To be suprised at Butlins and their lack of neurodiverse awareness?

Why would you take a child who struggles to regulate and is overwhelmed to BUTLINS?! Maybe accept her as she is and take her somewhere she would enjoy.

Sorry OP should have rtft. A forest park sounds lovely, if you win the lottery maybe centreparcs.

But what would that one day event look like? There is no one size fits all when it comes to neurodiversity. What works for one person would be a nightmare for others.

other posters have said that Butlins will make reasonable adjustments around things like queuing for the pool. But these things need to be done on an individual level not a one size fits all.

@GreenPhlem i really feel for you . I have dc with ASD (my youngest is 3 as well) I totally get it. You booked things to try and make sure she didn’t have to wait and get overwhelmed and they didn’t stick to the booking times / activity times . I think it’s reasonable to be upset about that .

I also agree with you re the soft play - a 3 year old is still tiny and would have been supervised by you so they should have made an adjustment.

You sound lovely and are clearly wonderful supportive grandparents I wish my parents were so involved ! It hasn’t worked out this time but I really hope in future you can have a lovely peaceful break that goes well

YABVU. You never should have taken her. It doesn't suit her needs. More importantly You are Unreasonable for expecting them to. They cater for the masses and the masses do go.

Yes 👏🏿 really good ideas there @user1492757084 too...

Haven’t read the entire thread but just dropping in with a bit of empathy OP. I can’t believe that many parents/grandparents/careers of ND children haven’t had at least one disaster of a day out or holiday where afterwards they have realised that it was madness to attempt that particular thing. I certainly have!

Caring for an ND child is a learning curve - sometimes you make a misjudgement and everyone has a horrible time. I only have one child and she is autistic so I don’t know anything about parenting an NT child: maybe in this regard it’s the same!

Your expectations were a bit out of whack here. Never mind - move on. You’ve learned something about what will work better next time. You sound like a wonderful grandparent!

I think you need to research suitable venues that cater for your child's personality.
Places have to be profitable and in school holidays it will always be busy; they will not turn away business to make the place less full of people.
Consider libraries, films at a cinema, (take ear muffs) one on one horseriding sessions, cooking at home, walkiing around a lake or on the beach with a little friend and a ball, and ask the pool for the most desirable time slot for a shy child.

@GreenPhlem

I am in two minds about this,

as i can see get other posters viewpoints on this topic in regards of Butlins,

However cause neuodivistity spectrums awareness is so common especially nowadays

then family friendly establishments i am susprised are not being encouraged or having the incentive drive to facilitate this such as often quieter times of the day, sensory space areas to relax ect,

Let's face Butlins and other establishments if they facilitate adapted this in some way whether even just one a day event neuro autustic spectrum family friendly activities,

it would make real good business sense model and make serious good money revenue sense for them for sure definitely too,

As being autustic family friendly

It would acctract more families or people who might have been put off or reluctant to vist a Butlins place etc,

Butlins you need to move with the times and adapts...

Butlin’s is a family holiday resort - noisy, chaotic, disorganised at times and geared towards money making. I’m sorry you have a granddaughter with additional needs, but if you wanted a holiday at a place with special facilities for autistic children, you should have found one. Yes ‘one show a day’ might not SEEM a lot to ask, but it is asking a lot
because it means Butlin’s have to exclude all the other families who are there. Will there be enough ND children each week to warrant a show a day? and how do Butlin’s possibility control for the fact NT kids might want to join in and change the environment?

I have a ND stepchild and taking her anywhere is a nightmare. Certainly we breathe a sigh of relief when places can accommodate her behaviour - but her needs are polar opposite to your GDs - she needs to be able to be loud and energetic and rampage about. I don’t think there are one size fits all ND accommodations.

If you’re still braving caravan sites have a look for sensory/autism friendly caravans. They’re private but there’s different families run them on different sites. We went to one on a haven site recently and it was lovely… van itself had a sensory room and loads of toys set up specifically and themed rooms for the kids and living area.
Haven itself had a bookable sensory room, activities did run on a bit late but was usually to allow stragglers in.. we learned to be a straggler 🤣. Beach side, loads of outdoor play spaces and day time shows weren’t as busy.. still loud but like 20 kids vs full club.

Both of mine are ND one who has severe complex needs and a wheelchair user.. phone places before hand and ask all the questions you be a pain in the arse. I always ask if it’s not busy can ds go into the smaller kids area explaining disabilities and decide if we’ll go from there for soft plays.

I think the mistake you made is seeing things from the perspective of adapting unsuitable activities to make them suitable, rather than taking your GD to do something she would enjoy without any need for adaptations.

I think a lot of people, understandably, think along the lines of wanting their child to be able to do the sorts of things they think children should enjoy. So they take the child to a really loud busy show and give them ear defenders and various coping strategies that enables them to just about tolerate it, when in fact the child would probably have been happier doing something they didn’t need adaptations to cope with. Of course, if you have other kids who are neurotypical, then it’s important they don’t miss out and adaptations for their sibling can mean that the whole family can do something, which is great. But I think if there is only one child, there’s less need to fit a square peg into a round hole.

I'm really glad she had a great time, bet she loved being spoilt by her grandparents for the whole holiday too!

