To wonder how we ever did 5 days a week in an office?

I agree. I do go in though anything from 1 to 3 days a week but love wfh. I organise a lot of meetings and what does drive ne mad though people refusing to come in for meetings even though given notice and some always asked for the meeting on line last minute as some excuse not to come in. Some of our rooms don't have teams so hard to do this if others are in the office for it. Not fair either unless a good excuse. Very grateful I can work wfh some days and know how lucky I am.

@Carly944 I'd agree that OP did make it sound as if everyone can say they're unhappy on a Friday afternoon and walk into their home office with a new role on Monday morning, we agree there!

But, I do think there are many on this thread who are trying their level best to 'put words in her mouth', she's quite aware that teachers, judges & scaffolders can't do their jobs from home and they do however difficult it could be, go for a career change.

We work hybrid now. I love my colleagues in my team and I enjoy their company in the office but we all prefer our home days. More productive, more comfortable just better all round!

@sandorschicken OFGS! For the millionth time, OP knows this! That's why she said office workers!

No OP did not say office workers.
She said those who would like to wfh but can't should change jobs. Hence my asking who she thinks would do all those jobs. They are essential and necessary, and I'm sure many of us who do them would prefer not to have to leave home to work each day

But her thinking that people can just choose to get another job annoyed me.

People can't just choose to get another job.

My colleage has worked in my office for a year. He is trying to change jobs.

He has recently gone for two interviews with different companies and he didn't get the jobs.

My other colleague just went for an interview with another company, and he didn't get the job.

You are competing against hundreds of people for jobs.

People CANT just get another job where they would be happier. People apply for jobs and don't get them

OP sounds like a "let them eat cake" type

What are you on about, she didnt say office workers.

She in fact said that if anyone doesn't work in an office job, that they should change their career to an office job.

Which is such a stupid thing to say.

It was then pointed out to her that nurses , doctors, teachers, plumbers, electricians, shop workers can't all change career to office jobs

@Carly944

She said if people were unhappy about being unable to work from home then they could and should get another role where they would be happier. And she's right, we are all in charge of our own happiness. If I wasn't happy in my office based job then I would get another. She didn't say that everyone should get another job, she said they could if they were unhappy.

And she did say office, it's right there in the post title 'to wonder how we ever did 5 days a week in an office', not 5 days a week in a ward, or classroom or a building site.

What are you on about, she didnt say office workers.

She in fact said that if anyone doesn't work in an office job, that they should change their career to an office job.

Which is such a stupid thing to say.

It was then pointed out to her that nurses , doctors, teachers, plumbers, electricians, shop workers can't all change career to office jobs

I couldn't manage 5 office days either.
I'm time poor and hate wasting it dawdling in yet another traffic jam when I could be picking kids up, sorting the shopping, laundry, whatever.
I hate office days because it's hit and miss whether I'm on time or not (childcare opens when it opens, I can't just leave another 20 minutes earlier on the off chance that someone broke down on the motorway that day) and as childcare closes when it closes, you don't see me for dust come 5pm, there is no spending an extra 10 minutes squeezing things over the line, I have to go!
WFH days I can even start early if required, which is a few times per quarter for meetings, absolutely a non flyer in office days. The flexibility goes both ways.
My work is only a 20/25 minute drive away in normal traffic conditions, at rush hour when everyone else is trying to get to work too? Double it and extra in case of disaster. What a waste.

I don't mind doing five days in the office now. I quite like going in and socialising.

And our big office had a pool table, a library, a book club, bean bags for break times

OFGS! For the millionth time, OP knows this! That's why she said office workers!

Same! I love wfh and can do more.hours now as don't need to factor in travel time. So I can earn more and spend much less on travel.
I used to do 10 to 12 k miles per year. Now I do 4k miles. So obv it's helping the planet but helping me mentally also:)

Who do you think would do all the jobs that can't be done from home OP? You're very lucky that you can wfh, but many of us simply don't have that choice. And it doesn't mean that we like going into the office, school, hospital etc to work

AI and outsourcing abroad are two very different things. I can see that AI is likely to be hugely significant, but what factors are going to come into place that make outsourcing more likely than it is now? After all, the labour and skills shortage both form very substantial incentives now.

