To think if you can no longer afford school fees...

The key phrase @dunkdemunder was 'trying to buy privilege'

And the reality is that no matter how great the state school, private schools do confer benefits, inevitably. Smaller classes, better facilities, etc. I don't doubt that many of them can offer a lot more than the increasingly-deprived state sector can.

Even the best state school can't compare, sadly.

But overlay that, the whole ethos that, somehow, private is a 'better class' of education and you can see why we end up with the kind of people who are now running our government.

"How? If the poster sends their dc state, that's going to cost the taxpayer thousands and save the poster thousands."

They were sending their child to school that was VAT free, so no money went to the tax payer. Holidays, days out etc etc, all attracts VAT.

They are also paying tax so they are paying for it too, it isn't "you lot" funding it.

DS catchment state secondary in 2015 was single sex. As mentioned Yorkshire. No state grammars up here. (They have to go if we're levelling education.)

Private education is one of the biggest drivers of inequality in the UK, with a massively disproportionate amount of those privately educated holding the top jobs. This is despite there being no long term educational benefit to them. The half a grade uplift at A level being wiped out by the time they graduate.

We only have to look at places like Finland to see how much better off we'd be without them. But to get to that place needs investment that none of our main parties are prepared to make.

Economise and make sacrifices. Just like poor people do to survive.

For me it’s the principle, I already pay a significant amount of tax on my earnings for services I don’t get a lot of benefit from (as a result of private healthcare, private schooling). Education cannot, from my perspective, be put into the same category as other services we pay VAT on. This is why the EU made education emempt from tax. Why should the state dictate where I spend my money after tax? Why target a very specific group of people who already contribute so much financially? And this isn’t poor
me as I’m lucky enough to easily afford the increase.

In that case, we should stop parents buying books (in fact why not add VAT onto them), paying for tutors or extra curricular activities. After all, all those things give a child an advantage.

@TheRealSlimShandy

" I cannot see any other possibly reason people would be rubbing their hands with glee over children’s lives being so disrupted."

Then you haven't been following the threads full of threats from PE parents.

How? If the poster sends their dc state, that's going to cost the taxpayer thousands and save the poster thousands.

Bloody hell, have I left Mumsnet and moved over to 4chan.

This thread is fucking awful.

Jealously really does bring out the worst in people. And you can say what you like but it is jealousy. I cannot see any other possibly reason people would be rubbing their hands with glee over children’s lives being so disrupted.

@BIWI

Because I don't agree with people trying to buy privilege. Is that so hard to understand?
But if your state school is so fantastic then what privilege are they buying?
So many people like you keep saying state schools are fantastic. Full of super bright dc and the pampered private school dc are going to get a surprise when they realise they are not ahead and state schools are not crap.

So what privilege are they buying then?

Honestly if it were me I’d be looking at my closest grammar, if I had multiple kids I’d make sure I was in the catchment area.

There are going to be fewer opportunities at grammar schools for kids like me who weren’t tutored and weren’t in catchment. Yeah great, brilliant idea.

@Another76543 choosing to eat caviar or travel first class is a completely different thing.

We're talking about issues that affect the general level of equality of opportunity in society when we talk about private vs state education. People who choose to go private believe that they're buying privilege. Nobody should be able to buy privilege over their fellow man. Or child.

Education is a tiny part of “privilege”. A child having a safe, warm house is a privilege. Being fed a healthy nutritious meal is a privilege. Having parents who take an interest in education, who help with homework, buy books, that’s a privilege. Parents who can afford tutors, day trips, foreign holidays, extra curricular activities, that’s a privilege. Some children being able to access amazing state schools whilst other struggle through in failing schools, that’s a privilege. There are far deeper inequalities in society than a few percent of children attending fee paying schools (many of whom have been failed by the state system for whatever reason).

"Best bit - you lot fund it."

Actually, you do too, it won't make any difference to the average tax payer. Thanks for all the extra consumption though, means you are actually contributing more to the exchequer than you were before.

I'm so sorry to hear this. I feel for you both so much.

I doubt the dc think anything. They are just dc who get sent to school by their parents. If they mice schools then they'll just go there instead.

The difference is the grammar chooses the kids.

How on earth has society become like this, when people are laughing at others, mocking their choice of children’s names, and making childish comments? It’s a sorry state of affairs when people are showing such glee at the thought of children being disrupted. Why on earth can people just be civil to each other, accept that people make different life choices (be that a bigger house, nicer car, once in a lifetime holiday, private school etc)? For those who are spending their money on a foreign holiday this year, I’m sure there’d be plenty of complaints if you were suddenly hit with a 20% tax penalty which you suddenly had to find. There will always be people better off than you. There’s little to be achieved in feeling bitter about the fact that some fly around in private jets from mansion to mansion for example. Feeling resentful about the fact that “it’s not fair” isn’t a path to a happy life.

If this policy was going to raise a decent amount of money, then perhaps it would be seen more favourably by some that currently oppose it. The fact is it isn’t. Even the IFS have now said that the amount raised will be tiny. They’ve said “don't be fooled into thinking this is going to make any real difference to the amount of money available for public services.” The policy is not about making economic sense. It’s an ideological one.

There are plenty of other areas of life where we could tweak VAT and raise more substantial funds. Cake is currently free of VAT for example. And caviar. Should we tax education but not cake and caviar? Air passenger duty is currently far lower than the VAT equivalent. Why not add VAT onto air fares? Those flying first class to Australia currently only pay around £200 in tax. That’s a fraction of the potential VAT on the fare.

@Willyoujustbequiet

You're in a minority if you're luckily enough for your DC with SEN to be well supported by a state school.

Yes there are pockets of good provision, but SEN is in crisis across the UK with massive underfunding; a massive backlog; staff barely able to scratch the surface of the demand for their services etc etc etc - on top of a teacher recruitment and retention crisis.