To think that this really can't be true about young people's thoughts about Israel?

You created conditions where people had to fight back because you took their homes, massacred their families and erased their villages. You then complain that because they fought back you need to sustain the racism. You wouldn't parent kids like this. Why does Israel get dispensation to continue a racist legacy and enact further and further injustice?

Are you actually referring to a mass terrorist attack on civilians including torture, the murder of children, and mass sexual violence, as a fight back? Seriously?

I'm not even going to go into how much you've twisted and oversimplified the actual recent history of the region.

If you and they think it’s only the ‘mainstream media’ spewing out a false narrative you’re incredibly naive.

With the mainstream media, at least we know what the narrative is, what could be false about it and who’s spinning it. If your sole means of informing yourself is via social media, and you’re swallowing the lines peddled there whole, you don’t have a clue what’s right or wrong or even who’s pushing certain viewpoints.

On the likes of TikTok, amongst the user-generated content (much of which is uninformed bilge anyway, let’s face it), you’re also going to be consuming content from bad-faith players, such as agents of foreign powers like Russia and China, who have a vested interest in influencing social opinion in the west in ways that benefit them, not us.

I hope you’re teaching your kids how to critically assess the info and opinions they hear. That includes grading sources for reliability and accuracy. Much as you would hopefully view a textbook as more reliable than Wiki.

You created conditions where people had to fight back because you took their homes, massacred their families and erased their villages. You then complain that because they fought back you need to sustain the racism. You wouldn't parent kids like this. Why does Israel get dispensation to continue a racist legacy and enact further and further injustice?

Israel as a country is necessary because the first half of the 20th century showed Jewish people they are not safe in any place where they don't have a majority. It's not "just" that Germany perpetrated the Holocaust, so many other nations were collaborators and enablers. Even on the "good guys" side, the US and the UK only intervened when their own personal interests were threatened, a big chunk of their public and political opinion was pro-Nazi. And let's not forget the Jewish refugee ships that were refused landing and sunk. The guilt of Europe and the West in this issue is immense, and it's not like they can say "well, we'll definitely make it safe for you from now on", everyone knows this isn't trustworthy. I'm not sure to what degree young people (or people in general) understand this, because the Holocaust nowadays is often presented as "Germans did bad thing, UK and US were good and defeated them". Which is not entirely accurate.

However: while all countries and nation-states on Earth were founded through violent events (invasions, revolutions etc), Israel did so in recent living memory. A new country was defined and colonised in a place where other people were already living as a majority for centuries- those people were invaded, kicked out and their homes stolen, some are still alive to remember this. Their descendants are being treated as non-human and penned into occupation zones. This is not something you can tell them to just get over (the way some Israel supporters do), especially not while it's still going on. So yes, the way the state of Israel was formed is something that shouldn't have happened and it's the reason why Israel has to be on a continuous war footing, young people (or any people) who say this aren't wrong. I don't know what is the solution. The creation of Israel can't be undone, and Jewish people do need a safe haven. However, two wrongs don't make a right. Palestinians are right that it is their home and that Israelis are invaders there.

They have but the part they haven't come to terms with is the obvious and clear racism that demands israel continues as a majority Jewish state

I used to think that too, but after October 7 I do believe being a majority is necessary for their safety and survival. It's not racism.

If my child was murdered on the 7th October atrocities I wouldn't want ten thousand innocent children murdered in revenge for her death.

" I take it you didn't read their charter then."

I take it you didn't know that Bibi and his chums funded Hamas as an opposition to Fatah in order to destabilise the movement for a Palestinian state then?

Still though, no Hamas is not recognised as a government. Israel's government is internationally recognised.

I think it is true, quite a few of my colleagues at work are in their early 20's and I would say 90% of them agree that what Israel are doing is wrong. They also will not vote Conservative and are contemplating about voting labour due to Starmers response in October to the atrocity being committed by Israel.
My own children and their friends who are all in their 20's all feel the same, that Israel is completely in the wrong. I tend to agree with them.
I really think the tide is turning and the younger generation are not falling for the false narrative that is being spewed out by the mainstream media which by the way none of them watch, listen or read.

Google is your friend
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism

Understanding whar zionism is, is pretty key to understanding the creation of the state of Israel and the settler movement.

Zionists as with most movements are not necessarily all on the same page with regards to how or where but if you're zionist you agree with a homeland for Jewish people in Palestine.
Therefore if you agree that Israel should have been created you agree with zionists/are zionist.