Yes AI and other outsourcing abroad is going to be even bigger in the next decade I think, especially with people insisting on hiding at home being "productive". Most people I know now are either working in the office most of the time or hybrid, for those who have office jobs.

Controversial view incoming!

There just aren't loads of guaranteed cushy wfh jobs in most places anymore. It was never sustainable for the majority of roles to stay remote longer term. It massively impacts culture, training, progression and is a really bad thing at the start of a career in all but very specialist roles. It's awful for developing soft skills.

As an employer the tide is definitely turning. We're attracting loads of people because we're now unusual in offering even hybrid. I know this because I'm now getting told it by candidates on a weekly basis.

I actually think we will see most of the roles which are currently fully remote being replaced by ai in the next decade.

I am with you OP; used to do 5 days a week in an office and honestly don't know how I managed it; I couldn't now! Love WFH and to be honest get far more done than I do on my once-weekly office days

Yes I got 3 job offers on the same day. I picked the one that confirmed (and put into my contract) that I would never have to go into the office more than once a week. That was as important to me (if not more so) than salary.

The same could just as easily be said of the criticisms of it. In this thread, as in all of them, we've had people who've decided remote working is a bad thing because they've experienced poor customer service, despite the obvious other reasons why that might be the case. And people who've decided it's bad for young people per se because of a few they know. If we're going to be critical of people generalising based on their own experiences, there's plenty of that to go around.

Also the tough, adapt with the times thing is what a lot of it does come down to. People might want a workforce who are more willing to come into the office, but that doesn't mean they can have it.

I think employers who can offer WFH have realised they need to allow some kind of hybrid working, or they can't recruit. They might not need to if the local employment market is not very competitive, but when other comparable organisations in the same area offer WFH, and you don't, you do lose out on candidates. You often lose the best candidates too, who can pick and choose where they work.

Yes @Hayliebells before our hybrid policy was finalised, we would advertise vacancies with no mention of hybrid, and when the inevitable queries came in, our response was “hybrid policy to be confirmed” and (surprise surprise) we couldn’t recruit. Potential applicants wanted hybrid roles and weren’t prepared to commit to an organisation that hadn’t made its mind up yet. So applications dried up, and this didn’t change until our policy was finalised, and we started advertising hybrid vacancies.

I don't know if I count as "the older population" I'm mid 40s.
Myself and my husband wanted to open a new business bank account. You can't do it via the app. It took 6 weeks to get a phone call....which took 2 minutes and they emailed some forms.....which we filled in.That was 3 weeks ago, we still haven't got the new account number, but yeah closing branches is so much more efficient! (I say this as someone who does 99% of banking on my phone)

There is a lot of inward looking when WFH and how it works for that particular individual. No one will ever acknowledge that there are downsides, even when a pp pointed out difficulties it was very much "tough, adapt with the times"

I'm WFH now. I couldn't work for my employer without being wfh as my commute would be minimum 4.5 hours each way. I work in the same field as my previous job which required being on site full time but my new job and role is fully wfh. Love it.

People will piss about in any environment.

However, even in those cases where it could be objectively shown that a role is more efficiently done in person, that still doesn't mean the organisation will be able to get anyone to do it for the price they're prepared to pay. You can stop someone from working remotely, but you can't make them work in person. This is one of the complicating factors.

It was literally on a mezzanine floor above the factory floor. It's not possible to just "jump onto teams" in an environment that is so noisy it's mandatory to wear ear-defenders. Hopefully management will see that planning guy WFH is costing the company ££ in stoppage time and lost production and will actually listen to those of us saying he needs to return to the site full-time.