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Original poster

6 year child - stranger talking about her penis

434 replies

hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 09:58

Trigger warning : sensitive topic around Gender Identity

I was at a work event (private garden - bring family along deal) and someone there is a transgender woman- she was tall, bearded ,hirsuite and wearing a dress and heels.
My daughter (6) was roaming around with the other kids and i think must have asked the lady why she was wearing a dress.
She explained that she ´was born a man with a willy , and is now a lady ’

Something jarred in me about a grown person talking about gentalia to a 6 year old child.
What does the mumsnet think?
AIBU to be annoyed?

OP posts:
SoupChicken · 21/06/2024 06:49

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

10 years ago it would have been uncontroversial to say this, how did we get to a place where everyone is ignoring their instincts?

EasternStandard · 21/06/2024 06:49

Allshallbewell2021 · 21/06/2024 06:46

I think this interaction clearly illustrates the issue of new gender expression's main areas of conflict.

From a neutral point of view - the guest was being clear about the contradiction between gender presentation and biological origin.

This is the world we are in now and it is either to do with being born with a penis or not being born with one and what that means.

Identity and meaning are not fixed things but our culture is clearly changing and it's uncomfortable for those who feel the status quo is the best quo.

Are you ok with other men, any man not one wearing something non conforming, talking about his genitalia to a six year old?

Allshallbewell2021 · 21/06/2024 06:46

I think this interaction clearly illustrates the issue of new gender expression's main areas of conflict.

From a neutral point of view - the guest was being clear about the contradiction between gender presentation and biological origin.

This is the world we are in now and it is either to do with being born with a penis or not being born with one and what that means.

Identity and meaning are not fixed things but our culture is clearly changing and it's uncomfortable for those who feel the status quo is the best quo.

IndecentPropolis · 21/06/2024 06:41

This reply has been deleted

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IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine · 21/06/2024 06:21

PaulAnkaTheDoggo · 21/06/2024 01:11

Why can’t people just go down the middle and say ‘their’ rather than completely misgendering? Why are people so caught up in ‘sex is determined at birth’ to just accept terminology probably needs a bit of work but being transGENDER IS a thing.

I have a lot of issues with trans women in female spaces, jobs etc. But the deliberate use on this forum to misgender is frankly disgusting. It’s a deliberate point, rather than even attempting to be ambiguous.

To me, and many others, pronouns are based on sex, not gender. This is logical, since pronouns existed long before the nebulous concept of gender as being different from sex.

You may consider me to be misgendering the bearded man with a penis, but I would consider you to be mis-sexing him.

Original poster
hermenmumster · 21/06/2024 06:15

changedusernameforthis1 · 20/06/2024 13:15

That's so unnecessary - if the child had asked why a woman was wearing a dress, would she reply to say that she has a vagina? Highly doubtful.

I'm a transman with my own children, so I'm around other children quite often and sometimes kids have asked questions. My reply is always the same "What do you think? ...Oh, that's an interesting thought, you should see what your Mum/Dad/whoever is with them at the time thinks."

It's people like that who made me turn away from the trans community and continue my journey without their "support" because it's just getting worse.

This is a really interesting insight. Thank you for sharing

OP posts:
Italianita · 21/06/2024 06:14

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Needanewname42 · 21/06/2024 05:25

PaulAnkaTheDoggo · 21/06/2024 01:11

Why can’t people just go down the middle and say ‘their’ rather than completely misgendering? Why are people so caught up in ‘sex is determined at birth’ to just accept terminology probably needs a bit of work but being transGENDER IS a thing.

I have a lot of issues with trans women in female spaces, jobs etc. But the deliberate use on this forum to misgender is frankly disgusting. It’s a deliberate point, rather than even attempting to be ambiguous.

No woman has a beard and penis.

StealthSpinach · 21/06/2024 04:15

PaulAnkaTheDoggo · 21/06/2024 01:11

Why can’t people just go down the middle and say ‘their’ rather than completely misgendering? Why are people so caught up in ‘sex is determined at birth’ to just accept terminology probably needs a bit of work but being transGENDER IS a thing.

I have a lot of issues with trans women in female spaces, jobs etc. But the deliberate use on this forum to misgender is frankly disgusting. It’s a deliberate point, rather than even attempting to be ambiguous.

Because I refuse to lie.
Anyone born a male is forever a male, regardless of their delusions or internal feelings.
Anyone, male or female, can wear whatever clothes they wish.
I have no problem with calling anyone their name (whatever they decide that will be).
I will not use wrong sex pronouns for anyone, as I do not tell lies.

PaulAnkaTheDoggo · 21/06/2024 01:11

Why can’t people just go down the middle and say ‘their’ rather than completely misgendering? Why are people so caught up in ‘sex is determined at birth’ to just accept terminology probably needs a bit of work but being transGENDER IS a thing.

I have a lot of issues with trans women in female spaces, jobs etc. But the deliberate use on this forum to misgender is frankly disgusting. It’s a deliberate point, rather than even attempting to be ambiguous.

