To think if you can no longer afford school fees...

"In general, mainstream private schools are very good at supporting children with what I would call minor SEN, on the dyslexic or dyspraxic spectrum, high performing ASN or mostly controlled ADHD. "

This is very true, often children who do not qualify for an ECHP in state school. There is also then the issue of private diagnosis. There is also a higher percentage of students in private schools that have special considerations for exams.

In general, mainstream private schools are very good at supporting children with what I would call minor SEN, on the dyslexic or dyspraxic spectrum, high performing ASN or mostly controlled ADHD. They have zero desire to take on disruptive pupils, regardless of the cause for the disruptiveness.

The above is often why parents choose them.

It is hard to defend inclusive SEN teaching in the state sector and choose a private school which doesn’t have to worry about it.

At one of the schools I used to teach at, there were about 100 (out of 600 odd) on the SEN list, but the majority of them had no formal diagnosis and a fair few were, in (polite) old fashioned terminology, just not academic. The ‘Head of academic mentoring’ (this is new popular private school term for SEN person) was constantly battling with parents to keep the list down to a size that actually made it possible to help those with genuine need (if you teach a class of 24 and 10 claim SEN, it is impossible to remember who they are or help them).

I wonder if it's area dependent, because my son, my great nephew, my cousins son, and several of my friends kids didn't find the process of getting a ECHP or even the relevant diagnosis torturous or gruelling, this was across different trusts and LAs, although in the same region of the country.
It seems stupid how there mustn't be a set process for this across the board and it seems to be harder for some.

You know that is wrong. Stop denying it. Given the tortuous process to get an ECHP soke parents give up and find an independent place to support their child’s need without an ECHP in place.

But the most vulnerable do have them, yes there will be some who don't, but again the majority are protected.

No because as you well know lots of vulnerable children with SEN in both state and independent schools don’t have an ECHP because the process of getting one is so tortious.

To be fair, if I could afford private for mine it would be a no brainer. The state school mine go to isn't bad, but there seemingly are a few deeply problematic kids that can be highly disruptive, and are disrupting those who want to do well and the teachers hands seem tied in dealing with them. Private seems to be a much better learning environment.
I'd be upset if I suddenly couldn't afford it, but moaning on and on, on a forum (and not on the correct board) where the vast majority couldn't afford it pre VAT, does come across as first world privileged problems. Equally starting a thread, again on an unrelated board, to say it's tough is just as bad.

"As has already been pointed out to you there are lots of DC in private schools with SEN who don’t have an ECHP. It’s only those with an ECHP that will be exempt."

So the most vulnerable are being protected?

Thanks for confirming.

As has already been pointed out to you there are lots of DC in private schools with SEN who don’t have an ECHP. It’s only those with an ECHP that will be exempt.

How many teachers per school are the Labour Party proposing? I know the answer but do you?!

@notbelieved

I agree. There are so many wrong things with teaching atm. The biggest one, for me, is current teachers involved in training PGCE and NQT level teachers act as gatekeepers.

I've always been very sympathetic and not demanded perfection, but in my last years in the state, I was asked to take over NQT and PGCE training on several occasions. Trainees who had been given no real help or advice, but asked to produce schemes of work and LPs that a qualified teacher would never do, and never were asked to do.

There is a reason that so many trainees leave and its the lack of support, and gatekeeping inside the profession that causes it.

I was the subject lead for a London borough, and went into schools who asked " why do my teachers in this subject keep leaving?". Because you overloaded a 24 year old and made them HOD because you had no one else at 24. 1 year after NQT.

Oh and Labour are proposing to improve the number of teachers, which will fix many of the issues that cause difficulties in the state sector

Look, I will be voting Labour for many reasons but their stance on education isn't one of them. I'll also be the proverbial turkey voting for Xmas as an independent school teacher. Labour will not suddenly, or even slowly, magic up the 6,000 teachers they think will fix the problem in the state system. It requires a massive overhaul, a shift in societal mindset about what is good for children and a fundamental change in how we treat teachers. Give it 10 years with an exbog standard teacher leading. We'd then have state education to be proud of

I don't know why that post put A rather than A star.

I know of a candidate who got into Yale, Stanford, Cornell, Brown, Georgetown, and Duke.

She had EVERYTHING, school government, sport, drama, volunteering ( consistently and impactful, the Ivies won't take notional). She also had a 1590, A level predicted of all A and an already achieved A at EPQ. Plus a string of 9s at GCSE.

I also know of highly academic children from other backgrounds, with similar scores, who have all the academics, plus meaningful internships in the field ( including be named as an author in a publication at 15). Who didn't have the whole "all rounder" thing.

What people never acknowledge with the Ivy league is that the admissions criteria is very skewed towards those who come from socio-economic backgrounds that can support all the involvement they require.

Whilst it is merit based, it isn't merit based on everything.

‘Where did I say they were retired? They are paying out of an inheritance. ‘

ah of course.
My mistake, PROPER generational wealth where even the grandparents have spare
cash from inheritance.
Gosh, IS there no end to the suffering?? You should try to get their plight highlighted on coverage of the ‘issue’ - I’m sure once people hear of this they’ll absolutely start caring about the possibility of private school fees going up.
i mean, if ones grandparents inheritance money can even cover it, what hope
is there?

