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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that 4/5 year olds should not be learning about d-day deaths?

183 replies

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 16:54

4 year old DS came home from school telling us about how they learned about D-Day, including how many people died, and the fighting. Whilst I agree kids should learn about this I definitely don’t think it should be foundation age children! DS suffers with nightmares and night terrors and already know this is going to cause many of them in the next few weeks. Husband says I’m overreacting, curious to see other mums opinions?

OP posts:
ageratum1 · 06/06/2024 20:25

He suffers with anxiety due to me having an illness that requires hospital appts, blood tests, IV etc every week/fortnight.
You have no problem sharing all that with him n though, even though you know it makes him anxious?

CharlotteBog · 06/06/2024 20:24

OP, maybe ask MN to edit the title so that it states your child has a diagnosis of anxiety that you are getting treatment for professionally, that he is under CAHMS, and that the school are aware of his particular issues.

Or at least remember to put these things in your first post if you post again.

StMarieforme · 06/06/2024 20:22

Anyone would think 4 and 5 year olds lived through the War, lost fathers, uncles, whole families.
Oh... wait...

bluetopazlove · 06/06/2024 20:16

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 06/06/2024 19:13

It’s odd, children are very very sheltered now yet their anxiety seems to be through the roof. Why?

Also when I was a kid I actively sought out things like horror films! I used to sneak downstairs to catch a glimpse of what my parents were watching when I was 5 or 6. As a child I watched the twin towers burn on the TV (as did my little brother who was 5), enjoyed Jurassic park when I was about 6, and my parents had endless conversations about the Iraq war and gory news stories without a second thought as to my presence. When foot and mouth happened there were pyres of dead animals around our village very visible.

I suspect there are many with upbringings like this, and while mental health issues are high in general, there just seems to be so many more anxious kids now than when I was growing up.

Edited

When my children grew up they were pad prats . One of them was born when husband was away at Christmas time no family around , it was heart breaking . But I do have to say one of my sons was very taken with the story of Bambi and Peter Pan .
We just had to get on with it as best we can .
Because it will soon be over and then we can get on with it as best we can .

Stoptherideiwanttogetoff24 · 06/06/2024 20:14

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 17:43

Apologies I typed quickly and should have mentioned his anxieties night terrors etc Originally. It’s not about not knowing these things, more about the appropriateness at this age talking about bloodshed which is what he has discussed since me posting this. It doesn’t sound like it has been done age appropriate. Learning about soldiers and how they serve a country, about veterans, different parts of military etc this in my eyes would be appropriate. I don’t think a 4 year old should learn about “France turning red” as he describes. It should absolutely be built upon with context which I could’ve helped with had I known this would be taught to him this year.

I’m shocked you’re getting so little understanding. I totally agree children don’t need to know about this stuff till they’re older.

SophieJo · 06/06/2024 20:13

MoonKiss · 06/06/2024 17:00

Sounds like you’ve already decided it’s going to give him nightmares. I’ve forgotten what the word is but try not to inflict your own feelings onto your child.

I agree. And you are being VU.

Stoptherideiwanttogetoff24 · 06/06/2024 20:12

cuckyplunt · 06/06/2024 17:01

Kids love this stuff. I doubt this will cause night terrors.

You have no idea what will upset the op’s child she’s already said he struggles with night terrors….

ageratum1 · 06/06/2024 20:09

I find it hard to believe that most reception children are nt familiar with what a war is

IfYoureHappyAndYouKnowItHaveAGin · 06/06/2024 20:08

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 19:26

Unfortunately not as it’s a rare disease. He has both night terrors and nightmares. He is under Camhs.

On a separate note, if your ds is struggling with your condition, there's a nonprofit called the 3Dtoyshop, they send teddies with 3d printed medical equipment attached, that can help kids come to terms with their own, or their families medical conditions.

Worth having a look to see if they can make him something with an IV, and whatever other devices you have.

I've seen a lot of kids get a lot of comfort from their teddies. Worth a look anyway to see if you think it may help.

AnnaMagnani · 06/06/2024 20:03

@Sue152
I'm with you OP, I don't think it's age appropriate to teach 4 year olds about war

Or asking our own parents and grandparents? My DF had memories of his sister missing a bomb when she crossed the street just before it landed. My DM's earliest memories were the Germans shooting in her house and her mum being held as a prisoner.

They didn't have a choice but to learn about war. Somehow our safest generation have the worst mental health.

Nanny0gg · 06/06/2024 19:58

@Sue152
I'm with you OP, I don't think it's age appropriate to teach 4 year olds about war,

Tell that to the Ukrainians, Gazans, Israelis and many, many other nationalities.

Wasn't so long ago it was an issue in N Ireland too.

They need to learn that the world isn't all about love and peace (without frighting them)

And it's clear the OP's son has other issues making it worse for him

whyhavetheygotsomany · 06/06/2024 19:49

You don't want him to know about d day but he knows his parent is seriously ill and goes to hospital all the time ? Why didn't you hide that from him If he is a worrier.

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 19:26

jannier · 06/06/2024 19:22

Then that's what you need help addressing is there a support group for your illness and how to talk to young children?
Night terrors are a normal stage or do you mean nightmares?

Unfortunately not as it’s a rare disease. He has both night terrors and nightmares. He is under Camhs.

OP posts:
MaryMaryVeryContrary · 06/06/2024 19:25

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/06/2024 19:24

It’s odd, children are very very sheltered now yet their anxiety seems to be through the roof. Why?

It’s partly because they are both very sheltered and yet very exposed. They’re processing movies and online content without the capacity to make sense of it while parents protect them from real life stuff that they then also don’t understand. Throw in a dose of “resilience means nothing ever bothers you” and every difficult feeling becomes amplified and pathologised.

