Terrorists' vandalising Stone Henge and trying to force govt policy

and there's alot more to the industrial revolution than just those

and hopefully the security services are watching their every action

I will join you with my empty cornflour canister in a minute.

Maybe I need to break it down further since it’s apparently such a difficult concept to grasp.

Imagine lying under a duvet, in the sun on a hot day. You will feel hotter than if you were lying there without the duvet, right? Well the duvet is the CO2 released into the atmosphere from all the carbon we’re burning.

I lost the will. I am ready to sleep (I mean lie down in the field and wait for the horse!).

I thought the same. In the end I gave it a go but probably shouldn’t have bothered.

Oh and if it has been proved that humans cause climate change then the ice ages that happened before we evolved must have been caused by dinosaurs with private planes and coal fired power stations.

That’s like saying cancer existed before smoking so smoking can’t cause cancer.

Yes, fluctuations have always existed. However, we are now burning masses of carbon which enters the atmosphere as CO2 and traps energy from the sun. At the same time, we are destroying rainforests which would otherwise have dealt with some of this excess CO2, as well as paving over increasing amounts of the planet which compounds the warming effect. This is reflected in data which show a steep rise in temperatures following the Industrial Revolution. If you think of natural changes in climate as a campfire, we’re pouring petrol on it.

Oh well found. Hadn’t seen that but makes sense.

Workhouses weren’t so bad you know…😉

It's not a big if at all.

I don’t even know which bit of that nonsense to debunk first. So I don’t think I’ll bother. Anyone with critical thinking skills who learns from more sources than social media and the Daily Fail will know what bunkum and claptrap that is. May be someone else will have the energy.

Absolutely. Way too slow. And getting candidates elected in the face of such a catastrophic emergency is like seeing a fire and sitting down to plan how to put it out. The time for planning how to put the fire out has passed. We just need to put the bloody fire out. No more dithering.

That’s not the point. With my roof caving in analogy the shouty builders aren’t shouting to draw in passers by to support their aim, they are shouting at me to take action as I’m the only one who can. The flaw in my analogy is that in it, I’m also the one effected most by my roof caving in. I need a new analogy now. Bugger.

But the point is direct action or civil disobedience is not about getting the public on your side.

As I already said above, green politicians have been doing this for decades and it isn’t enough.

And what do you think the environmental and nature NGOs have been doing for the past 40 years? Presenting petitions, presenting research to parliamentary committees, but the pace of change is glacially slow. Too slow.

"Sometimes needs must" = "I can break any law if I really want to"

Imagine if their next idea was working their way down your street destroying cars that use oil. Those supporting them now would be be calling the police quick enough.

Oh and if it has been proved that humans cause climate change then the ice ages that happened before we evolved must have been caused by dinosaurs with private planes and coal fired power stations.

We do need to clean up our act as we do pollute, but the Just Stop Oil vision of a society with a handful of survivors living on berries is not for me. So I want them to face riot shields and batons and long prison sentences.

And I want oil use to carry on until we find real alternatives. Not the gimmicky nonsense we are being saddled with now.

As a PP said, what do you think the Greens have been doing?

So rather than standing for parliament to get elected and influence government policy it's more effective to throw powder on a snooker table?

I think the Make Britain Great Again style government of the last decade really hasn’t helped with this. I think many people would welcome a return to the Britain of the Industrial Revolution.

80% of people want their government to take stronger climate action. See
https://www.undp.org/press-releases/80-percent-people-globally-want-stronger-climate-action-governments-according-un-development-programme-survey

We will have to agree to disagree there I think. I just simply don’t understand why more people aren’t doing the same kind of thing. We are being completely f’d over by the powers that be and anger a protest really are the only sane response and if I could afford to get arrested I’d be joining them.

JSO’s aim isn’t to try to influence public opinion. It’s to get the government to stop approving new oil projects.

So how's the influencing of public opinion going? Getting the public on your side ?

Can you feel the groundswell of support?

There isn’t time though, that really IS the point. We have had decades to act and now it’s not a far off possible threat now, it’s already happening - every week there is something happening somewhere on the globe that’s to do with climate change and very little of it (if any) is good).

In my analogy of the roof about to cave in on top of me, would you tell the shouty structural engineer to go take a week to draw up a five point plan for what he thinks I should do? If you care about me under my about to collapse roof and you see them all shouting at me to get out, you’d join them and start shouting too (I’d hope 😬).

No, you're missing the point. It hasn't. Talking and coverage are not achievements or positive things in themselves. They can make things worse not better. It's not that people don't understand your argument, it's that we think it is total bollocks.

Also, it doesn't actually matter whether people being actively deterred from environmentalism by JSO is objectively stupid. You don't get to excuse yourself from the consequences of your actions by arguing that people should've felt differently about it.

Some protesters were recently convicted for damaging windows of a bank that has been bankrolling oil drilling. And JSO also targeted private jets. So they do, but actions involving monuments and art works capture the press’s attention more.