‘Normal schools don’t generally have the ability to get Ivy League universities in the states, who offer huge and generous sports scholarships, ‘

No school does - Ivy League schools don’t offer sports scholarships.
Other USA universities do - but they take children from ALL walks of life and the school doesn’t get them in -
genuine proven talent and drive does -
along with playing Jr Wimbledon for tennis, or
playing for your national football team as a teen, as Alessia Russo did.

There are very clear pathways to
sporfs scholarships in the USA which start when kids are13/14… being posh and mummy and daddy having sent you to the right school holds a lot less
sway.
But as then young sportsman you were referring is very talented ( and deffo not just playing against other posh schools) he’ll be fine.

"t doesn’t cost anything to understand that and have a bit of sympathy."

I think everyone has sympathy. It is not ideal.

It looks as if you'll have till the 25/26 academic year to sort something out though.

"Normal schools don’t generally have the ability to get Ivy League universities in the states, who offer huge and generous sports scholarships, often covering tuition and then some in full, to take interest in their students, however academically or physically talented."

Well, neither do UK privates, none of the Ivies offer sports scholarships, or even merit scholarships of any kind.

For foreign pupils at Harvard, Princeton, Dartmouth and Yale (and from this year Brown) there is the possibility of getting need based scholarships. Pirnceton aim offer anyone under 80k (GBP) per year (100 USD) a full ride. However, the rates of getting into these colleges are far lower than Oxbridge, and actually far more competitive because they receive more applications. On top of that, the actual admissions rate is lower than stated because of legacy applications/Deans list/Staff children. At Harvard this makes up 42% of all white students!

So funny. I trained as a teacher under labour. They were filling shortages then too. Offered thousands of pounds for us to train. At the time something like 30% of teachers were quitting in the first 5 years because it was so bad.

Teachers don’t just quit under Tory governments. Can’t wait to see how they plan on filling the gaps. Suspect it’ll be with unqualified staff.

Where did I say they were retired? They are paying out of an inheritance. That’s how the money has been set aside already, with standard annual fee increases factored in - not increases plus 20%.

You don’t feel sorry for the kids who have a dad on 8 figures. Why would you? Their school fees are covered. I’ve just given them as an example of kids from working class backgrounds in private school. Nothing changes for them. School fees are court ordered, even if he drags his feet over settling the bill.

Yes normal schools have sports. Normal schools don’t generally have the ability to get Ivy League universities in the states, who offer huge and generous sports scholarships, often covering tuition and then some in full, to take interest in their students, however academically or physically talented.

They won’t dump his bursary but the bursary doesn’t cover the full fees. I don’t know of any that do.

You know. Opportunities that state schools can’t offer. None of the ones I’ve worked in have had anything that comes close.

Going to state school isn’t awful.

Changing schools in year 9/middle of GCSEs/at any time really is pretty awful. Having to leave all your friends and go to a school where you don’t know anyone is pretty awful (for any teenager, not least ones that are going to end up getting picked on for being posh or pov, take your pick). Trying to find a space in established friendship groups, at the time your social life is starting to take off. Pretty awful. The change in culture is awful. I’ve actually worked with kids who moved to state school after being in boarding schools (parents in the military or worked in oil for example). I usually ended up working one to one with them. Might seem minor to you, it’s not to a teenager. These are formative years. It doesn’t cost anything to understand that and have a bit of sympathy. They don’t control the finances.

Have any schools announced the likely impact on fees yet? There seems to be a lot of labouring about Year 13's having to leave, along with grandchildren, budding sport stars and numerous state school refusers.

This has been mooted for years, why haven't the schools given out better (any?) information.

They’re saying SEN but only with an EHCP.

"V And it can be done without impacting the most vulnerable pupils in private schools." Aren't the most vulnerable people in private schools the ones with SEN who are being protected?

Oh and Labour are proposing to improve the number of teachers, which will fix many of the issues that cause difficulties in the state sector.

You are absolutely right that there needs to be a massive investment in state schools but that is not what Labour are proposing. And it can be done without impacting the most vulnerable pupils in private schools.

My child isn’t speshal and as I said in the last line of that particular post, I am not sending my dd to private school to have a superior education or for her advantage, I’m sending her there to get an education as she couldn’t cope in state. And I have explained what I meant by the demographic in a later post. Perhaps doing a ‘see all of Mummyoflittledragons’ post would help explain dd’s situation. I’m the one with the mentally ill child, ie anorexic child, which is largely caused by not coping with her medical condition, where her heart stops beating when triggered. She is anything but ‘speshal’ and does not deserve to be described in this manner. She has additional needs not catered for properly in her former school. I also had issues at state primary but it was easier to fight the head at a medium sized primary than at a secondary with 1500 kids.

Who has an irrational hatred of private schools?

"I choose to spend my monies on making my children happy and educated in different ways - my monies, my choice-I sacrifice thigns for this choice but it is my choice, it is not a luxury, it was a necessity for my child physical and mental health"

So does everyone that has children. For the most part (except for kids clothes) they pay VAT on these purchases.