Autistic Traits in a Neurotypical Person.

I wouldn't say they impair his life though? I also don't think he displays (m)any restrictive and repetitive behaviours...

I think my DD also has ADHD, but I'm really struggling at the moment to get her assessed as school don't (or didn't) have concerns (apart from telling me she's too chatty and needs reminding to stay on task 🙄). But they also didn't have concerns regarding ASD!!

No its not always just the assessors, sometimes there are a series of meetings, sometimes birth parents are there sometimes not. Not all children live with their birth parents, but even when they dont, we try to encourage birth parents to be part of the assessment process if appropriate, its not always.
Children can have a number of assessments for several reasons, criminal proceedings, family court proceedings and services being involved with the child for their minority which means that their needs get re looked at over time.

I don’t think social media helps this narrative either. The amount of videos I’ve seen saying “if you do these things then you probably have ADHD or ASD” or whatever and the things they go on to describe are ridiculous such as walking in to a room and forgetting why you’re there. Imagine how many people there are trying to get themselves an unnecessary diagnosis when there is fuck all wrong with them.

I mean it’s just language semantics I guess. I would just call them personality traits rather than autistic traits. I think probably everyone on here could talk about traits they have that they think might lend themselves to OCD, ASD, ADHD etc etc. This happens so much these days that I wonder if there is any point in having a neuro typical group as almost nobody would fit in to it and therefore it wouldn’t be ‘typical’

My understanding with any type of diagnoses is that it has to be severely impacting your life and if it isn’t, they are just your little quirks and idiosyncrasies. So it’s not language I would choose to use.

My DD has recently been diagnosed with ASD. She has significant sensory issues, anxiety, inability to regulate her emotions, extreme need for control and routine, social differences. Her traits impact her life on a daily basis.

Her younger brother has some traits (different sensory issues that actually don't bother DD - eg haircutting, teeth-brushing, some sounds; particular obsessions and knowledge, some literal language, some communication differences, random comfort objects).

However these do not significantly impact his life on a day-to-day basis.

He is also on the whole extremely laid-back, not bothered by uncertainty nor changes to routine and very in-tune with other people's emotions so I don't think he has ASD.

I think “you’re either Autistic or you’re not” is unusable until we get those scans!

Some people have no idea they are ND and would be offended at the idea. But everyone around them can see it clearly.

Some people think they are but the GP doesn’t agree because their experience of Autism is with boys, or people that have high support needs, and they walked in, spoke for themselves and acted like a normal person (because that’s what you do in public), so that’s that for them.

I’ve read stories where some get diagnosed fairly quickly and easily, some people go through multiple processes and no-one agrees on a diagnoses.

There are cases where people have a breakdown and are diagnosed with a mental illness, then later re-diagnosed with Autism.

There are people that know they’re different and will have no idea about ND, so will end up in another area of labels like “INFP”, highly sensitive person (HSP), a “lone wolf”, a creative, a hermit.. etc.

You're either autistic or you're not. OP if you have two ND kids and you have 'traits' you are likely ND yourself and mask well. Been there done that, got my ADHD medicated and controlled then, hello, autism that was silently lurking underneath!

One condition can do a pretty good job of obscuring the other - we can appear 'normalish' meanwhile inside it's a battle of two extremes!

I hope we get to a point where we can brain scan and know for sure who is and who isn’t.

This research is interesting.. I asked AI to explain it like I’m 12 to simplify it:

They took brain samples from 49 people who had autism and 54 people who didn't. They compared these samples to see how the genes were acting differently in people with autism.
They found that in every part of the brain they looked at, there were differences in the levels of RNA, but the biggest differences were in two areas:

1. Visual cortex: This part of the brain helps us see and process what we're looking at.
2. Parietal cortex: This part helps us feel things like touch, pain, and temperature.

Brain changes in autism are far more sweeping than previously known

We're not all on the spectrum, although this is something I also believed until both me and my daughter were informally diagnosed. We're both currently waiting for a formal diagnosis assessment.

Autism spectrum disorder (ASD) is a developmental disability caused by differences in the brain. You are born with ASD, so whether you're diagnosed early or late in life, the key point here is having always had ASD not just "developing" symptoms later.

