Is it a foregone conclusion now that labour will win?

the election results disagree with you

But you don't 'get the press aligned with you' - the British press is always right wing because of who owns it, not because of the quality of the campaigns that are run. (I do know Blair got the Sun on side and that was a massive achievement of that campaign, however it came about).

I agree that the Johnson campaign was impressive but I honestly can't remember much about the Cameron one and do feel in some ways it was a bit like the Tory situation now in that people felt it was time for a change and were blaming Brown for the financial crash. I suppose that did come up in the campaign and the Tories were absolutely on message for the decade after that in saying how Labour had wrecked the economy - they kept that up right up to Brexit/Covid as I recall.

But this Tory talent for campaigning has really not been much in evidence this time around has it?

But you don't 'get the press aligned with you' - the British press is always right wing because of who owns it, not because of the quality of the campaigns that are run. (I do know Blair got the Sun on side and that was a massive achievement of that campaign, however it came about).

I agree that the Johnson campaign was impressive but I honestly can't remember much about the Cameron one and do feel in some ways it was a bit like the Tory situation now in that people felt it was time for a change and were blaming Brown for the financial crash. I suppose that did come up in the campaign and the Tories were absolutely on message for the decade after that in saying how Labour had wrecked the economy - they kept that up right up to Brexit/Covid as I recall.

But this Tory talent for campaigning has really not been much in evidence this time around has it?

I must say it's funny how PPs are crediting Cameron and Johnson with being such excellent campaigners and failing to mention the enormous boost they get from the right-wing press in this country. Remember a certain bacon sandwich and the absolutely heinous way in which it was eaten which would undoubtedly have resulted in the annihilation of Great Britain had Putin witnessed it?

Obviously Johnson did have a certain appeal amongst many and the simplicity bullshit of 'Get Brexit Done' was effective (so effective it's now never mentioned even though it's one promise that was kept - wonder why that is...) but Cameron was not a great campaigner. He also headed the Remain campaign and look how well that went. However, to be fair to dear old Hammy there was also the law-breaking on the Leave side - it was hardly a fair fight.

I think the press play a big part in it all, even today, and then unexpected things like the bloody 'bigoted woman' thing can crop up, but even that wasn't that unexpected as it was all tied in with fucking Brexit, not that it was even called that then I don't think. I think, when you step back and peel back the layers, there's often a common thread that takes hold. From 2015 onwards that was Brexit, and now I really do think it's the idea that everything has gone to shit in this country and that is the fault of the Tories who are corrupt/shit/both, or they've just been in too long. I think many people hold a version of that view and I hope (and barely dare to think) that that will be the thread that strengthens and will result in a clear Labour win.

I must say it's funny how PPs are crediting Cameron and Johnson with being such excellent campaigners and failing to mention the enormous boost they get from the right-wing press in this country. Remember a certain bacon sandwich and the absolutely heinous way in which it was eaten which would undoubtedly have resulted in the annihilation of Great Britain had Putin witnessed it?

Obviously Johnson did have a certain appeal amongst many and the simplicity bullshit of 'Get Brexit Done' was effective (so effective it's now never mentioned even though it's one promise that was kept - wonder why that is...) but Cameron was not a great campaigner. He also headed the Remain campaign and look how well that went. However, to be fair to dear old Hammy there was also the law-breaking on the Leave side - it was hardly a fair fight.

I think the press play a big part in it all, even today, and then unexpected things like the bloody 'bigoted woman' thing can crop up, but even that wasn't that unexpected as it was all tied in with fucking Brexit, not that it was even called that then I don't think. I think, when you step back and peel back the layers, there's often a common thread that takes hold. From 2015 onwards that was Brexit, and now I really do think it's the idea that everything has gone to shit in this country and that is the fault of the Tories who are corrupt/shit/both, or they've just been in too long. I think many people hold a version of that view and I hope (and barely dare to think) that that will be the thread that strengthens and will result in a clear Labour win.

I must say it's funny how PPs are crediting Cameron and Johnson with being such excellent campaigners and failing to mention the enormous boost they get from the right-wing press in this country. Remember a certain bacon sandwich and the absolutely heinous way in which it was eaten which would undoubtedly have resulted in the annihilation of Great Britain had Putin witnessed it?

Obviously Johnson did have a certain appeal amongst many and the simplicity bullshit of 'Get Brexit Done' was effective (so effective it's now never mentioned even though it's one promise that was kept - wonder why that is...) but Cameron was not a great campaigner. He also headed the Remain campaign and look how well that went. However, to be fair to dear old Hammy there was also the law-breaking on the Leave side - it was hardly a fair fight.

I think the press play a big part in it all, even today, and then unexpected things like the bloody 'bigoted woman' thing can crop up, but even that wasn't that unexpected as it was all tied in with fucking Brexit, not that it was even called that then I don't think. I think, when you step back and peel back the layers, there's often a common thread that takes hold. From 2015 onwards that was Brexit, and now I really do think it's the idea that everything has gone to shit in this country and that is the fault of the Tories who are corrupt/shit/both, or they've just been in too long. I think many people hold a version of that view and I hope (and barely dare to think) that that will be the thread that strengthens and will result in a clear Labour win.

@SherbetDips but what will that mean? Will it mean labour will get their policies through still?

The thing with it is just that it’s divisive to voters. Some voters will support her and be angry, other voters will find her comments anti semitic and be annoyed that the findings weren’t presented months ago

The Diane Abbot thing from today is so odd.
Then again I don’t support antisemites being politicians and I find her tantrum over something that hasn’t happened to be rather crass.

I think many people expect a PM to have charisma, and that will be an obstacle for Starmer. But IMO he ticks the boxes that matter.

No. There are still sufficient fair weather Labour voters who will only vote if the Party is currently 100% in accord with their own personal views to hand the election to the Tories.

Such voters call their action "sticking to their principles". I call it smug self-satisfaction.

Very interesting. Did they feel let down by how centrist he is?

I’ll look that up too - haven’t read much about the labour campaigning but im
sure there’s a wealthy of (dare I say comical) info around the Miliband years 😀 thanks!

I think your first paragraph just nails it and shows how much of a balancing act the opposition have to do. I attended an anniversary march for the miners strike a few months ago in my S Yorks town. Behind Thatcher, Starmer was the most called out politician in the speeches which is what makes me think its not a foregone conclusion at all.

The trouble is, the further right the right go, the further right the left have to go to capture the disenfranchised middle voters that the right piss off by going further right. And they have to do it without pissing off the left voters in the process.

JC was always unelectable. He's the best thing that ever happened to the Conservative party. The amount of young people who started talking politics was incredible though, and I have to concede that this is a good thing.

I shall have a look, it is interesting. I recall reading am article by the guy who did labour campaigns when Milliband was in the chair and he asked whether any of the shadow cabinet had ongoing relationships with anyone from the demographic they were supposed to represent. Not a one of them did.

I don't doubt that there is more science / effort than I give credit to, however I lost interest in the campaigns when they started with the chicken / headless chicken suits. 1997 I think. It has all been downhill from there really.