I'm sorry it was harder for you. Like you, I feel like the world should be just as accessible to children and persons with disabilities. Why should everything be harder? But in reality, I know it's not, sadly, and I don't really have the answers as to how it would work in practice.

That said, I don't think it would be unreasonable to send some polite feedback saying if they wanted to improve their accomodation for disabilities, x, y and z would be helpful. It might be something they're looking at anyway, you never know.

In the nicest possible way I’m in the YABU group - and I’m on the spectrum myself.

My Daughter and husband are NT and love these types of holidays though so hopefully these tips will help for next time:

1. apply for an access card or similar. These will normally open up quiet areas or virtual queue (not a jump before anyone jumps on the band waggon, you get a stamp and sit somewhere quiet for your turn)
2. contact the park before hand, Check FAQ etc. see what is available for disabled guests.
3. plan plan plan, and have a plan B. Harder for a 3 year old, but if I know what we are doing and when we are doing it I know how to move my energy. Indoors loud areas are a lot harder than outdoors, so indoor activities are limited for example. Locate quiet spots.
4. try to visit during term time week days.

sounds like she enjoyed the beach and quieter activities, it’s ok that she was happy in the apartment - the holiday was a success and she had a great time. I love being on holiday and just chilling on the balcony- I’m not fussed about going see and doing all the “normal” activities. I think that’s the hardest part for my family, as it can come across as miserable and missing out. But I’m not, I’m on holiday and happy and make sure there is an even mix so we can all enjoy what we enjoy.

Cinemas and soft play do those things at off-peak times/days to get people through the door when they'd be quiet anyway. Butlins in half-term is not an off-peak thing and doesn't have off-peak hours.

Swimming has been like that since covid and because they overbook. It's rubbish.

The harsh reality of living with autism...

Lots of places are not suitable. Especially any place aimed at children in school holidays. Because they packed, which creates noise, and gives no space.

And "Autism Friendly" days can be unsuitable too, due to the conflicting needs of different people with Autism.

Do until your GD starts school... making the most of visiting these places during school hours and term time. So the Soft play centre, where she can play on the equipment of a suitable size without 10yos, or the museum, or a quieter holiday.

I've lost track of the number of times we've cut a highly anticipated trip short due to Too Many People. DD is nearly 13 now. Her tolerance is higher, but we still need to plan

They have a silent cinema, also you know your daughter is autistic so why on earth did you not get all her swimming stuff on her before she got to the pool so that you are literally only in the changing room for a minute. You also need to come up with ways to help your daughter, with my children we avoided all entertainment for years because it was too loud and too busy, you are choosing to put your daughter in this environment that you know will be.

We also visited holiday venues in quieter times the same with Indoor play areas, you can't expect play areas to let your daughter into the toddler bit of she's above her height limit especially when there will be babies in that part.

The whole experience at Butlins is not/can not be truly ASD friendly. It's important to be clued up on needs and try not to 'gift' an ASD child with something like this that is your idea of 'FUN'. It's like trying to stick a square peg in a round hole. Look into other experiences where they can calmly take part in things they enjoy minus the 100's of loud strangers, upsetting noise, unexpected new routines etc.

YABU taking an autistic 3 year old to butlins in the school holidays. Of course it was going to be busy and loud, there are plenty more appropriate places you could have taken her to.

Butlins whole thing is loud and in your face fun for the kids.

Delays happen they can’t do anything about that and the pools always been rammed constantly even before booking. If you want it quieter tots break or owners only.

I think you're being reasonable to expect and advocate for these adaptations and considerations, and tbh, we all should be.

I think that taking her to Butlins without making sure there were things that she could handle and then being cross about it is where you're coming unstuck. It only would have taken an email to find out that it would have been unsuitable.

You're not wrong, you're just in a difficult situation.

As an adult with sensory processing disorder Butlins is my idea of hell. I wouldn't dream of taking a very young neurodiverse child there.

If you have an ND child or are ND (I am ND FWIW), you should research these things in advance and not expect them to be provided. It would be nice if everywhere did, but that’s just not realistic at the moment. Turning up on a holiday just expecting there to be ND-friendly performances is madness.

I've taken my NT DD to Butlins Skegness and it was full on, but that was expected. It was a half term, the shows are designed to be energetic and interactive, there are arcades, fun fairs etc the whole thing is set up to keep kids busy and entertained for early to late.

I've also taken her to Haven, it's much more low key the caravans/lodges are more spread out, there is beach access and quiet walks, the entertainment is less frequent and more low key. The swimming pool is smaller and has less flumes and stuff but that means it's also less busy.

In your situation if I wanted a holiday park with activities and kid stuff but with less volume and business than Butlins I would absolutely choose somewhere like Haven.

Not necessarily. We have an amazing softplay near us that is Sen sessions. She has put a few things in place:

reduced numbers
removal of age restrictions for the different areas
opens up the party room as a break out space
25% off

The sessions are run at a loss.

on occasion I agree and actually making them sen sessions actually makes them harder for my autistic daughter to access but there definitely are autism friendly that are just that.

Op I think you're great for taking your grandchild away and being sensitive to their needs. My kids grandparents wouldn't dream of doing that