Neurotypical brains are different to neurodivergent brains, so you're either autistic or not. You can't be a "little bit" autistic. Neurotypical brains are different to neurodivergent brains. The spectrum that is so often spoken about refers to the neurodivergent spectrum that neurodivergent people are on. People misunderstand this as a linear continuum ranging from mild autism to severe autism. The spectrum isn't linear, but is instead a collection of a variety of traits, that each autistic person has uniquely. Which explains why you can get a very wide range of symptoms from being totally non verbal to being a savant, with everything in between. No two autistics are the same.

The spectrum doesn't refer to all humans, it refers to all neurodivergent people. Yes, NT people can also experience lots of the listed autistic symptoms, but it doesn't automatically mean you're neurodivergent. For example, lots of people have anxiety, doesn't mean you're autistic. 85% of autistic people are said to suffer from social anxiety.

There is also a significant genetic link, with autism often running in families. Numerous studies, including twin studies and family studies, have estimated the heritability of autism to be around 80 to 90%, indicating that genetic factors play a substantial role. Heritability estimates do not imply that autism is solely determined by genetics, as environmental factors also contribute to the development of the disorder.

Oh and please don't assume if someone is sociable, makes friends, has children, has a romantic relationship that they can't be autistic. Masking in females is a huge thing and very very misunderstood!

Like some others up-thread, I also work in autism research and (a long time ago) was trained to do ADOS etc.

I think some people want there to be a clear cut, categorical distinction between 'autism' and 'not autism'. But the real world is messier than that. Diagnoses can be wrong, different specialists can disagree, people can grow and change so a child who would be diagnosed at one age might not be later.

And similarly, people who do not have a formal diagnosis of autism can show some features or traits that are similar to autism. Look up the dozens of research papers on 'broader autism phenotype' or 'autistic traits' on google Scholar etc.

Maybe one day there will be a clear way to diagnose and understand autism, but at the moment, things are still messy.

Autism clinic said on the spectrum means you have diagnosed autism. Neurotypical people are not anywhere on the spectrum.

This is a really interesting thread to me because I've often thought I have very, very mild versions of some autism traits.

I'm extremely sensitive to sound (but I don't avoid going to loud places, and certain sounds are far more triggering to me than others, e.g. bagpipes). But, I don't wear headphones or earplugs or anything.

I like logic and structure and I don't always get people's jokes because my first instinct is to take them literally.

While I like order and dislike mess, and find it difficult to concentrate if my surroundings aren't in order, I'm not hyper obsessive about it (I have a friend whose shoes always have to go in their exact shoebox, in a certain order of boxes, when he takes them off).

I understand people's emotions in general (unless they're massively going out of their way to fake or hide them), people think of me as "normally" sociable.

Once I'm doing something I get very angry and frustrated if someone distracts me or tries to pull me away from doing it.

I prefer certain feels of fabrics over others and won't wear certain ones, but I don't have to buy exact specific things. I also don't get mad if the packaging changes or recipe changes for a product, or it's discontinued. Again, thinking about my friend who had to have the same thing for his work lunch every day, and a particular type of bread and a particular type of ham so he had exactly enough slices of each for a consistent 5 day week. He wouldn't buy ham if there were "too many" slices, whereas I'd just leave a slice, have an extra slice, or offer someone the slice.

I guess this is why it's considered a spectrum.

If you finish things you start you likely don't have ADHD. You can be very motivated to start things or be obsessed with them for a while, but if you're ADHD you likely don't really finish them. Also, you probably don't care your house is a mess.

If you're always focused on/obsessed about the same things and finish them or stick with them to the logical conclusion, or finish and repeat at some point, you're probably more autism leaning.

A spiky profile is a common term of term used when identifying Dyslexia and other Neurdiversities.

Hi OP,

I work in an assessment team for both ASD and ADHD. I often see youngsters who don’t quite meet the threshold for diagnosis. This may be because the specific things we are looking at are not pervasive or having a massive impact on life and functioning (so wouldn’t meet threshold in that way) or alternatively there may be marked differences in some areas (like a sensory profile) but no evidence of anything falling outside of what we might expect to see in other areas which would then mean the young person wouldn’t fall in line with the threshold as we need to see a specific pattern differences across a number of different areas.

