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Original poster

VAT on nursery fees and university fees

46 replies

DontShow · 14/06/2024 07:57

Talking through legality of labour introducing vat to private schools. Education is a non vat able service, so if they are changing that, then will they have to apply vat to nursery or university fees.

Removing the charitable status is one thing, but there are other places that offer private educational provision but aren't chariti3s.

Anyway, aibu to think in any eventuality there will be legal arguments in the courts for while before anything can be introduced......

OP posts:
DogInATent · 14/06/2024 08:37

VAT rules already manage to distinguish between different types of educational establishment - for example FE colleges are not VAT exempt, private tutoring is exempt under some circumstances and not others. Tax rules are already a complex, flexible, and adaptable thing. If HMRC can legally distinguish between a Jaffa cake and a digestive for VAT, they can make it work for private education.

All this scaremongering is coming from two directions:

  • Those with a vested interest in private education.
  • General ignorance of how things work. Every election people suddenly take a fleeting interest in things that they've previously never cared enough about to understand and wouldn't give a toss about if they passed it on the street. It's like a plane crash, when suddenly everyone on social media becomes a plane crash expert.
charitynamechange · 14/06/2024 08:33

So funny. In real life this just isn't a conversation. I have friends who are doctors, artists, have PhDs, teachers, farmers, receptionists and more. A few did educate their children privately. Most (like us) didn't. Yet not once have any of them wrung their hands over this. Yet on MN it seems to be an obsession. Which I suppose nails the demographic on here.

2thumbs · 14/06/2024 08:30

OP, are you a solicitor or have you had any legal training?

Babyandnewjob · 14/06/2024 08:28

Private schools are totally different to nurseries (which working parents need) and universities (where student finance helps academic students who need financial help although the interest keeps going up). Private education is not a right.

Scaevola · 14/06/2024 08:26

This is nothing to do with charitable status.

EU law banned tax on education.

Post-Brexit, we are not bound by that. Removing the principle of "no taxation on education" does indeed open the way to taxing fees for other age groups. There are however no plans at present from any party to do that

paasll · 14/06/2024 08:24

I think the whole thing of this VAT may quietly be put to bed after labour get into office. Too much legal wrangling, not enough money raised (if any), awful precedent and subsequent consequences for other things, such as wrap around care, swimming lessons etc. My opinion, and I may well be very wrong, is that the VAT on privates won’t happen.

PinkFrogss · 14/06/2024 08:23

DontShow · 14/06/2024 08:21

Yes, but singling them out it could be argued is unfair/unlawfully....

Show quote history

Something being considered unfair by some is not the basis of a legitimate legal challenge though.

Who are you expecting to start these legal arguments?

Original poster
DontShow · 14/06/2024 08:22

DaniMontyRae · 14/06/2024 08:21

Could you not have added this to one of the hundred threads on VAT and private schools?

Could you not have replied to them?

OP posts:
Original poster
DontShow · 14/06/2024 08:21

Catza · 14/06/2024 08:18

I think you are probably right and it "could" be challenged in courts. I am no legal expert but it appears that only "eligible body" is able to claim VAT exemption on education fees. So, I am guessing, it is just a matter of legislating for the private schools to be somehow ineligible.
ETA: out of interest, I found this article. So, technically, private schools should fall under private tuition provider and the only reason they are not paying VAT is due to their charitable status.
https://www.marcusward.co/vat-education-what-precisely-is-exempt/

Edited

Yes, but singling them out it could be argued is unfair/unlawfully....

OP posts:
DaniMontyRae · 14/06/2024 08:21

Could you not have added this to one of the hundred threads on VAT and private schools?

Summerfreezemakesmedrinkwine · 14/06/2024 08:21

There's no political appetite for this. It isn't going to happen.

SaltySeaCat · 14/06/2024 08:21

Charitable status isn’t being removed….

PinkFrogss · 14/06/2024 08:21

Catza · 14/06/2024 08:14

That wasn't what the OP was saying or asking. Read to the end of the post before jumping to conclusions.

Show quote history

Well is there any evidence of an appetite to change VAT for any other eduction setting? If no, then why would there be a lengthy legal argument about it?

There’s lots of times one specific thing is changed, added, or removed. That doesn’t mean there’s always a lengthy legal argument about similar things Confused

I think Labour have made a lot of promises based on funding from VAT so they’ll be anxious to get it changed quickly. I’m sure they’ve already though through all the legal implications and the process.

Spirallingdownwards · 14/06/2024 08:19

OVienna · 14/06/2024 08:08

Do people not know that the vast majority of UK universities are 'state schools' ? This is not a thing.

Actually they are not.

Catza · 14/06/2024 08:18

I think you are probably right and it "could" be challenged in courts. I am no legal expert but it appears that only "eligible body" is able to claim VAT exemption on education fees. So, I am guessing, it is just a matter of legislating for the private schools to be somehow ineligible.
ETA: out of interest, I found this article. So, technically, private schools should fall under private tuition provider and the only reason they are not paying VAT is due to their charitable status.
https://www.marcusward.co/vat-education-what-precisely-is-exempt/

Original poster
DontShow · 14/06/2024 08:17

OVienna · 14/06/2024 08:08

Do people not know that the vast majority of UK universities are 'state schools' ? This is not a thing.

No, most universities have a charter and are legally different entities to state schools.

It's a huge area, and my title probably should have ended with a question mark

OP posts:
Catza · 14/06/2024 08:14

PinkFrogss · 14/06/2024 08:10

More scaremongering….

Do you have any evidence that VAT will be added to any education setting besides private schools?

That wasn't what the OP was saying or asking. Read to the end of the post before jumping to conclusions.

PinkFrogss · 14/06/2024 08:10

More scaremongering….

Do you have any evidence that VAT will be added to any education setting besides private schools?

OVienna · 14/06/2024 08:08

Do people not know that the vast majority of UK universities are 'state schools' ? This is not a thing.

Original poster
DontShow · 14/06/2024 08:05

I've not seen many legal arguments discussions tbh....?

OP posts:
BusyCM · 14/06/2024 08:03

Oh yay! I don't think we've discussed this topic yet!