Yes some people experience extreme levels of anxiety and need support for that, but feeling sad, angry, upset, anxious is part of life, not something that needs to be cured.

I agree with this 100%.

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/06/2024 19:24

It’s odd, children are very very sheltered now yet their anxiety seems to be through the roof. Why?

It’s partly because they are both very sheltered and yet very exposed. They’re processing movies and online content without the capacity to make sense of it while parents protect them from real life stuff that they then also don’t understand. Throw in a dose of “resilience means nothing ever bothers you” and every difficult feeling becomes amplified and pathologised.

Yes some people experience extreme levels of anxiety and need support for that, but feeling sad, angry, upset, anxious is part of life, not something that needs to be cured.

jannier · 06/06/2024 19:22

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 17:26

He suffers with anxiety due to me having an illness that requires hospital appts, blood tests, IV etc every week/fortnight. The school is aware of this and his night terrors. It also hasn’t been presented age appropriately by the sounds of it.

Then that's what you need help addressing is there a support group for your illness and how to talk to young children?
Night terrors are a normal stage or do you mean nightmares?

jannier · 06/06/2024 19:20

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 17:18

So as suspected, DS is now talking about how soldiers are going to come and attack him, that they get children, and that France is covered in red. The school is already aware of his night terrors, as they discussed the Queen dying in preschool which led to 2 months of nightmares of the Queen coming to get him. I strongly believe 4 year olds are way too imaginative to be taught about this type of detail, maybe about soldiers protect us but that’s about as far as it should go. Thank you for everyone’s replies, I do agree about learning about things as long as it’s age appropriate, and with heads up from school. However it seems this isn’t happening.

Then you reframe it France was covered in red poppies. Soldiers wont attack you they are sent to protect countries where bad things are happening
Many 4 year olds and younger are dealing with death of lived ones experiencing it in pets, the plant I didn't look after etc are good starting points but you do need to talk about it pretending it doesn't happen sets them up to crash later on. Surely he's seen news, posters, the programme on cbeebies on remembrance day? Maybe it's more your fear he's picking up on.

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/06/2024 19:18

It also shows that he wasn’t ready to learn about this as he’s put two things together and got something else.

I don’t think it means he’s not ready to learn about an important part of history, it’s our job as parents to help our kids when they put two and two together and get five, no matter the subject.

I’d have had conversations about no the soldier weren’t chasing children, the sea and beaches weren’t red - maybe the teacher meant X or Y. Or exploring why he thought what he did which would help you separate out what was said, his understanding of what was said and what was being driven by a different anxiety.

I often need to correct misunderstandings or explain something more fully, because kids get confused and their imagination takes over. My DS refers to our “random conversations” on the way to school which is usually me covering something he’s needed fuller or better explanation of - it’s just part of being a parent.

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 06/06/2024 19:13

Serencwtch · 06/06/2024 19:03

We can't pretend that history didn't happen just to shelter those with mental illness/behavioral issues.
I suspect it's your attitudes that's contributing to his problems.
The youngsters who lost their daddy in WW2 didn't get camhs & liaison.

It’s odd, children are very very sheltered now yet their anxiety seems to be through the roof. Why?

Also when I was a kid I actively sought out things like horror films! I used to sneak downstairs to catch a glimpse of what my parents were watching when I was 5 or 6. As a child I watched the twin towers burn on the TV (as did my little brother who was 5), enjoyed Jurassic park when I was about 6, and my parents had endless conversations about the Iraq war and gory news stories without a second thought as to my presence. When foot and mouth happened there were pyres of dead animals around our village very visible.

I suspect there are many with upbringings like this, and while mental health issues are high in general, there just seems to be so many more anxious kids now than when I was growing up.

Cuwins · 06/06/2024 19:12

I can't imagine the school felt the need to give you a heads up given the anniversary. I imagine they thought it would be obvious. I have a 2.5 year old, the memorial service was on earlier and she was interested. So I explained it was to remember people who had died while looking after us, a long time ago.
So a 4 year old I would expect to be told much more detailed information.

HumphreysCorner · 06/06/2024 19:12

We've shared it today in Collective Worship and the children were happy to talk about it.

Ginkypig · 06/06/2024 19:06

We all learned this same stuff as children and I don’t know about you but Iv never met anyone as an adult who have said they were traumatised as a child when learning this history.

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 06/06/2024 19:04

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 18:26

He is recieving support, from Camhs and a liasion. Hence my frustration the school hadn’t discussed with us first. Aware now it’s not about age and more my sons own perceptions due to his anxiety.

They can’t do this OP. It’s unrealistic. So many children now have special needs or mental health issues that teachers can barely cope with their job as it is. I’m sorry to say you’re expecting far too much.

What does he know about your illness? I’m quite unwell and my child sees me do 7 injections daily and also I have dizzy episodes where she knows to bring me my orange juice (type 1 diabetes with various complications)

Serencwtch · 06/06/2024 19:03

UponReflectionLake · 06/06/2024 18:26

He is recieving support, from Camhs and a liasion. Hence my frustration the school hadn’t discussed with us first. Aware now it’s not about age and more my sons own perceptions due to his anxiety.

We can't pretend that history didn't happen just to shelter those with mental illness/behavioral issues.
I suspect it's your attitudes that's contributing to his problems.
The youngsters who lost their daddy in WW2 didn't get camhs & liaison.

SkeletonBatsflyatnight · 06/06/2024 19:00

I think its tricky tbh. Even if the school had pulled him out, his peers would have still been discussing it around him. Plus you still can't account for what the rest of the class are learning/doing out of school. My 5 year old returned to school after the Easter holidays and talked about her great grandfather's murder during the Troubles because we'd come back from an anniversary memorial.