Imtheotherguy · 20/06/2024 23:47

Needanewname42 · 20/06/2024 22:20

Exactly I can't even figure out how it would come up in conversation with a man or a woman.
The dress and beard were a complete trap for a child.
It's just wrong.

Show quote history

It’s wrong for an adult to talk about their genitalia with a random child.

It isn’t wrong for a man with a beard to wear a dress (neither does it make him a woman however).

KomodoOhno · 20/06/2024 23:37

RedToothBrush · 20/06/2024 20:11

Question.

How would you feel if this was a woman talking about her bits with a six year old boy?

My point here is focus on the behaviour.

Any adult talking to a six year old, about their bits for whatever reason, raises alarm bells.

The problem isn't that they are trans.

Absolutely. I would definitely take it to HR any adult talking to a child like this is beyond nuts.

Needanewname42 · 20/06/2024 22:20

RedToothBrush · 20/06/2024 20:11

Question.

How would you feel if this was a woman talking about her bits with a six year old boy?

My point here is focus on the behaviour.

Any adult talking to a six year old, about their bits for whatever reason, raises alarm bells.

The problem isn't that they are trans.

Exactly I can't even figure out how it would come up in conversation with a man or a woman.
The dress and beard were a complete trap for a child.
It's just wrong.

Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 21:52

@Needanewname42
i agree too. I will be doing this. Thank you

OP posts:
Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 21:50

Fireangels · 20/06/2024 19:29

“Unfortunately I do not have the guts to go to HR who as I have mentioned this government organisation is very Stonewall leaning.
My daughter will not be helped if I get it wrong and somehow mess up my career. Also as this was OUTSIDE of work (ie a social, hosted bu a colleague but not paid for by work) they could just not get involved”

Even if you’re not in the workplace and you are ‘off the clock’, if work colleagues are at an event, employment law still applies. Of course it’s up to you to decide whether or not bring the matter to the attention of your employers, but in my opinion a formal warning from your employer would be appropriate.

Thank you . I hadn't considered this about employment law as it wasn't a "work do" officially but more of a friendly social hosted by a v kind colleague

OP posts:
Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 21:48

@RedToothBrush
I don't know if that is right or wrong, it is just how I feel in my gut

OP posts:
Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 21:47

RedToothBrush · 20/06/2024 20:11

Question.

How would you feel if this was a woman talking about her bits with a six year old boy?

My point here is focus on the behaviour.

Any adult talking to a six year old, about their bits for whatever reason, raises alarm bells.

The problem isn't that they are trans.

Good question.

If it was a grown woman to a little boy i would find that very inappropriate and assume the woman was a bit drunk or very awkward or something. Or perhaps showing off.
I wouldnt be "worried".

The fact that a willy was discussed by a person who looked very male to a little girl (or boy) makes me feel worried

OP posts:
Needanewname42 · 20/06/2024 21:46

IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine · 20/06/2024 20:51

I meant you should warn them so they know to keep their children away from him in future. If he's behaved this inappropriately with a child once, he absolutely will again.

Show quote history

Totally agree.
Unfortunately I don't believe this was a one off either.

Telling people is how people tried to keep kids safe in the past.
X is a dirty old man, stay away from him. Don't ever go into that man's house, just because, I don't trust him.

Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 21:45

@IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine
Yes, good point.

OP posts:
IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine · 20/06/2024 20:51

hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 20:02

Sorry @IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine
Pressed send too early. My daughter was the only child there when that conversations occured. There were other other adults there too. Her little friends were a few metres away.
For some reason i haven't felt able to raise it with colleagues yet

I meant you should warn them so they know to keep their children away from him in future. If he's behaved this inappropriately with a child once, he absolutely will again.

Needanewname42 · 20/06/2024 20:30

hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 20:02

Sorry @IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine
Pressed send too early. My daughter was the only child there when that conversations occured. There were other other adults there too. Her little friends were a few metres away.
For some reason i haven't felt able to raise it with colleagues yet

Op you need to raise this somewhere. The next time it might not just be a CHAT about the penis.

You either make the other colleagues aware esp those with children. Or you tell HR.

They should be aware that a member of staff was discussing their penis with a 6 year old child. Before HR or someone else organises another family event.

YellowAsteroid · 20/06/2024 20:14

YANBU. The man was out of order.

RedToothBrush · 20/06/2024 20:11

Question.

How would you feel if this was a woman talking about her bits with a six year old boy?

My point here is focus on the behaviour.

Any adult talking to a six year old, about their bits for whatever reason, raises alarm bells.

The problem isn't that they are trans.

Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 20:02

Sorry @IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine
Pressed send too early. My daughter was the only child there when that conversations occured. There were other other adults there too. Her little friends were a few metres away.
For some reason i haven't felt able to raise it with colleagues yet

OP posts:
Original poster
hermenmumster · 20/06/2024 20:00

IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine · 20/06/2024 18:36

It's just occurred to me that some of your colleagues may also have young children- I would have a quiet word with them if you feel able to.

@

OP posts: