from the airport directly) then had one evening and one day off a week to explore which was lovely. Lots of people travelled afterwards with the people they met. For me it was a great experience.

OP posts:

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 09:29

If people are telling you they understand the world they are either lying or ignoring the bits they don't understand.😁
You say you helped out at a summer camp,. Sounds like a good life experience, I might suggest it to my 18 year old, he's not a happy bunny at the mo' and needs something to take him out of himself.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 09:26

Thanks for update op.

The big takeaway is, whatever she thought, it’s not a biggie and no harm done. It doesn’t sound as though her mum made a huge thing of it either.

If it’s a style thing then it’s just superficial and if it’s the traction alopecia, I don’t think you caused either in that short time. But I respect the fact you were curious and open enough to ask .

MyOliveFox · 23/06/2024 09:24

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 09:09

I think it's about spheres of influence. This generation in particular socialises online, has information at their fingertips , (not always authoritative), no tedious library research for them.
The old adage is..at 16 I knew everything but as I got older I realised how little I knew. Live and learn.
My family and friends range from 90 year olds who still embrace the world to toddlers who find the whole world hilarious or traumatising. It's mainly the teenagers who are a bit jaded but they'll get over it like we did I hope.

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Absolutely agree with you.
The Internet also means that people of all ages are more aware of trends and attitudes of younger generations, in a way they weren't before. It's not a new thing for teenagers to be rebellious and strident in their views.

Original poster

AuntieWithAttitude · 23/06/2024 09:15

User284732 · 23/06/2024 03:15

I'm curious how old you are OP, as high ponies were seen as chavvy and common early to late 90's, as it was a common hairstyle with scrunchies and hairspray for tracksuit wearing youths and working class adults, hence the phrase Croydon facelift and highlighted by comedy sketch shows like Little Britain's Vicky Pollard and Catherine Tate show etc. But I imagine that is quite dated now tbh, as it isn't a common hairstyle anymore. In fact, you are more likely to see a high ponytail on a middle class gym goer these days. Is there an age gap between you and your friend?

We're both in our mid 30's, but I've spent most of my life taking very little notice of fashions and trends. Mostly I've worn the things I like and was happily surrounded by friends who did the same. There probably were those around me who followed the trends but I'm not highly observant, quite like my little bubble, so either I chose not to notice or haven't commited it to memory. Not sure. Based on me now I probably chose not to notice. I don't enjoy shopping so the ebb and flow of charging styles goes over my head. In hindsight theres probably some gratitude which should be felt for growing up in an age without social media where I had the freedom to just be me and not be burdened with whether that was a positive or negative thing or something to be improved.

I mostly wore my hair down (whilst at school and beyond I remember most of my friends doing the same), as I was frequently told by family members that it looked prettier than way, which as I child I translated to mean I didn't look attractive with my hair up so it took me till I was about 34 to be brave enough to start doing that (after therapy). I've never really watched much television so people like the characters named in this thread didn't spring to mind. The thing we were actually trying to create in the moment was the high messy bun, the ponytail was just the end result. My friend wasn't rude or anything in the moment, she just looked very surprised and commented on the hair being high, then a little while later took it down so it obviously bothered her in some way but in the moment I assumed it was just that she wasn't used to seeing her daughter with that style and wanted her to look more like herself (which after this thread I'm inclined to continue thinking tbh), it was only then hearing the multiple references to the ponytail on Grey's anatomy which made me ponder if there was something I was missing. I can often misunderstand things, part of being unobservant I presume, and if a thought pops into my brain sometimes I like to check if I should be learning something about the world which i had previously missed.

Think what I've concluded from this situation is that in Grey's anatomy the hair way commented on because it is associated with a type of character over there which didn't suit the character sporting it (thanks to be person who explained that!) and in the case of my friend she probably just wasn't used to that style on her daughter and so changed it so she looked more like how the mum was used to seeing her. Might have been a headache/traction thing but as someone kindly said that would just be speculation.

Really grateful to all the people who have taken a moment to consider a response and try to help me understand the world a bit better. Doesn't come naturally to all of us but I'm doing my best :)

OP posts:

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 09:09

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:56

Yes I was trying to explain that to my mum the other day. ( She’s now in 70’s and has “grown up “ against” her parents’ generation and watched my generation grow up.) She said ( rightly in my opinion) she finds the difference is that other generations were happy to evolve and accept the differences were of their era. She feels this gen z are more aggressive about telling the whole world that have had it wrong all along and to have no patience for those with different values. This rang true with me as I certainly tried to moderate my language/ conversation etc round my grandparents.

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I think it's about spheres of influence. This generation in particular socialises online, has information at their fingertips , (not always authoritative), no tedious library research for them.
The old adage is..at 16 I knew everything but as I got older I realised how little I knew. Live and learn.
My family and friends range from 90 year olds who still embrace the world to toddlers who find the whole world hilarious or traumatising. It's mainly the teenagers who are a bit jaded but they'll get over it like we did I hope.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:57

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 08:53

Without knowing the mum or child it's all speculation,.
Practically it can cause headaches, traction alopecia, inability to wear a bike or other riding helmet, or even a sunhat.
Socially people get a bit judgy it seems.

Unlikely to be a sexy hairstyle issue (though who knows what people think) or an anti-rapist issue (top tip from the kick boxer - a demo would be good. My prison officer friend says buns instead of ponytails for similar reasons.)

You could always ...ask your friend what the issue was.

I really like the idea of just asking - and updating us!

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:56

MyOliveFox · 23/06/2024 08:47

I think every generation feels that way about younger generations. I'm a millennial and I don't understand some of their attitudes and trends but I don't think I'm supposed to!

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Yes I was trying to explain that to my mum the other day. ( She’s now in 70’s and has “grown up “ against” her parents’ generation and watched my generation grow up.) She said ( rightly in my opinion) she finds the difference is that other generations were happy to evolve and accept the differences were of their era. She feels this gen z are more aggressive about telling the whole world that have had it wrong all along and to have no patience for those with different values. This rang true with me as I certainly tried to moderate my language/ conversation etc round my grandparents.

xxSideshowAuntSallyxx · 23/06/2024 08:54

I've always worn them, never too tight or right on the top, but mine always ends up looking messy as I have curly hair so it does what it wants and I just have to live with it. I have masses of hair and some days(and in the gym) I just need it off my face and the easiest thing is a high pony tail.

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 08:53

Without knowing the mum or child it's all speculation,.
Practically it can cause headaches, traction alopecia, inability to wear a bike or other riding helmet, or even a sunhat.
Socially people get a bit judgy it seems.

Unlikely to be a sexy hairstyle issue (though who knows what people think) or an anti-rapist issue (top tip from the kick boxer - a demo would be good. My prison officer friend says buns instead of ponytails for similar reasons.)

You could always ...ask your friend what the issue was.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:49

CyanideShake · 23/06/2024 03:00

oh shush, you awful bore.

why is mumsnet full of the dullest type of snobs?

the vibes you're giving off are 'suburban mum without an original thought in her little head, who's desperate for approval'

try and be more interesting.

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To be honest, there are worse types in this world.

And shush is rude. Sorry if that code of conduct is too “ suburban” for you, but it is.

MyOliveFox · 23/06/2024 08:47

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:38

Perhaps the “old folk” think gen z is chavvy! 😂

I definitely think some gen z attitudes are a bit off the mark.

Edited to add I didn’t mean that as unkindly as it might have sounded. But gen z attitudes do come with a lot of rejection of things that have gone before, in a way that I think has not been so profound in previous generations.

Edited

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I think every generation feels that way about younger generations. I'm a millennial and I don't understand some of their attitudes and trends but I don't think I'm supposed to!

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:46

Fraa · 23/06/2024 08:43

Agreed. They always dullly troop on to these threads to educate everyone on 'codes', 'tells', and what is 'infra-dig'.

I feel sorry for them to be controlled by something so regressive and narrow minded.

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I think there is a big difference between awareness and understanding and being controlled by something.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:44

CyanideShake · 23/06/2024 03:03

I enjoy mumsnet in the main but quite frequently you're reminded that it's populated with so many sad little Hyacinth Buckets who are obsessed with the class system.

That isn’t untrue BUT this thread actually isn’t about people obsessed with it. It’s about people who were asked to describe a reaction. If the reaction is a class-based one, what do you want us to do? Just say “ I have no idea whatsoever what the issue could be? Nope. Nothing.” 😶🤐

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 08:44

Ever tried changing a box of cat litter with a waist length pony tail, especially a high one?

Fraa · 23/06/2024 08:43

CyanideShake · 23/06/2024 03:03

I enjoy mumsnet in the main but quite frequently you're reminded that it's populated with so many sad little Hyacinth Buckets who are obsessed with the class system.

Agreed. They always dullly troop on to these threads to educate everyone on 'codes', 'tells', and what is 'infra-dig'.

I feel sorry for them to be controlled by something so regressive and narrow minded.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:38

MyOliveFox · 23/06/2024 07:42

A lot of the opinions here feel quite dated! There's a 90s/00s revival for gen z and slicked back ponytails are popular again.

Perhaps the “old folk” think gen z is chavvy! 😂

I definitely think some gen z attitudes are a bit off the mark.

Edited to add I didn’t mean that as unkindly as it might have sounded. But gen z attitudes do come with a lot of rejection of things that have gone before, in a way that I think has not been so profound in previous generations.

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 08:38

PinkSand · 22/06/2024 21:14

Another middle class thread sneering and looking down their noses. The only time middle class people have an opinion.

She said sneerily.

Calliopespa · 23/06/2024 08:36

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 22/06/2024 23:56

Those very low ponytails (tied at nape of neck) can look a bit middle aged.

I think it’s all about something in between.

EverythingYouDoIsaBalloon · 23/06/2024 08:27

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 22/06/2024 23:56

Those very low ponytails (tied at nape of neck) can look a bit middle aged.

Heaven forbid!

quantumbutterfly · 23/06/2024 08:15

GreenTeaLikesMe · 21/06/2024 13:40

In Japan, high ponytails (not tight, but just placed high) are often considered to be a bit "sexy." Some of the schools don't allow them. The nape of the neck is considered a very sexy part of the body, dating back to the days when drawings of beautiful kimono-clad women used to show them at a three-quarter angle from behind, so that the back of the neck was on display.

Wasn't there a little part of the nape with no make up on geisha?

MyOliveFox · 23/06/2024 07:42

A lot of the opinions here feel quite dated! There's a 90s/00s revival for gen z and slicked back ponytails are popular again.

MadameMassiveSalad · 23/06/2024 04:44

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 22/06/2024 23:56

Those very low ponytails (tied at nape of neck) can look a bit middle aged.

Snobbery and now ageism. Lovely 🙄

CyanideShake · 23/06/2024 03:24

846th mention of a croydon facelift.

DingoWoodworm · 23/06/2024 03:24

piperatthegates · 21/06/2024 12:28

I always knew of it as a Croydon facelift. Must be dependant on where you live. But it was also the style favoured by Matt Lucas as Vicky Pollard.

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Haaa yep I’ve always heard it called the Croydon facelift.