My understanding around the move towards a spectrum is that every human is on a spectrum and falls somewhere, but this would only meet a diagnostic threshold if the differences were marked, formed a pattern across a few key areas and had a substantial impact on the person. So theoretically, yes, it’s my view that everyone should display ‘traits’ in one way or another. However, I’m not sure I would describe those as ASD traits, just general differences between people.

People have quite different views on the use of labels, for some ‘neurotypical’ people describing themselves as having ASD traits might be considered offensive or minimising to the autistic community. Similarly, for some people separating their child outside of the realm of ‘normal’ and labelling them as having ASD can be extremely stigmatising and an unhelpful narrative. We usually think carefullly with families about this before and after any assessment.

I dont really think autism is a collection of traits anyway.

I think if someone has an area of difficulty but hasnt met the threshold for autism it's more useful for them to say what their difficulty is than say I have some autistic traits.

So they could say I struggle with social communication so need you to be direct.

I have sensory processing issues so will need a quieter environment to meet up.

I get anxious about change can you talk me through it.

We shouldn't have a limit on compassion or little adjustments.

"Policing other people's language" if so many people now didn't try and use langauge that doesn't actually apply to them, there would be no need for policing it. So many people WANT to be seen as different, its becoming truly pathetic and is mocking those with the real conditions you seem to want to have!

Then I would flag them up for an assessment just in case.

Some of them pretend to be ‘higher functioning’ than they are because they don’t want to be seen as different, so they’ll say what they think is the right answer.

And some will think they have traits that they don’t - do you find social situations difficult or struggle to make eye contact - we all do sometimes but we don’t think about it but when asked this question many people will say yes.

So the questionnaire is always used as just a guide to try and get help to those that need it but we try and use our own judgement too.

as an autistic adult I 100% agree with this. if I get out of breath while running it isn’t an “asthmatic trait.” if you aren’t autistic, they aren’t autistic traits, they’re just traits

I'm NT and my DS has low functioning autism (he's an adult now). He needs support 24/7 and 2:1 care in the community.

I've often wondered about myself due to his diagnosis.

I've been a hair twiddler since a young child (pull it out, rub it together in palm of my hands and then open hair out and pull through teeth). I do it mostly in times of stress but when I'm calm too. Is it a stim, who knows?

I have anxiety (on meds for 20 plus years). As I've got older I have more social anxiety too but not sure it could be perimenopause related.

I'm a linguist and musician- I like rules, structure.

I don't deal with surprises or changes brilliantly.

That's really interesting. I have a late bloomer too. I am trying to progress an assessment because other parents with high functioning children with autism have said it really helps them understand why they are the way they are and it has helped with extra support such as time in exams at university. I think he will be perfectly able to live away from home, get a job, etc. If it wasn't for the feedback from other parents I probably wouldn't be trying to get an assessment.

I remember posting on here about after an assessment by an educational psychologist as we were leaving I asked " So definitely not autistic then?" and she answered "well if he is he is so high functioning it doesn't matter". ANd I was told I was lying or the woman was an idiot. But it was the truth. He had so many "autistic traits " as a child. Didn't talk till he was 4yo. Extremely limited diet. Couldn't follow a point etc etc. His assessment was done when he was 7yo. He is still a tad quirky ( mostly shown by his sense of humour) , but excelling at school, very empathetic and has a lot of friends. I'm not an expert but it seems to me that lumping all autism into a "spectrum" has not really done anyone any favours. If I'd taken him for assessment at 3yo he would have been diagnosed as autistic I'm pretty sure. Thus taking funding and help from a child who really needed it. He was just a classic late-bloomer. People seem to have forgotten they exist. They do. I have one right here. Edited for spelling

I think you're confusing having a trait at any level to mean if that trait exists within the nd spectrum then it means prehaps everyone with the trait is on the spectrum. but you have many similar symptoms or traits in any illnesses thay occur that also occur in health ppl and there is no medical illness and nor would you be considered on the spectrum of that illness. For example you can have anti bodies that relate to a specific auto immune illness but you do not have that illness and you are not on the spectrum for it either. You can have similar traits in anything but if it doesn't effect your brain function then it does not put you on the spectrum and it's dangerous to even suggest this. Ppl have gone pass the point of raising awareness which is so important to the other end of mis information.

But what if the traits are really pronounced, but there aren’t enough?