VAT on private health

So let's create opportunities for there to be less of the poor. Let's hold our governments accountable for that

Some people would support the 'rich' paying VAT on Healthcare but would not support paying £15 for an outpatient appointment that costs £160 conservatively? The same 'rich' that already pay sometimes over 60% of their income.

What I have learnt is these sorts of people simply want to spend other people's money. The concept of fairness is broken. The government needs to provide infrastructure and an environment to enable everyone to be able to do fruitful, productive work and benefit from that work. Then the populace can focus on maximising the opportunities they create. That is what we should be pushing for.

Not 'how can we keep doing what we are doing and make sure those guys over there pay for what we want' - whether private health, school, fancy cars or whatever

There is. In my village we have 1 bus every 2 hours, starts at 8am, last one about 6pm. So works perfectly for shift workers!!!!

Actually a lot of healthcare is preventative and your background plays a large part in how long you're likely to live/ how reliant on healthcare you'll be. The people who are likely to need the most significant input from healthcare, are unlikely to be those who can afford private.
Education is similar. Yes all those things are available and lovely. But it's very unlikely those who most need them will access them. That's putting aside things like psychological blocks which are often caused by being raised in environments with low aspirations/unmet SEN needs.
Either way, the poor almost always pay the biggest price.

Education is also freely available by using libraries and the Internet - much more so than when I was at school when you were out of luck.if the library didn't have it. It's possible to give yourself quite a good education in some things at least free of charge, if you have the literacy, the time and are motivated.

The same definitely cannot be said of healthcare. DIY is definitely not generally possible or desirable there!

But that's like the people who have put their children into private school because they're being bulled to the point that they are suicidal/struggling with unmet SEN, and parents feel they have no choice but to move them out of the state system.

In reality, I think inequality in health and literal life and death is more unfair and unreasonable than inequality in education tbh. It is more important that everyone has access to the highest quality of health care regardless of means than the highest quality of education.

It's easy to make arguements like "why should life only be available to those that can afford to pay for it" until your child has cancer and the only way to save them is to pay, then watch all those arguments go out the window you'll do anything to save your child.
Extreme example but it happens.
As for education I went to a regular school just like the other 93% of the population and I thought it was pretty fine and dandy. My kids go to a regular school too and haven't had any problems.
It cannot be compared to healthcare it just can't 🤷🏻‍♀️

When people talk about European health insurance systems I never really understand why this would be better. I mean compulsory insurance is a tax by any other name isn't it? The only reason that European countries have better health systems is that they spend more whether that's from general taxation or insurance what's the difference?

Yh I'm not following politics and don't get involved but I did see that and thought, wow. Your political career is more important than yours and your families health/life? It shocked me tbh. And let's be real, he's not going to be sitting around on waiting lists is he.

We don't tax anything like as much as mainland Europe does, so we look to low tax economies for answers.... the UK wants it all on the cheap and as my ole Granny would have said "Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"

It all ends up costing us far more.

"this attitude" has been around since the early days of Thatcher selling off everything in sight. Something I have repeatedly and consistently voted against whenever and wherever possible. However I lost and got over it.

True, perhaps a needs based assessment that is exempt, then VAT on the excess if you want more.

Ive just been costing up 4 2 person care visits a day for my father. The hospital have said this is the minimum he needs if he comes home at all. I’m already at £72k pa. The thought of VAT on that essential service seems very unfair.

But probably irrelevant as the money will run out and the state will have to pay eventually.

Just listening to Keir “its about how you slice the cake”

I'm very hopeful!!!

Maybe you have a point. I guess I was thinking of places where public transport isn't brilliant - maybe there could be a system to claim an allowance for that if a car was necessary for your work.

Hmm, re adult social care, if you pay privately, you can have what you like - a companion, housekeeper, 24hr care or a beautiful nursing home with cordon bleu chef. Is it the same in the public system? Should the standard of care be the same for everyone?

Makes sense. Education is as essential as healthcare. Private healthcare is a luxury not everyone can afford and should be taxed. I look forward to when labour gets in and implements these sort of policies, probably when they realise the economy isn’t growing and they need to generate revenue for things they want to do.

Cars over a certain price

Why not all cars? There is public transport

Private Adult Social care isn't an unnecessary, nice to have service. This is people who desperately need support and are paying themselves because they have over £23k in savings.

Sure - and those of us who believe you should be able to enjoy the money you earn without being punished for it - will go live elsewhere. The rest can stay and pay all the taxes they like to fund the kind of country they want.

I actually think it will be really good for Britain - those left behind would have to do really contribute and then a balance would be found. The 'rich' won't be available to be picked on anymore, so alternative targets would have to be found or shock horror - everyone would have to bear the burden fairly

Because it’s MN and no private healthcare debate is complete without somebody inevitably bringing the US into it.. What they fail to realise is that this attitude is the exact reason why we’re headed towards a US style system.

The more I think about this way of taxing people, the fairer it seems. Basically choosing how much you are taxed so a basic NI contribution and income tax bands for most and then additional VAT penalties for really unnecessary or already state-provided services would really even the playing field and open income streams for other projects.

Private health
Private school
Private adult social care
Cars over a certain price
Foreign holidays
Imported fruit and veg

All strike me as things that are brilliant to haves but probably unnecessary and could have a bit more tax on them to fund state schooling/NHS/public adult social care.

You are the problem. You and this attitude. Why can’t we have nice things like they have in Europe? Why do we have to go straight to the worst possibly option, missing out all of the nice options on the way?

It’s the typical fur coat no knickers virtue signalling that we’ve all come to expect from Keir Starmer. After that comment on not allowing his own family to use private healthcare should they need it he lost my vote. He can make a martyr out of himself if he likes but bringing his relatives into it is completely unacceptable

Why would they if the can’t buy better things with the money they earn because that would create a ‘two tier’ country?

@mrsm43s Yup, the VAT thing will cost whatever it makes to run, if it runs. It'll only punish the kids who's parents are barely affording it. If they were actually against it, they'd ban private schools altogether, like Finland has. But they're not, it's an exercise to get headlines and causes more division than it solves problems.