Anti-zionists disagree with the creation of a Jewish state or homeland for various reasons.

They have but the part they haven't come to terms with is the obvious and clear racism that demands israel continues as a majority Jewish state with no right of return for Palestinians, no freedom of movement for those in occupied territories, asymmetric war fare against an indigenous population and the continued expansion and ethnic cleansing. You've clearly made your peace with that as have the US and UK govts. The kids haven't.

Your argument was that young people are well informed as they study it at GCSE level.

The data does NOT even support your argument, so it falls down. 🤦‍♂️

Jesus wept....

You just can't accept that you were wrong can you.

Whatever. I've lost the will to live.

But 800 years is the right amount of time to go back in history?

I never got an answer to this earlier, what came first - the temples or the mosque? That will give you a clue who the actual colonisers are :)

Anyway, all I'm getting from your posts is that Israel needs to hold out 800 years at which point they'll be considered the indigenous population. Only 725ish years to go 🤞🏻🤞🏻🤞🏻

Well. We are where we are, Israel exists and the majority of its population was born there so everyone in the region needs to come to terms with that.

"pitching itself as more moderate" - I take it you didn't read their charter then.

If you believe that people have a right of return that pre-dates 800 years then you would be giving back large parts of Europe to the Romans, South Asia to Alexander the Great, huge parts of central, South Asia to Genghis Khan etc. And not only is that as bonkers as it sounds you also advocate that their ancient right to that land trumps the right of anyone who has lived in it for 800 years. Sorry we were here 2000 years ago. The whole argument is based on racism. We are better- we can rule this batter- our guns are bigger- it's ours. It's how Australia and America were colonised. Watch BBC iPlayer The Australian Wars and learn about the importance of erasing indigenous people once their land is stolen.

@MyMumIsBetterThanYours

"Hamas were the biggest party following the election and won a parliamentary majority. 44.45% of those who voted, voted for Hamas. That's far from being an insignificant number"

Still not a recognised government though AND as noted by other commentators Hamas at the time was pitching its self as more moderate.

However, I suspect you know that Hamas aren't recognised as a legitimate government and are attempting to blame the situation that is occurring on the Palestinian civilians.

No one is justifying the Hamas attack.

However, it is important for people to understand why it happened. It didn't just occur out of the blue because Hamas decided they are against Israel.

There were also claims that Egypt warned Israel that Hamas were about to launch an attack days before https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67082047

This raises the question of why Israel ignored the warning? Israel deny it, but Egypt has nothing to gain from lying.

Do you really?

How many schools in England, the most populous region of the UK, teach about the conflict in MER?

27!

What percentage of students actually study MER conflict?

Fewer than 2%!

Sources attached - Guardian, The National, Parrallel History and Jewish Chronicle.

How many UK History GCSE exam boards teach the topic?

ONE! Just one.

Therefore, the vast majority of young people in the UK are NOT taught about the MER conflict nor are they especially well informed about it!

That's just the reality.

Yes there were Jewish people in villages and towns numbering fewer than the Christian population (20%) with 75% being Muslim. How can this be the foundation of a Jewish state unless there is a colonial and ethnic cleansing aim? This was in fact the stated aim and objective discussed at the Zionist Congress of 1937 envisaged and fulfilled by Ben Gurion.

No.

What is a Zionist?

What is an anti-Zionist?

Ok so what about before the 800 years you keep referencing? Who lived there then? Why have you decided history started 800 years ago?

Hamas were the biggest party following the election and won a parliamentary majority. 44.45% of those who voted, voted for Hamas. That's far from being an insignificant number.

Sorry there was simply no Israeli Jewish bit of Palestine. This is Israeli mythology and fantasy.
There were a series of towns and villages which were Muslim, Christian or Jewish with much mixing. For 800 years they coexisted.
To read the Peel Commission offer of 1937 as an offer of 75% of the land for Arabs is a distortion that even the Zionist historian Benny Wise wouldn't stomach. The Zionist Congress only accepted it because they saw those boundaries as temporary and they actually claimed all of the land from the river to the sea- this was their stated colonial wish as early as the Zionist Congress in 1937.
The lies and contortions that people have to do to deny the colonialist theft of land and culture is grotesque and the kids are actually seeing right through it.

@MyMumIsBetterThanYours

Aren't Israel recognised by the UN as having been in breach of international and human rights laws for decades?

Hamas wasn't elected by a majority of Palestinians and it isn't recognised as a government by the UN as it doesn't recognise a Palestinian state.